Justifying Riots

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His eyebrows sparkling, his white beard hangs down to his chest. The thatched mats, spread outside his chise, spread softly, his splendid attos. He polishes, cross-legged, his makiri, with his eyes completely absorbed.

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The god of Ainu Mosir, Ae-Oine Kamuy, descendant of Okiku-Rumi, He perishes, a living corpse. The summers day, the white sunlight, unabrushed, ends simply through his breath alone.
The issue is further complicated by the fact that everyone is the States is packing heat, (so cops are on edge at all times anyway) and now they are on extra-edge because several states have gone full revolution-mode.
So protestors are going to be seen as targets by the police, regardless of their actual threat. Why are they in charge of maintaining the peace again? And given guns?
Not defending the pig's behaviour but Nick does have a point about the prevalence of guns and gun culture in the states. Given how liberal it is for basically anyone and everyone to carry a firearm it would be really silly for the police not to come armed for the potentiality of self preservation.
I'm not disagreeing with his point, I'm just piggybacking off of it to make another point. I might be coming off a bit harsher than I mean to in general here, and that's my bad. Police need de-escalation training, not guns. Bringing more vectors of violence into an already tense situation doesn't neutralize the problem, it fuels it.
Last Edit: June 01, 2020, 10:29:41 AM by 🍁 Aria 🔮


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I came here from b.net after a few Floods invited me. None of them post on either b.net nor here anymore, which is sad. I was still active on b.net until for some bizarre reason, b.net admins locked out people who have not played Destiny. Even if you wanted to post on the offtopic section. After that, I fully moved here and have not returned to b.net since.
Please come play Halo with me.
The issue is further complicated by the fact that everyone is the States is packing heat, (so cops are on edge at all times anyway) and now they are on extra-edge because several states have gone full revolution-mode.
So protestors are going to be seen as targets by the police, regardless of their actual threat. Why are they in charge of maintaining the peace again? And given guns?
Not defending the pig's behaviour but Nick does have a point about the prevalence of guns and gun culture in the states. Given how liberal it is for basically anyone and everyone to carry a firearm it would be really silly for the police not to come armed for the potentiality of self preservation.
I'm not disagreeing with his point, I'm just piggybacking off of it to make another point. I might be coming off a bit harsher than I mean to in general here, and that's my bad. Police need de-escalation training, not guns. Bringing more vectors of violence into an already tense situation doesn't neutralize the problem, it fuels it.
How do you de-escalate a rioting crowd? I think that is the key question here. I doubt there is a right answer.

What will end the riots in the US now? Do people even understand what they are rioting about? I think most were just frustrated by all the other things going on at the moment and this riot just happened at the right time.


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A good number of posts on social media still link it to a BLM movement for Goerge Floyd's death, but it appears to have been co-opted by Antifa which is only going to sully the original idea and render it invalid. Regardless, several posts on Twitter last night called for it to move to suburban neighborhoods, that would be an absolutely garbage idea if their intent is to hurt the idea of authoritative power, attacking innocent civilians trying to keep themselves safe at home is a complete contradiction to that.

How do you de-escalate a rioting crowd? I think that is the key question here. I doubt there is a right answer.

What will end the riots in the US now? Do people even understand what they are rioting about? I think most were just frustrated by all the other things going on at the moment and this riot just happened at the right time.


 
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We knew the world would not be the same.
A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent.
I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita.
Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty
and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says,
"Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.."
I suppose we all thought that one way or another.
Ian you really have no idea what the fuck you're talking about.


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Ian you really have no idea what the fuck you're talking about.
https://twitter.com/AkaashSingh/status/1266294593697353733

>Honestly if you can, burn down white neighborhoods so companies are afraid to move back there. Then after the property value lowers enough, buy the neighborhood mad cheap and rebuild it. This is a real opportunity to flip the gentrification cycle.

Excuse me while I find one more so I can fit the definition of "a few"**; unless you're saying this movement isn't about BLM/George Floyd's death at all, which it is; or that Antifa isn't involved, which they are (along with other radical groups).

**Edit: There was another Tweet that was trending last night, but the account was removed for violating Twitter's rules.
Last Edit: June 01, 2020, 12:05:32 PM by Ian


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Hard power gets met with hard power. Let's not forget that the catalyst to these riots and protests is because a state funded fascist essentially curbstomped a guy who pleaded for his life for 9 minutes over a fucking counterfeit 20 dollar bill, allegedly. This is also just one of the multitude of incidences of police brutality that haven't even been documented.

And people wonder why a violent response ensued.

If your biggest concern right now is civil unrest and property damage as a response to state officiated murder then there's not much else to tell you other than that your priorities and moral compass have exited the Earth's atmosphere.
Last Edit: June 01, 2020, 12:42:47 PM by Mordo


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Long live NoNolesNeckin.

Ya fuckin' ganderneck.
If your biggest concern right now is civil unrest and property damage as a response to state officiated murder then there's not much else to tell you other than that your priorities and moral compass have exited the Earth's atmosphere.
Innocent people are being beaten, shot at, and having their businesses destroyed. You don't believe all of that is somehow necessary do you?


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If your biggest concern right now is civil unrest and property damage as a response to state officiated murder then there's not much else to tell you other than that your priorities and moral compass have exited the Earth's atmosphere.
Innocent people are being beaten, shot at, and having their businesses destroyed. You don't believe all of that is somehow necessary do you?
Me? I don't. The system has somehow made it necessary.

How many times have we been down this road with peaceful protest where nothing changes? Believe me, I'd really like to live in a world where we can kumbaya the problems away by singing John Lennons Imagine but it's a far cry from reality.


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His eyebrows sparkling, his white beard hangs down to his chest. The thatched mats, spread outside his chise, spread softly, his splendid attos. He polishes, cross-legged, his makiri, with his eyes completely absorbed.

He is Ainu.

The god of Ainu Mosir, Ae-Oine Kamuy, descendant of Okiku-Rumi, He perishes, a living corpse. The summers day, the white sunlight, unabrushed, ends simply through his breath alone.
How do you de-escalate a rioting crowd? I think that is the key question here. I doubt there is a right answer.

What will end the riots in the US now? Do people even understand what they are rioting about? I think most were just frustrated by all the other things going on at the moment and this riot just happened at the right time.
If it has reached the point of a riot then there WASN'T  a focus on de-escalation. We have some pretty good scenes of police dropping their gear and joining the crowd. In ATL on Day 1, before they started rolling in military vehicles and shooting teargas, Chief Shields sat with the crowd and engaged with the crowd. Nobody tried to touch her because there was no reason to. When you listen to protestors, you don't get rioters. When you pre-emptively bring in riot shields, you're creating a barrier and not empathy. As well, clearly if the cities are burning while armed police are present their presence isn't stopping anything. If it doesn't deter crime, what purpose does it serve but to show power?

Also class issues highlighted by the pandemic are pretty obviously tied to but not ultimately the reason for the protests and riots. There's also 40% low-income unemployment, meaning working class people in this country no longer have loss of healthcare access or income to dissuade them from speaking up and sharing the cause.


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Long live NoNolesNeckin.

Ya fuckin' ganderneck.
If your biggest concern right now is civil unrest and property damage as a response to state officiated murder then there's not much else to tell you other than that your priorities and moral compass have exited the Earth's atmosphere.
Innocent people are being beaten, shot at, and having their businesses destroyed. You don't believe all of that is somehow necessary do you?
Me? I don't. The system has somehow made it necessary.

How many times have we been down this road with peaceful protest where nothing changes? Believe me, I'd really like to live in a world where we can kumbaya the problems away by singing John Lennons Imagine but it's a far cry from reality.
Sorry, I don't think hurting innocent people is necessary to fight oppression. I think that's a very dangerous belief seriously lacking in empathy.

There's a reason MLK said that, "darkness cannot drive out darkness, only the light can do that." His movement didn't go around singing kumbaya, but they didn't go around hurting people for no reason either, and yet they somehow managed to get the civil rights act enacted and abolish segregation and Jim Crow laws.


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If your biggest concern right now is civil unrest and property damage as a response to state officiated murder then there's not much else to tell you other than that your priorities and moral compass have exited the Earth's atmosphere.
Innocent people are being beaten, shot at, and having their businesses destroyed. You don't believe all of that is somehow necessary do you?
Me? I don't. The system has somehow made it necessary.

How many times have we been down this road with peaceful protest where nothing changes? Believe me, I'd really like to live in a world where we can kumbaya the problems away by singing John Lennons Imagine but it's a far cry from reality.
Sorry, I don't think hurting innocent people is necessary to fight oppression. I think that's a very dangerous belief seriously lacking in empathy.

There's a reason MLK said that, "darkness cannot drive out darkness, only the light can do that." His movement didn't go around singing kumbaya, but they didn't go around hurting people for no reason either, and yet they somehow managed to get the civil rights act enacted and abolish segregation and Jim Crow laws.
And yet racial inequality and systematic discrimination is still a pervasive and ingrained problem that hasn't dissappeared.

No one here is positing the notion that innocent lives need to be ruined to see any significant change, at least not seriously. But this instant jump to riots and looting being the main focus of concern, when it's actually a symptom of the rotten system, is a serious misalignment of where the priorities should be.


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A good number of posts on social media still link it to a BLM movement for Goerge Floyd's death, but it appears to have been co-opted by Antifa which is only going to sully the original idea and render it invalid. Regardless, several posts on Twitter last night called for it to move to suburban neighborhoods, that would be an absolutely garbage idea if their intent is to hurt the idea of authoritative power, attacking innocent civilians trying to keep themselves safe at home is a complete contradiction to that.

How do you de-escalate a rioting crowd? I think that is the key question here. I doubt there is a right answer.

What will end the riots in the US now? Do people even understand what they are rioting about? I think most were just frustrated by all the other things going on at the moment and this riot just happened at the right time.
it can't be co-opted by antifa because antifa is not an actual singular organization


 
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There's a reason MLK said that, "darkness cannot drive out darkness, only the light can do that." His movement didn't go around singing kumbaya, but they didn't go around hurting people for no reason either, and yet they somehow managed to get the civil rights act enacted and abolish segregation and Jim Crow laws.
don't forget stopped racism!

oh wait he didn't do that because peaceful protests have demonstrably done fuck all to stop racism, fucking whoops


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There is a lot of division right now among the protests that are def being exacerbated by the media idea of "outside agitators". This started with a Target getting fucked up and now I've seen a video of people defending another target from being harmed. police don't need to see looting to get violent anyway, as been demonstrated by plenty examples now of them getting aggressive first towards peaceful protestors


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His eyebrows sparkling, his white beard hangs down to his chest. The thatched mats, spread outside his chise, spread softly, his splendid attos. He polishes, cross-legged, his makiri, with his eyes completely absorbed.

He is Ainu.

The god of Ainu Mosir, Ae-Oine Kamuy, descendant of Okiku-Rumi, He perishes, a living corpse. The summers day, the white sunlight, unabrushed, ends simply through his breath alone.
There's a reason MLK said that, "darkness cannot drive out darkness, only the light can do that." His movement didn't go around singing kumbaya, but they didn't go around hurting people for no reason either, and yet they somehow managed to get the civil rights act enacted and abolish segregation and Jim Crow laws.
don't forget stopped racism!

oh wait he didn't do that because peaceful protests have demonstrably done fuck all to stop racism, fucking whoops
Also MLK was assassinated just like Malcolm. I can understand the moral superiority of non-violence but let's not pretend it will protect protestors.


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Hey.
I came here from b.net after a few Floods invited me. None of them post on either b.net nor here anymore, which is sad. I was still active on b.net until for some bizarre reason, b.net admins locked out people who have not played Destiny. Even if you wanted to post on the offtopic section. After that, I fully moved here and have not returned to b.net since.
Please come play Halo with me.
aaaand with these last few posts I hope now you understand why cops bring riot shields and armored vehicles to large, riled-up protests.


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aaaand with these last few posts I hope now you understand why cops bring riot shields and armored vehicles to large, riled-up protests.
New Zealand, London and Berlin have all been subject to street wide "riled up" emotionally charged protests and been met with no civil disorder.

I wonder why that is. I wonder what the common denominator here could be.

Oink oink.


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Hey.
I came here from b.net after a few Floods invited me. None of them post on either b.net nor here anymore, which is sad. I was still active on b.net until for some bizarre reason, b.net admins locked out people who have not played Destiny. Even if you wanted to post on the offtopic section. After that, I fully moved here and have not returned to b.net since.
Please come play Halo with me.
aaaand with these last few posts I hope now you understand why cops bring riot shields and armored vehicles to large, riled-up protests.
New Zealand, London and Berlin have all been subject to street wide "riled up" emotionally charged protests and been met with no civil disorder.

I wonder why that is. I wonder what the common denominator here could be.

Oink oink.
So there were no riots in NZ, London or Berlin? Wort wort


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Hey.
I came here from b.net after a few Floods invited me. None of them post on either b.net nor here anymore, which is sad. I was still active on b.net until for some bizarre reason, b.net admins locked out people who have not played Destiny. Even if you wanted to post on the offtopic section. After that, I fully moved here and have not returned to b.net since.
Please come play Halo with me.
Like I said, they most likely have orders along the lines of - as soon as you see a large gathering, break it up by any less-lethal means necessary.

Take it up with leadership at state and maybe even Federal level. Trump hid in his bunker and tweeted something along the lines of "Just sort it out with force."

This sort of lack of organization at leadership level is obvious with the reports of how many reporters were arrested or harmed and how many innocent bystanders were injured or also arrested.
Another shitty chapter of the 2016 election result.


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Long live NoNolesNeckin.

Ya fuckin' ganderneck.
And yet racial inequality and systematic discrimination is still a pervasive and ingrained problem that hasn't dissappeared.

No one here is positing the notion that innocent lives need to be ruined to see any significant change, at least not seriously. But this instant jump to riots and looting being the main focus of concern, when it's actually a symptom of the rotten system, is a serious misalignment of where the priorities should be.
The point is not to encourage the violence by making it out to be a necessary evil to create change within a rotten system.

If you don't believe innocent lives need ruining, then I don't understand how you can say that "the system makes it necessary."
Last Edit: June 01, 2020, 02:02:36 PM by Aether


 
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We knew the world would not be the same.
A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent.
I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita.
Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty
and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says,
"Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.."
I suppose we all thought that one way or another.
Ian you really have no idea what the fuck you're talking about.
https://twitter.com/AkaashSingh/status/1266294593697353733

>Honestly if you can, burn down white neighborhoods so companies are afraid to move back there. Then after the property value lowers enough, buy the neighborhood mad cheap and rebuild it. This is a real opportunity to flip the gentrification cycle.

Excuse me while I find one more so I can fit the definition of "a few"**; unless you're saying this movement isn't about BLM/George Floyd's death at all, which it is; or that Antifa isn't involved, which they are (along with other radical groups).

**Edit: There was another Tweet that was trending last night, but the account was removed for violating Twitter's rules.
Implying it's a bad thing to kick out the corporations that have led us to the economic position we're in now in the first place. Why should I feel bad for predatory companies that value profit margins over human lives? Also BLM and ANTIFA aren't a monolith, there are no leaders. That's were the "CEO of ANTIFA" meme comes from, because it demonstrates a ridiculous and complete lack of understanding of how any of this shit actually functions.


 
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We knew the world would not be the same.
A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent.
I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita.
Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty
and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says,
"Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.."
I suppose we all thought that one way or another.
Spoiler


 
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We knew the world would not be the same.
A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent.
I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita.
Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty
and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says,
"Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.."
I suppose we all thought that one way or another.
Plus you know that's not going to be the case anyways, all the big mega-corps have insurance.


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Are we really trying to pretend that it's just corporations getting destroyed?


 
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We knew the world would not be the same.
A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent.
I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita.
Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty
and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says,
"Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.."
I suppose we all thought that one way or another.
Are we really trying to pretend that it's just corporations getting destroyed?
I know it's not (though it is mostly corporations being targeted)
I was a responding to this:
>Honestly if you can, burn down white neighborhoods so companies are afraid to move back there. Then after the property value lowers enough, buy the neighborhood mad cheap and rebuild it. This is a real opportunity to flip the gentrification cycle.


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Are we really trying to pretend that it's just corporations getting destroyed?
Black Lives Matter was never about individuals suffering, it was about rebelling against a system that sucks, so if people who own shops and shit get fucked that's just collateral. If rioting was about justice then yeah, it wouldn't make sense to destroy local shit, but it's not.


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EDIT: I will respond to the first point in another post now that I see where it coming from.

So any group of people can go in and cause chaos in these riots and wouldn't be manipulative because they didn't organize? I'm not saying that's incorrect, but that's awfully convenient considering how people are complaining on social media about such groups causing damage to the protests validity and that sources are saying BLM groups are organizing.

Quote
Also BLM and ANTIFA aren't a monolith, there are no leaders. That's were the "CEO of ANTIFA" meme comes from, because it demonstrates a ridiculous and complete lack of understanding of how any of this shit actually functions.
Last Edit: June 01, 2020, 03:23:54 PM by Ian


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If by the economic position we're in in the first place? Do you mean the massive unemployment caused by a pandemic? I don't really see how one can blame companies for what a virus did so maybe you mean something else?

Implying it's a bad thing to kick out the corporations that have led us to the economic position we're in now in the first place. Why should I feel bad for predatory companies that value profit margins over human lives?


 
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We knew the world would not be the same.
A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent.
I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita.
Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty
and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says,
"Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.."
I suppose we all thought that one way or another.
EDIT: I will respond to the first point in another post now that I see where it coming from.

Quote
Also BLM and ANTIFA aren't a monolith, there are no leaders. That's were the "CEO of ANTIFA" meme comes from, because it demonstrates a ridiculous and complete lack of understanding of how any of this shit actually functions.
So any group of people can go in and cause chaos in these riots and wouldn't be manipulative because they didn't organize? I'm not saying that's incorrect, but that's awfully convenient considering how people are complaining on social media about such groups causing damage to the protests validity and that sources are saying BLM groups are organizing.
You're missing the point. What Desty said is actually correct. But yes it is possible that they can be manipulated, and riots in general frequently are. Undercover cops are known to instigate riots in a protest so that they can take control of the situation. Also human lives have higher value than property, end story.


 
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We knew the world would not be the same.
A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent.
I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita.
Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty
and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says,
"Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.."
I suppose we all thought that one way or another.
If by the economic position we're in in the first place? Do you mean the massive unemployment caused by a pandemic? I don't really see how one can blame companies for what a virus did so maybe you mean something else?

Implying it's a bad thing to kick out the corporations that have led us to the economic position we're in now in the first place. Why should I feel bad for predatory companies that value profit margins over human lives?
No, corporations who care more about profit margins above all else. I'm talking about the penny pinching that squeezes every last dime out of both employees and customers so that execs can horde their wealth while the rest of the country continues to fall into disarray. I don't really think I need to spell it out for you further, you should know what I'm talking about.