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Messages - More Than Mortal
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10831
« on: November 19, 2014, 05:16:36 PM »
More people are being deported because more are coming here illegally, as I pointed out twice earlier
Again, there's no mathematical necessity for numbers of illegal immigrants to correlate with deportation. That only exists within the current shitty paradigm.
>trying to put off the blunt truth
I'm not concerned with what's blunt or not, to be honest. I'm concerned with what makes sense mathematically. I'm not denying a correlation can exist, I'm just saying a correlation doesn't need to exist and could be got rid of.
10832
« on: November 19, 2014, 05:15:39 PM »
Intelligent people such as Rand Paul who have actual university disagrees
You demonstrate intelligence through discourse and development, not qualifications. In the context of this discussion, Psy and I are both intelligent individuals. You aren't helping your case, either, considering Rand Paul is a Doctor of Medicine, whereas I'll actually be studying Philosophy, Politics and Economics.
10833
« on: November 19, 2014, 05:11:08 PM »
And do we oppress your political opinions? Are we a liberal beacon?
Not at all. I know you don't like me for being pro-Israel, but you don't try and silence me for it. I know Challenger doesn't like me for my fairly conservative approach to the economy, but he doesn't try and silence me for it. This forum is surprisingly tolerant if you aren't completely fucking unreasonable.
10834
« on: November 19, 2014, 05:08:53 PM »
More people are being deported because more are coming here illegally, as I pointed out twice earlier
Again, there's no mathematical necessity for numbers of illegal immigrants to correlate with deportation. That only exists within the current shitty paradigm.
10835
« on: November 19, 2014, 05:07:48 PM »
You are aware you aren't the only member who swings to the right?
I'd like to point out that I'm more fucking right-wing than Kinder.
10836
« on: November 19, 2014, 05:05:40 PM »
The system isn't enforced.
I've already demonstrated how Obama has been one of the most nativist peacetime presidents. Now, you can throw around increasing numbers of illegal immigrants and whatnot (which isn't the fault of Obama), but it doesn't prove the system isn't enforced. It proves the system is inadequate. Nobody here is arguing we should give immigrants free reign to come and go as they fucking please, we just realise that building a wall is smearing-shit-on-the-wall insane.
10837
« on: November 19, 2014, 05:01:46 PM »
If that number isn't a big of a deal, then there's a issue on how you see things
Yes, but we're debating the economic impact and propensity of CONTEMPORARY policy to produce good outcomes. We aren't an ancient civilisation trying to defend ourselves against invaders who'll kill our men and rape our women.
10838
« on: November 19, 2014, 04:58:13 PM »
So in aspects of being flooded with foreigners, there exists similarities
 I don't have anything more to say to you.
10839
« on: November 19, 2014, 04:54:11 PM »
Have you ever learned about ancient Chinese history? Because if you did, you'd learn that the Qin Dynasty started the construction of the Great Wall,
Even you must be even basically aware of the sheer fucking stupidity of comparing the Qin Dynasty's construction of the Wall to America's situation/capacity.
10840
« on: November 19, 2014, 03:36:57 PM »
Killing was abhorrent to the Cathars. Catholic Church: 
10841
« on: November 19, 2014, 03:27:34 PM »
And yet the way to fill demand is through outsourcing.
. . . Jesus fucking Christ. You're essentially saying spending in America doesn't benefit Americans. The amount of goods and services which immigrants demand cannot all be outsourced, and the profits simply cannot all go to outsourced labour. It's like you're deliberately being facile. The entire reason unemployment hasn't recovered is because of structural issues on the supply-side of the economy, and depressed nominal income.
10842
« on: November 19, 2014, 03:15:12 PM »
Not like there's an endless supply of these jobs
There is, actually, with some temporal constraints.
10843
« on: November 19, 2014, 03:14:38 PM »
Illegals do take jobs
Not true, like I told Max, they boost AD. Immigrants demand goods and services facilitating economic expansion and falling unemployment. Even without such an effect, unemployment could be countenanced by proper monetary policy. Oh, and not to mention, more than half of Silicon Valley tech companies have immigrants as at least one key founder.
10844
« on: November 19, 2014, 03:11:42 PM »
Are immigrants really taking REAL jobs?
No, they largely create them by boosting AD.
10845
« on: November 19, 2014, 03:06:22 PM »
2. Lol, it's not a bs excuse.
Yes it is. Immigrants don't take jobs, that's such a dumb thing to say. As if the job pool is fucking fixed. Also, unemployment is at 6pc.
10846
« on: November 19, 2014, 03:00:33 PM »
It's pants on the head easy
Punishment generally doesn't work as much of a deterrent. Restributive justice is a joke. Even if it did it wouldn't change the motives for people coming here illegally. You could have a liberal immigration system and still punish people for breaking it, if you really can't stop your sadistic streak from breaking through. And, I can't stress this enough, it's overwhelmingly easier and more beneficial just to adopt sensible immigration and economic policies. You can paint it out to be easy, but your plan is incredibly convoluted.
10847
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:55:00 PM »
Or, we can direct more funds to border security and adopt harsher personalities for those who break federal law That's ridiculous on the face of it.
10848
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:53:46 PM »
Then work with the foreign government
Are you ignorant of, or just ignoring the fact, that said government will likely be complicit in such instances of genocide and, if that isn't the case, then a neighbouring government likely will and most likely be able to overpower the offended nation?
10849
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:49:02 PM »
This only teaches illegals that coming here illegally means they will eventually be able to stay
Or, on the other hand, you could liberalise the fucking immigration laws so people aren't overly-tempted to get in illegally.Just what about this aren't you getting?
10850
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:46:09 PM »
I'd also like to point out you could largely stabilise the economy (if you believe immigration causes economic issues) through proper government policy.
10851
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:43:43 PM »
we are not the government of Mexico, Columbia, etc, we are not the nanny of other people
No, but we are morally and legally obligated to act in instances of genocide.
10852
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:43:03 PM »
You know you could solve all of those problems and still have a fairly liberal immigration policy, right? We aren't defending open borders.
10853
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:41:18 PM »
Yeah, not our fucking problem that other countries have issues. I find it incredibly worrying that you could potentially think a genocide, or serious humanitarian violations, in other countries isn't our problem. or people bitching that the British government reserves jobs to British citizens or citizens of the EU. I don't know what you're talking about, but if you mean we give immigrative priority to citizens of the EU then fucking speak for yourself. I bitch about that all the time.
10854
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:39:18 PM »
Agree to disagree.
That's exactly my point. Immigration is pretty much as clear-cut an issue as you can get in economics, so we can afford to disagree about the nuances as much as we want.
10855
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:38:18 PM »
How is adding more people, who most likely have no degrees, can't speak English, and have no special skills equals to economic positive?
Their spending is your income.
10856
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:37:00 PM »
Hey, immigrants are necessary for an economy, whether or not you want to accept it. They're more than willing to do some of the shittiest jobs that the typical America would scoff at.
The beauty of this is that I don't agree with you. I actually think skilled immigration is a larger factor at play. But that's just it, we don't need to agree as long as we concede immigration is beneficial. Immigrants boost nominal income, and skilled or not, that's what matters.
10857
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:34:24 PM »
yes because deer and elk are regular offenders, they run up on peoples home like "yo nigga gimme yo wallet"
10858
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:31:49 PM »
Yes, please let's tell families and children attempting who are waiting in line in a legal manner to "go fuck yourselves" because we now have to deal with people who couldn't wait
Icy and I aren't arguing for that, though. We're saying we should just split the difference, and make immigration fucking simpler. Also, lol, immigrants are pretty much universally positive for the economy.
10859
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:30:54 PM »
With 100 illegals, you're going to deport about 60 of them. Under 1000 illegals, you're going to deport 600. The deportation size increases because there's more people
Again, no. That's only true if restrictive immigration laws are in place. There's no axiom which says 60pc of illegal immigrants will probably be deported, therefore the presence of more illegals equals more deportation. That only holds true in a paradigm where the law facilitates it.
10860
« on: November 19, 2014, 02:29:31 PM »
Because military operations don't need a $664 billion budget, especially when generals have voiced they don't need any more tanks yet the government keeps buying more
Allow me to rephrase my point in a less obscure way. Military expenditure is more important that enforcing unnecessarily restrictive immigration law, and where it can be cut, such gains should be paid into much more pressing needs.
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