social aspects of race

AKA the only aspects that matter

And he's saying what I am. Correlation of violence to blacks in America is skewed in a way that negatively reflects on the individual because of their skin instead of their culture. This leads to the assumption that someone from Compton will act the same as someone from Johanessburg.

i mean, i feel like i know what you're gonna say, but keep in mind what you just said here

"negatively reflects on the individual because of their skin
not their culture"

in other words, race > ethnicity
you'd think if people accepted that race is a social construct, that kind of shit wouldn't happen, would it

that's precisely my argument

One could argue that they're both illusory and imagined. But racial categories have had a much more concrete impact on peoples' lives, because they've been used to discriminate and to distribute resources unequally and set up different standards for protection under law.

but that still means that they're "illusory and imagined"--it doesn't matter that, historically, we've treated them as if they're real

because they're not
they're not real because we've thought so in the past--that's just silly

Here's a PBS article with experts in the field explaining the differences.

First of all, race is primarily unitary. You can only have one race, while you can claim multiple ethnic affiliations. You can identify ethnically as Irish and Polish, but you have to be essentially either black or white.

so what is this guy saying

you can't be half-black, or mixed race?
does he know a guy called barack obama?

the rest of what he said seemed sound, but he prefaced it with a bunch of bullshit

let's try the next guy

I think the most powerful argument about the differentiation between race and ethnicity is that race becomes institutionalized in a way that has profound social consequences on the members of different groups.

well, there you go

this guy pretty much made my argument for me

and the next guy agrees with him, too

That was ethnicity I was just describing, Verb.

Race = Genetics
Ethnicity = Genetics + Culture

Ethnicity is impacted by social expectations/perceptions. Race isn't.

says who, exactly?

i would argue, as i stated earlier, that race includes culture as well
like... why can't it

Quote from: Saerveyn on April 27, 2015, 09:23:39 PM

People seem to be assuming that just because a race has a larger probability of receiving some disease, that it is due to some level of "racial traits"rather than simply being...you know, a correlation.

Take sickle cell anemia for example. To say it's just a "black person disease" is wrong, because we know that race isn't specifically tied to skin color; a biracial person that physically appears to be one or the other (I.E., Barack Obama appears to be black despite being biracial) could very well be susceptible to certain medical or genetic conditions because of their genotype. Sickle cell anemia in Africans evolved as a way to combat Malaria, which is why black people are more prone to having it. So no, it's not at all just a mere correlation, it's an actual trait of the race, and it's relevant outside of the limited scope of society.

i just said thaaaaaaaat

not to mention, "black people are more likely to commit a crime"

yeah, maybe statistically
but not genetically

as cindy said, correlation =/= causation
that's all we're saying

If you're arguing that it stems from ancestors... you aren't really refuting anything here. All I said is that races aren't a social construct because it's defined by hereditary commonality.

well, it obviously stems from ancestors--that's the whole idea behind genetics and hereditary traits like sickle cell and such

you brought up the sickle cell thing and implied that it had anything to do with race, so i tackled that

As long as we can acknowledge that ethnicity is not.

i don't even know the difference, to be honest

isn't "ethnicity" notorious for being one of the most ill-defined concepts ever

I'm not sure what argument you seem to think I'm positing here, but whatever it is, it isn't the case.

Should we treat all ethnicities the same if we do end up discovering different genetic variations in race? Yes, of course. But is it "racist" to scientifically inquire the human genome? No, and that's a laughable notion at best.

That's not my argument either. The idea is that, historically, we've made a mountain out of this race thing, and even today, we're still struggling with the notion that race doesn't really matter. If there's anything in our DNA to suggest anything about race, we can certainly embrace it, but the point is that if it takes us this long to find an inkling of a difference, it's probably not that significant. And it certainly doesn't change the fact that race is a social construct, because like I said, you're not gonna be able to find anything in our DNA that says "black people can't swim" or something stupid like that--but it won't stop people from making jokes about black people not being able to swim. Because it's a social construct. That's the idea. That's the theory.

New evidence is emerging to suggest there is in fact a biological basis for race though. We've only just started mapping the human genome which takes an astronomical amount of computational power to process, so to affirm the notion that race is purely a social construct when we've barely even begun to understand genetics is simply fallacious and unscientific.

It goes without saying that racism and discrimination are wrong as a matter of principle of course, but that doesn't mean we should disregard empirical evidence for the sake of political correctness.

It should also go without saying that there's not going to be anything within our genome that could possibly justify the centuries of attrition levied towards racial minorities, let alone social segregation or other minor forms of racial discrimination. Which is essentially what the "social construct" theory is predicated upon.

If it takes us this long to find anything within our DNA to suggest anything about race, it's likely negligible, and we've made the tallest mountain out of the smallest molehill with it.

I think it's a bit of a given that you can't even mention Dark Souls without Verb feeling the need to complain as if we don't already know he dislikes it

or, if someone literally brings the subject back up onto my plate, i feel almost obligated to respond back

indeed, by posting this snarky comment, you notified me, prompting me to respond again, smart one

Race is an indicator of certain physical, heredity traits, no?

it actually isn't
like, at all

(i actually just learned about this in my sociology class)

>we didn't know exactly what we were doing

You don't FUCKING say

not strong enough