Quote from: Meta Cognition on June 25, 2016, 02:00:18 PM

Quote from: Flee on June 25, 2016, 12:31:08 PM

Although, to be fair to you, I probably do find it easier to cosy up to less desirable types if I think the cause is worth it. If only because I'm cynical and pessimistic about the state of society as a whole.

Oh yeah, I fully understand that. I'll get back to the rest of your post in a bit.

I just want to say your post riled me a little bit, so I probably responded more 'forcefully' than I think I'd have liked. I know you weren't trying to fire me up, though.

Also worth noting Farage has literally been excluded from being a part of the negotiations.

Telegraph article highlighting the split in the Leave camp.

This combustible social squaring up is a token of the profound nature of the two camps’ mutual incomprehension. But through the bitter, patronising insults that have been hurled back and forth, above the reckless hurly-burly, one sentiment stands out: white working class voters feel that, just for once, they have not been silenced. Quite the reverse. And they have used their newfound power to give the establishment, out-of-touch metropolitan ruling class, a damn good kicking.

The only problem is that they are about to discover something that is galling in the extreme: the sneery Remain elite that they have so sensationally defenestrated will be quickly and seamlessly replaced by something startingly similar from their own side.

There have always been two Brexit camps. One is that angry white working class - the blue collar workers who feel marginalised by immigration, who want less of it; who are the losers from globalisation and want less of that too. They are the instinctive, pull-up-the-drawbridge protectionists, the bring-back-the-old-days types so heartily championed by Farage.

Then there is the other camp. These are the sovereignty-ists, the fed up with ever-closer-union types. The anti-federalists. This camp is not populated by the poor and unemployed. This is not Nigel’s peasant army. This is the tribe led by Michael Gove and Boris Johnson. The intelligentsia. Many are pretty well off, actually. They’ve done quite well out of open borders, thanks. And immigration? Well, it’s part of the package of a thriving, globalised, outward looking economy isn’t it?

So within about 20 minutes of Brexit being announced we saw Dan Hannan (Tribe 2) warning the great unwashed (Tribe 1) that they shouldn’t expect lower immigration anytime soon. When Boris came out to speak, he barely mentioned the issue that was the principal driver of his victory.

Your intentions may be good, but you inadvertently voted for anti-intellectualism.

I'm sorry but this is blithely incorrect.

Did I find myself on the side of those who have expressed overly populistic and anti-intellectual attitudes? Yes. Does populism and anti-intellectualism define the Leave campaign? No, and you do a disservice to those of us (including, funnily enough, intellectuals) who voted Leave for reasons other than blind ignorance. If we're going to judge the campaigns by their worst elements, I could have a lot to say about the way Remain ran their campaign.

Ironically, there has been (subtle) anti-intellectualism in the Remain campaign too. Using politicised Treasury reports based on obviously poor or false assumptions to press your political narrative is rather more sinister in its anti-intellectualism than a politician on the TV expressing the misguided ignorance the people feel. One is a manipulation of intellectualism to serve a goal, the other is tapping into an already-existing feeling. A feeling, I should add, that has come about precisely because people feel like they have been failed by the elite. And they have. Is anti-intellectualism justified? No. But the anti-intellectuals are not the only ones with things to apologise for.

I understand that you feel strongly about the European Union, and about how the Leave campaign has operated. So have I. I have said before, and I will say again, that the priority is to make sure the globalist Eurosceptics beat the nativist ones. And for all their political rhetoric and anti-intellectualism, Gove and Johnson are still among the globalists.

I did my research. I read as many reports on the economic impacts as I could, read a few books, read through neutral websites and I made a judgement call based on the evidence. To suggest that my vote is a vote for anti-intellectualism--however unintentionally--is to judge me guilty by association. Which, given that a whole country was basically split into halves, is not at all difficult to do.

Also, 36pc of people aged 18-24 actually turned out to vote.

Vote the least, bitch the loudest. That's our motto.

The post-Brexit political atmosphere is fucking depressing. I'm disgusted both by the pettiness, puerility, dishonesty and sanctimony from Remain, and I'm disgusted by the nativists in the Leave camp. Not only do the Remainers have a stick up their arse, but the more 'immigration-unfriendly' Brexiteers are probably going to find themselves sorely disappointed.

We're barely even out the gate, and everybody has suddenly become an expert on complex economic issues and everybody apparently has the fucking prescience to tell exactly how the negotiations are going to go.

I wish everybody would just shut the fuck up and focus on the questions that actually matter now, such as whether or not we want to adopt a Norwegian or Swiss arrangement, or something in between, or just an FTA. But no we're treated with OMG LITERALLY OVER HALF THE COUNTRY VOTED LEAVE BECAUSE THEY HATE DARK-SKINNED PEOPLE!!!111!!! and I VOTED LRAVE TO KICK ALL THE FUCKING IMMGRANTS OUT!!111!1 and the media isn't even fucking paying attention to anybody who voted Leave for reasons other than immigration, nor do they seem to be talking to anybody who has something interesting to say about what kind of arrangement we should be shooting for.

Fuck this country. It's full of sanctimonious, whining ass-holes who pretend to know more than they possibly can, and think more highly of themselves in one corner; immigrant-hating nativists who don't have the interest or the intelligence to look past their own bigotry in another; people who actually might be worth listening to who are ignored in the third; and lastly shitty journalists who don't even have the decency or intellectual integrity to do basic fact-checking.

We are going to crash and burn. Not because we've left, but because we're too dumb to shut up and get on with what's necessary. And the worst part is we probably deserve it.

if you OD and die, make sure to have someone else post it

that'll make a good anti-drug advert

A worthy sacrifice.

Hopefully all three of them merge together into some amorphous blob of floppy blonde hair and they finally bring about the supremacy of white Christendom.

He shall bear the name. . . Geerisump.

Oh wow, Wilders is top of the polls for the Dutch.

I know you don't like populism Flee, but this sort of shit is what happens when the European establishment basically becomes non-responsive to the concerns of those towards the bottom of society.

Quote from: ⚡ Thunder on June 24, 2016, 01:25:12 PM

Dutch calling for an EU referendum.

Dexit soon

Are they really or is it just Wilders again?

BASED GEERT
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Psy, u know any dealers local?

what are the chances we rejoin in 10-20 years given how the younger people wanted to remain?

German industry has already said they will be calling for a tariff-free trading arrangement with the UK. If an FTA is on the cards, as I think it is, we will likely return to relatively normal trade patters and growth. We could also get rid of tariffs unilaterally on imports, and some Tories in Canada have been calling for a post-Brexit FTA with us.

People need to remember that this is literally the same day as the results have been announced. Of course we're going to see volatility, especially in a market that evidently did not correctly price in the possibility of a Brexit.

And the lord did sayeth
Thou shalt do the dance

YOU STICKIED IT YOU CUNT

No.

You'd need to drug and rape the roommate in order to be the EU.