That's still censorship my dude

I explained precisely why it isn't, but you're a fucking idiot so I'm not surprised you don't get it.

>Child molestation mini-game

Lmao

the japanese version of fates allows you to literally rape children incestuously in a basement

https://gamerant.com/kingdom-hearts-3-winnie-the-pooh-censored/

Reports out of China have confirmed that in the Chinese version of Kingdom Hearts 3, Winnie the Pooh will be censored. Rather than removing the bear from the game altogether, the game has instead been edited slightly to blur his appearance. According to screenshots of the censored version, Winnie the Pooh just has a bright, white blot over his body. Strangely, the blot doesn’t cover all of Winnie the Pooh as his feet are still visible, something which has been the subject of many jokes on social media.

Given that Winnie the Pooh seems harmless, many fans in the west are totally baffled over this censorship. However, the Chinese government has ordered this censorship due to its fear it will cause instability within the country. Back in August, China banned any depictions of the character after some compared Winnie the Pooh’s appearance to that of Chinese president Xi Jinping. One of the memes compared a 2013 photo of Winnie and Tigger to a photo of Xi Jinping and Barack Obama walking together.

in case anyone still thinks a localization team removing child molestation minigames from a nintendo title for the sake of being sensitive towards cultural differences is at all comparable

Quote from: Verbatim on November 22, 2018, 10:18:45 PM

Quote from: challengerX on November 22, 2018, 10:16:27 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on November 22, 2018, 09:58:39 PM

Quote from: challengerX on November 22, 2018, 09:55:45 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on November 22, 2018, 09:49:25 PM

Quote from: challengerX on November 22, 2018, 05:59:25 PM

All this coming from the guy who said he lived in the Atlantic Ocean because he flew over it in a plane.

never said lived "in"

lived over, for sure

>admitting you fundamentally disagree with the entire essay you just wrote
OH NO NO NO

i didn't do anything like that

You’re telling him he needs to actually spend time and interact with the game to experience it. Yet you claim you lived in countries you’ve only actually visited.

living in something has nothing to do with experiencing it

it just requires you to be alive within the borders for at least one planck unit's worth of time

Except if you were to say to someone, nobody would understand it that way. To say “oh yeah I lived in Italy” because you were there on vacation for a week is a lie and really awkward.

not my problem

Quote from: Verbatim on November 22, 2018, 09:58:39 PM

Quote from: challengerX on November 22, 2018, 09:55:45 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on November 22, 2018, 09:49:25 PM

Quote from: challengerX on November 22, 2018, 05:59:25 PM

All this coming from the guy who said he lived in the Atlantic Ocean because he flew over it in a plane.

never said lived "in"

lived over, for sure

>admitting you fundamentally disagree with the entire essay you just wrote
OH NO NO NO

i didn't do anything like that

You’re telling him he needs to actually spend time and interact with the game to experience it. Yet you claim you lived in countries you’ve only actually visited.

living in something has nothing to do with experiencing it

it just requires you to be alive within the borders for at least one planck unit's worth of time

she did get better, and we had a pleasant day

Quote from: Verbatim on November 21, 2018, 02:52:54 PM

Quote from: Eli on November 21, 2018, 02:51:12 PM

none of the games you are referring to require me to play them in order to experience their artistic value

that's super wrong in ways that i could write paragraphs about so i'll have to do that later

cool im looking forward to finding out how im wrong

it's pretty simple

there's a way to make what you're saying perfectly reasonable by changing just one word: "experience"

So, obviously, what separates video games from other art forms is that they are interactive. You can't watch a movie and influence anything that happens, or be a part of its story in any way. You can pretty much only do that with games, which is what makes them special. Your input as a player will produce an output that is individual to your own personal run of the game, and as a result, your experience is going to be virtually unique from anyone else's. Even if any two runs of a particular game wound up being identical, you can bet that the emotional reactions that the two players experienced will not be.

Art forms are defined not only by the physical elements of the medium itself (print, marble, oil on canvas), but by the nature or method through which all the intentions of the artist can be channeled, expressed, and the art consumed. You view a painting. You watch a movie. You read a book. You listen to music. You play a game. These are the ways in which these individual art forms must be experienced.

I can describe a painting to you in exquisite detail. I can describe every feature of the Mona Lisa vividly. Every color, every element, I can use words to describe it. I might even be able to relay to you what the painting does for me emotionally, having seen the real thing myself when I visited the Louvre almost five years ago. Keywords being "for me," however, because no matter how well I'm able to use the medium of language to describe this painting, you will never be able to say that you've "experienced" the Mona Lisa if you haven't seen it for yourself. Painting is a visual medium that requires you to see it in order to experience it.

Likewise, I could do the same for a movie. I could throw together a 10 minute review of the first Godfather film where I succinctly describe everything that makes the film work and why it's one of the best and most important movies of all time. It could be the best review ever, but unless you've actually seen the movie yourself, you cannot say that you've "experienced" The Godfather, because The Godfather is a movie, and you watch movies. That is how you experience film. That is the purpose of the art form.

I could try to paint something intended to be a visual representation of The Downward Spiral by Nine Inch Nails. This painting exhibits all of the attributes of the album, and you could say it's the perfect visual equivalent of the record. But no matter what, you cannot see this painting and say that you've experienced The Downward Spiral. It's an album that you listen to.

To argue that you don't need to play a game in order to EXPERIENCE the game is the same thing as saying you can listen to a painting or read an album.

By watching a Let's Play, for example, you are not experiencing the game, because you're not the one playing; you are only experiencing another person's experience of the game. It's a filtered and limited experience, similar to a movie review. Therefore, you're not having your own.

A better word to ameliorate your statement, I think, would be "appreciate."

none of the games you are referring to require me to play them in order to appreciate their artistic value

I can certainly listen to an in-depth movie review, without having seen the movie being discussed, and appreciate all the things that are being discussed. I can go online and have someone explain to me the meaning behind a Pollock, and I can appreciate his work, even if I've never seen a Pollock in person.

If you haven't played a game, but you've seen, heard, or read all about it, all you can do is appreciate it. You have not experienced it.

When it comes to must-play games, not only is it not a phrase meant to be taken literally (because you could extrapolate it to, "there's nothing that we 'must' do, which is just obnoxious nihilism for the sake of itself"), it's a phrase that simply means, "if you care about the art form at all, it would not make sense for you to avoid this game." We all want to have positive experiences on this shit planet. When people describe things as "musts," it is simply a good-faith attempt by the collective to offer the most positive experiences to those who are interested in having those (and why would you not).

Even then, I would argue that certain things must be experienced regardless of whether you'll wind up enjoying it or not. I would recommend people things that they'd utterly hate, in fact, if the thing in question was important enough. Because at that point, it's no longer important. It doesn't matter if you don't like gangster movies. You MUST watch The Godfather anyway, even if you hate it, because it's just that good, regardless of what anybody thinks (including myself).

Regarding the specific examples I gave, Super Metroid is a game that is renowned for its capacity to teach players how to perform obscure mechanics without outright telling them.

If you haven't played Super Metroid yet, I'm about to ruin a couple things about it for the sake of making my point.

There's a couple segments throughout the game where you'll fall into a pit, accompanied only by a strange animal, such as an alien ostrich-looking thing or a group of alien monkey-like things. The player may not have any idea how to get out of the pit, but if he pays attention to what the animals are doing to get themselves out, he'll eventually decide to mimic their actions. The monkeys use a wall jump technique to get themselves out, so the player might feel inclined to try this for themselves. It's intentionally awkward to perform so as to be not too obvious, and though it may take practice, the player will eventually learn how to do it and be able to get themselves out. Or, they could utilize alternative methods such as bomb jumping, but that also requires some ingenuity on part of the player.

In any case, the game doesn't teach you through words, only visuals. You have to use your own brain to figure out the solution. When you do, the moment of epiphany is swiftly followed by an intense rush of catharsis that can ONLY be felt and understood if you're playing the game yourself, and not having watched someone else figure it out "for" you.

Beating an extremely tough boss will produce similar emotions. Watching a friend beat a tough boss might be a lot of fun, but nothing compares to the feeling you get when you do it yourself.

If that's something you can't relate to, then I don't know what to say other than that I don't find your way of thinking reasonable. I still haven't played Symphony of the Night, for example, so even though I'm able to appreciate that it's a cool game, to say that I've experienced it just by watching playthroughs of it would be like watching Harry Potter and knowing what it's like to be a wizard or something. When no.

Therefore, there are certainly games out there that you "must" play if you're interested in the art form. Super Mario Bros. may not be a terribly difficult game to grasp, even if you've never played it before, but you play it not because it's fun, but because it's important. It's important to understand and respect the groundwork upon which the entire industry as we know it was built. You can love or hate the game itself all you want, that part is irrelevant.

Furthermore, having a "taste" is inherently closed-minded, and people should work towards not having one. Why would anybody want to put themselves in a box where they automatically never give certain things a try based solely off of preconceived bigotries and fragile sensibilities? It's just another one of those weird spook-like institutions that only makes less and less sense the more I think about it.

Like, I realize that in some way, our prejudices (which is what our "tastes" could honestly be described as) are ingrained within us and can't easily be changed, but that doesn't meant tey should be worn as badges, or things that are worth protecting.

none of the games you are referring to require me to play them in order to experience their artistic value

that's super wrong in ways that i could write paragraphs about so i'll have to do that later

in short, if you're implying that watching a let's play is a sufficient enough facsimile of a game experience, i find that notion patently false

Super Metroid
The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker
Super Mario World

>approaching his late 20s
>hates his job
>got a 4-year degree and moved to the other side of the country to get it; hates it there
>has no friends outside of the internet, can't make any more due to anxiety
>makes more money than he needs for his lifestyle
>lives with his shitty conservative family who drives him up the wall every day
>nowhere else to go
>is overall unhappy
>wants to quit and move back to his home where he has friends
>plans on doing this
>decides to stick it out for another 4 months so he can put 2 full years of experience on his resume
>3 months later
>just suffered through the slowest performing month in his career
>suddenly receive a raise and a bonus for seemingly no reason
>literally can't quit now without it being a spit-in-the-face and instantaneously burning the only bridge he's ever built
>can't whine about this to anyone without seeming like an entitled brat
>seems like he's gonna be trapped in this boring friendless cesspit forever but he makes bank so he's not allowed to complain

what do i even say to this guy

This is incredibly sexist. Casual-masculinity is gateway behavior to more aggressive and toxic misogyny. We really shouldn’t encourage this.

this but unironically

Siouxsie and the Banshees - The Rapture
Alternative rock
11th and final LP

In my journey through the Banshees discography, I actually wound up finding myself a new favorite. Given that they've been making music since the late '70s and are largely considered a pioneer of post-punk and gothic rock, even influencing the likes of Joy Division and The Cure (Robert Smith even played guitar for them for a period of time), so I'm ashamed to have never discovered them sooner. Their 1981 album, Juju, is my current favorite for being so far ahead of its time. The guitar work on that record by then-guitarist John McGeoch is insanely good, and he was a very unique talent. I'd recommend that one to everybody whose into somewhat older transgressive rock music.

The Rapture, on the other hand, was the band's denouement. It's somewhat of a return to form, for in the years after McGeoch was fired from the band for being an alcoholic shithead, the Banshees experimented with a variety of styles—often to mixed results, though I wouldn't say they've ever made a bad album. The Rapture is no exception. It's a solid final effort that doesn't quite attain the heights achieved in their best years, but has enough good material on it to make you think, "Yeah, she's still got it." I'd personally stick with the old stuff, though.

7/10

---

Extreme - Waiting for the Punchline
Hard rock
4th LP

Extreme was one of those shitty hair metal acts that came onto the scene far too late into the game—you probably know the song "More Than Words," or perhaps the fun "Play with Me"—but since grunge was the new hotness, they did on this album what everyone rightfully maligns every other metal act for doing—the classic transparent sellout move of jumping on the bandwagon. It wouldn't be so bad if the music actually felt genuine or sounded like it came from the heart, but you can actually hear the lust for money in Gary Cherone's disgusting voice as he puts on his very best Chris Cornell or Scott Weiland impression for this hack of a record. It's embarrassing.

The first track alone was enough for me to determine officially that these guys fucking suck. It's a song called "There is No God," and in spite of the name, it's actually a satire and biting critique of atheist thought. There's nothing wrong with injecting your personal beliefs and convictions into your art, but reading into the lyrics on this one, it's really hard for me not to cringe at the sheer bitterness that this guy exudes at the mere suggestion that someone doesn't share the same beliefs as him. It's just a sour way to open an album, and only serves to alienate people who otherwise wouldn't give a fuck what you believe in. What is a song like this doing on an Extreme album, anyway? It's rather out of character for a band that used to make songs about youth and boyhood and shit.

If that song wasn't enough, though, look no further than the song "Naked," which is one of the most unbearable rock songs I've ever heard. It's supposed to be the kind of song you'd play for a sexual partner to, I don't know, "set the mood" or whatever. The lyrics are pretty hilarious.

So you want me to take it off
Just to see what's
Underneath my cloth
I'll show you I'm every
Inch a man
Measure all that you
Think you can

Naked, and I'm unashamed
Naked, with no one to blame
Naked, ya you want the truth
Naked, here's my birthday suit
Naked, naked, naked, naked

Call me a prude, but I can't think of a more unsexy way to describe a nude male body than the term "birthday suit." This cornball style of lyricism pervades the album and makes the experience all but unlistenable.

That being said, credit where it's due, Nuno Bettencourt is a great guitarist, and is the one saving grace of the record. "Midnight Express" showcases his talents pretty well, and he's the only thing stopping me from slapping a 4/10 on this thing. Not that it matters.

5/10

---

Thunder - Behind Closed Doors
Hard rock
3rd LP

Generic and unspecial record by a generic and unspecial arena rock band. Unlike Extreme, however, they never jumped on any bandwagons and stuck to their roots despite the waning popularity of the genre, which I think is respectable, even if it only dug themselves further in the hole.

6/10

---

Swans - The Great Annihilator
Experimental post-punk
9th album

One of my top favorite bands of all time, they released, in my opinion, one of their better albums in 1995.

Swans is a very difficult band to get into—very experimental, very abrasive, with several of their albums (especially the first four) sounding like these horrible, emaciated, mutant-like creatures that emerged from a tar pit, screaming "KILL ME, KILL ME"—but if you find yourself enjoying industrial soundscapes, transgressive lyrical topics, or extreme forms of music in general, you'll probably find Swans very easy to get into.

In fact, I would say The Great Annihilator is one of the more accessible albums they've ever produced, with a lot of the aggressive drum beats sounding vaguely danceable and relatively conventional song structures. Michael Gira's vocals are splendid as always, and Jarboe (whose sultry voice has typically been relegated to the background on previous albums, or exclusively singing soft ballads) shows her true range on this record. Prime example: the song "Mother/Father," my personal favorite, is an aggressive jam featuring an intense, roaring vocal performance from Jarboe. It's startling, yet awesome.

You do have some experimental cuts on this record, though, too. There's some creative instrumentation featured on tracks like "Blood Promise," "Mind/Body/Light/Sound," and "Killing for Company," which is always great for people who are perhaps tired of hearing the same old instruments being played, or being played in the same way, as a more conventional rock band, but not necessarily so out there that it's alienating.

That said, this is very much a "bad mood" kind of album. It's not something I'd play if I'm having a really good day, or something. It's a Swans album, so it's going to be rather unfriendly and uncompromising. As long as you listen to it with that in mind, then I think I've adequately prepared you. It's currently my favorite album that I've reviewed in this thread so far.

8/10

---

Dead Voices on Air - Hafted Maul
Experimental
Debut LP

Dead Voices on Air is Mark Spyby, who used to play for Zoviet France.

Speaking of unfriendly, this would be a great example of an album that I personally enjoy to an extent, but would have a very difficult time recommending to virtually anybody. For one thing, I don't even like it that much myself. There's some good stuff, but it's not all great. For another, it's a series of relatively harsh industrial instrumentals featuring highly experimental production, but no sense of cohesion, purpose, or direction. It just sounds like a hobbyist making disgruntled-ass music for no rhyme or reason. Interesting, but not mind-blowing.

7/10

---

RANKING (so far)

#1. The Great Annihilator by Swans
#2. Do You Want More?!!!??! by The Roots
#3. Dah Shinin' by Smif-N-Wessun
#4. The Rapture by Siouxsie and the Banshees
#5. Hafted Maul by Dead Voices on Air
#6. Daredevil by Fu Manchu
#7. University by Throwing Muses
#8. Amok by Sentenced
#9. Behind Closed Doors by Thunder
#10. From the Bottom Up by Brownstone

Next I'll be trying some Laughing Hyenas, The Human League, Van Halen, and Too Short.

6th. So, considering Verb won't change it for the remainder of the time left for him here, which means won't change ever, maybe we should pick something that suits his character the best, so people reading his posts could imagine him better.

Also the person who makes 6th post desides not to pick Verb's avatar automatically by this thread rules.

this is post #5; the OP is post #0

anyway, chronic got it

Is the OP the first post or does it not count?

that's you

in fact, only posts by unique users will count

so this one doesn't count

i'll probably never stop, but i'm trying to say fuck a little less often

but only because i actually want it to mean something when i do

shit too, but it would help if it wasn't so damn versatile