Dark Souls Impressions - The FINAL Update

Big Boss | Mythic Card Master
 
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Jacob Potila was actually a Jacob Flotilla of lies.- WarTurkey
There's a dex weapon in the graveyard too, just sayin.
I probably picked it up. I haven't actually checked all of my weapons yet, but I'm gonna have to soon.

The weapon was a
Spoiler
Winged Spear

It's a good weapon for poking people with, and you can use it while holding your shield too


 
Verbatim
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Was thinking about updating the OP with my stats and whatnot, but I don't think anybody checks that shit.


 
Luciana
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Was thinking about updating the OP with my stats and whatnot, but I don't think anybody checks that shit.
They will if you update the title


 
Naru
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The Rage....
Was thinking about updating the OP with my stats and whatnot, but I don't think anybody checks that shit.
i-its not like i wanted to s-see your stats or anything...

B-BAKA!


 
Luciana
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They did that because the game is connected online so there is really no pausing it. What with the chance of being invaded, getting called to another world, etc.

Though offline yeah, that does seem like it should be a feature.

Not everything is a try hard mechanic >_>
That's true. I didn't even take that into consideration.

It definitely should be a feature offline, though. Without a doubt.
I agree with you. I remember I had to be someplace when I was fighting Manus (hardest boss imo, he's the DLC of that game) and I had to finish because, well, I was far.

Ended up killing him but my mother was annoyed I took a bit.
I really disagree with the idea of offline pause, it's done to make you feel no where is really safe, and that there is always some kind of danger. If you need to leave in a hurry the game gives you the option of returning to the menu and loading into the exact spot you left off.
If that was the case, then bonfires wouldn't exist, and neither would Firelink Shrine, along with a few other choice areas.


 
Luciana
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Also Verb just a little tip. I believe the Zweihander requires 24 in strength, but if you two hand it you can half it to 16.


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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They did that because the game is connected online so there is really no pausing it. What with the chance of being invaded, getting called to another world, etc.

Though offline yeah, that does seem like it should be a feature.

Not everything is a try hard mechanic >_>
That's true. I didn't even take that into consideration.

It definitely should be a feature offline, though. Without a doubt.
I agree with you. I remember I had to be someplace when I was fighting Manus (hardest boss imo, he's the DLC of that game) and I had to finish because, well, I was far.

Ended up killing him but my mother was annoyed I took a bit.
I really disagree with the idea of offline pause, it's done to make you feel no where is really safe, and that there is always some kind of danger. If you need to leave in a hurry the game gives you the option of returning to the menu and loading into the exact spot you left off.
If that was the case, then bonfires wouldn't exist, and neither would Firelink Shrine, along with a few other choice areas.
Those are the few area's that are meant to be the respite from it all, put it there to enhance this feeling of every where being dangerous. A few area's where you can rest. The lack of pause is because Big M wanted this feeling, and it adds to the factor of the game's overall deal which is overcoming challenges. If you can get past the area's with heavy danger. then you're reward for overcoming that is a little bit of rest.


 
Verbatim
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Those are the few area's that are meant to be the respite from it all, put it there to enhance this feeling of every where being dangerous. A few area's where you can rest. The lack of pause is because Big M wanted this feeling, and it adds to the factor of the game's overall deal which is overcoming challenges. If you can get past the area's with heavy danger. then you're reward for overcoming that is a little bit of rest.
>needing rest

lol fucking casual

i bet you use weapons that do more than 1 damage, too


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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Those are the few area's that are meant to be the respite from it all, put it there to enhance this feeling of every where being dangerous. A few area's where you can rest. The lack of pause is because Big M wanted this feeling, and it adds to the factor of the game's overall deal which is overcoming challenges. If you can get past the area's with heavy danger. then you're reward for overcoming that is a little bit of rest.
>needing rest

lol fucking casual

i bet you use weapons that do more than 1 damage, too
Your ironic shitposting is still shitposting.


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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Like sure the community can be cancerous, but when thinking about the game you need to think about what the director was trying to achieve, and how he's gone about doing it. Which in Dark Souls the entire theme is overcoming challengers. So the game is going to be tough on you the player, but for the most part the game is very fair. By taking away the traditional option of pausing the game, this causes the player more of a stress and a burden, one they must overcome. If you need to go in a hurry then you can exit the game and reload when you're back, or have the choice of going and clearing the area.  When you do however do manage to overcome it even with stress on your back, it's meant to feel great, a release.  Because after all, what have you done to earn that pause? Nothing, so you're gonna have to work towards it.

But the response I'll get is just the game doesn't treat the player "with respect" and therefore it's awful and the worse choice in the world.
Last Edit: January 23, 2016, 01:25:01 PM by Incan


 
Verbatim
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Like sure the community can be cancerous
And you're part of the cancer, I hope you realize.

Quote
By taking away the traditional option of pausing the game, this causes the player more of a stress and a burden
Like I said--I've already addressed this whole point. I know what the game is about and what it's trying to do. My whole argument is that 1.) it's not worth it, and 2.) it doesn't do it well enough, in that respect. You should be able to pause the game. The director is well within his right to prioritize artistic vision over treating his audience with respect. I think that's a stupid and counter-intuitive choice, but that's his right. But if his decisions make the game less fun for me, then I'm going to point it out.

And not being able to pause makes the game a little bit less fun for me. It's a necessity for a game in my eyes.

The fact is, having a simple pause feature for the offline mode hardly compromises the game's gimmick. The game is obviously challenging enough. Having a pause feature wouldn't change anything.

Quote
When you do however do manage to overcome it even with stress on your back, it's meant to feel great, a release.
But it doesn't.

Quote
But the response I'll get is just the game doesn't treat the player "with respect" and therefore it's awful and the worse choice in the world.
It's a bad choice. Just because you have a good artistic purpose for doing something on paper doesn't mean it's worth it in practice.

I don't see what's so good about not being able to pause when you absolutely need to. I don't see why bolstering the game's gimmick is so fucking important.

Spoiler
Having a pause feature does compromise the gimmick of the game because the game relies on your earning your rest, by being able to pause takes away from it because it's giving you a moment of rest with you working towards it.
Then the gimmick itself is fundamentally flawed and incompatible with reality.

People have shit to do with their lives. Therefore, there needs to be a pause feature. You shouldn't have to quit the game. It isn't instantaneous, it's cumbersome as fuck, and it kills the immersion.

Quote
He treats you with respect by showing you how good it feels to finally go through an area by working through it without getting that moments rest, that is his gift you you the player.
If he treated the player with respect, he'd recognize that people have lives to attend to and that a pause feature is necessary.

Quote
I think if I could just pause when I was playing offline it wouldn't be anymore fun to me, in the end for me all it would do is take away the tension of being vulnerable and open to enemy patrols.
But you're still vulnerable. You still have to play the game--you can just pause it now. Big fucking deal.

Quote
When there's no patrols about and pausing then? There's no reason to have a pause there either really as you can just leave the game running.
What are electric bills?

Spoiler
Like your last point is just turning off the game as the solution, as you would with anything. Turning it off is a valid point and is plenty good enough, you debunked absolutely nothing.
I'm not trying to "debunk" anything. I'm explaining to you why I think having no pause feature is retarded, and your justifications are all bullshit. I shouldn't have to quit the game and I shouldn't have to turn the system off. I should be able to press a single button. It wouldn't take away anything.

Your precious little game is flawed. Deal with it.
Last Edit: January 23, 2016, 02:14:25 PM by Fuddy Duddy II


 
Verbatim
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Anyway, I think we've spent too much time on this tiny subject. No pause feature is bad--the end.

I know Dark Souls fans will defend their precious game to the fucking death, but Jesus Christ.

Gonna start playing again soon.


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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By taking away the traditional option of pausing the game, this causes the player more of a stress and a burden
Like I said--I've already addressed this whole point. I know what the game is about and what it's trying to do. My whole argument is that 1.) it's not worth it, and 2.) it doesn't do it well enough, in that respect. You should be able to pause the game. The director is well within his right to prioritize artistic vision over treating his audience with respect. I think that's a stupid and counter-intuitive choice, but that's his right. But if his decisions make the game less fun for me, then I'm going to point it out.

And not being able to pause makes the game a little bit less fun for me. It's a necessity for a game in my eyes.

The fact is, having a simple pause feature for the offline mode hardly compromises the game's gimmick. The game is obviously challenging enough. Having a pause feature wouldn't change anything.

Quote
When you do however do manage to overcome it even with stress on your back, it's meant to feel great, a release.
But it doesn't.

Quote
But the response I'll get is just the game doesn't treat the player "with respect" and therefore it's awful and the worse choice in the world.
It's a bad choice. Just because you have a good artistic purpose for doing something on paper doesn't mean it's worth it in practice.

I don't see what's so good about not being able to pause when you absolutely need to. I don't see why bolstering the game's gimmick is so fucking important.
Having a pause feature does compromise the gimmick of the game because the game relies on your earning your rest, by being able to pause takes away from it because it's giving you a moment of rest with you working towards it. He treats you with respect by showing you how good it feels to finally go through an area by working through it without getting that moments rest, that is his gift you you the player.

I can't see how or why pause is necessary,  or why it's more fun to be able to just start and stop. I think if I could just pause when I was playing offline it wouldn't be anymore fun to me, in the end for me all it would do is take away the tension of being vulnerable and open to enemy patrols. When there's no patrols about and pausing then? There's no reason to have a pause there either really as you can just leave the game running.

Without the gimmick, Dark Souls just isn't  anything really. It's just a game with a fun combat system and good level design for the first half. The gimmick I think really completes what it is to be a Souls game.


Turkey | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
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You can just save and quit; it takes only a couple button presses. You're not supposed to be able to stop mid-fight, so it resets you to just before the fight as a tradeoff.


 
Verbatim
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You can just save and quit; it takes only a couple button presses. You're not supposed to be able to stop mid-fight, so it resets you to just before the fight as a tradeoff.
Already addressed this.

Not good enough.


Turkey | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
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You can just save and quit; it takes only a couple button presses. You're not supposed to be able to stop mid-fight, so it resets you to just before the fight as a tradeoff.
Already addressed this.

Not good enough.

At this point I'm not really addressing you, I'm just discussing the mechanic with everyone else.


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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Quote from: Fuddy Duddy II
Having a pause feature does compromise the gimmick of the game because the game relies on your earning your rest, by being able to pause takes away from it because it's giving you a moment of rest with you working towards it.
Then the gimmick itself is fundamentally flawed and incompatible with reality.

People have shit to do with their lives. Therefore, there needs to be a pause feature. You shouldn't have to quit the game. It isn't instantaneous, it's cumbersome as fuck, and it kills the immersion.

Quote
He treats you with respect by showing you how good it feels to finally go through an area by working through it without getting that moments rest, that is his gift you you the player.
If he treated the player with respect, he'd recognize that people have lives to attend to and that a pause feature is necessary.

Quote
I think if I could just pause when I was playing offline it wouldn't be anymore fun to me, in the end for me all it would do is take away the tension of being vulnerable and open to enemy patrols.
But you're still vulnerable. You still have to play the game--you can just pause it now. Big fucking deal.

Quote
When there's no patrols about and pausing then? There's no reason to have a pause there either really as you can just leave the game running.
What are electric bills?
All of this just boils down to "Oh well I'll quickly back track for a total of five seconds and get safe" or "Oh well I'll turn it off for now."

Like your last point is just turning off the game as the solution, as you would with anything. Turning it off is a valid point and is plenty good enough, you debunked absolutely nothing.


 
Verbatim
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If challenge is SUCH an important theme for the game to have, then my earlier shitpost has become a legitimate argument.

Presumably, you use weapons that deal more than 1 damage.
Presumably, you use resting areas.
Presumably, you don't allow the game to take over your life.

Why?

Are you a casual?

Don't you know if you don't make the game as difficult as possible for yourself, then you're ruining the game?


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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Quote
Like your last point is just turning off the game as the solution, as you would with anything. Turning it off is a valid point and is plenty good enough, you debunked absolutely nothing.
I'm not trying to "debunk" anything. I'm explaining to you why I think having no pause feature is retarded, and your justifications are all bullshit. I shouldn't have to quit the game and I shouldn't have to turn the system off. I should be able to press a single button. It wouldn't take away anything.

Your precious little game is flawed. Deal with it.
Your justifications just make zero sense, you aren't entitled to a pause button, nor would having one improve the game in anyway at all. You're not entitled to one, and in fact there's a system which takes at most 3 hits of a button to stop the game to go away and do something.

I'm not trying to say my opinion is better then yours, I'm just trying to explain why I'd think it would be heavily detrimental to have a pause button. You're entitled to your opinion, but that's just what it is, not a fact.

And guess what Verb? I do think Dark Souls 1 is flawed, some of the bosses are a little lazy, and the later area's are a bit shit. The netcode could be better, and PvP could also been more balanced. Other then that though, Dark Souls is a wonderfully designed game (in terms of mechanics and game play, levels towards the end are a bit shit as stated) with interesting lore.

Sorry if I'm defending something I think was a good idea just because it doesn't match up with your arbitrary ideas of how a game should be.


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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If challenge is SUCH an important theme for the game to have, then my earlier shitpost has become a legitimate argument.

Presumably, you use weapons that deal more than 1 damage.
Presumably, you use resting areas.
Presumably, you don't allow the game to take over your life.

Why?

Are you a casual?

Don't you know if you don't make the game as difficult as possible for yourself, then you're ruining the game?
The game gives you the tools, it depends of how you use them. I personally I love playing the game when I'm stuck at level 1 for the entire thing, or placing heavy restrictions. Something that Souls players often do to the embrace the spirit of the game. If you want to do anything else, that's a fine way to play the game. Some people think maybe magic is a bit cheap, but if that's you're plan there's nothing wrong with it.


 
Verbatim
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Some people think maybe magic is a bit cheap, but if that's you're plan there's nothing wrong with it.
Then there should be nothing wrong with having a pause feature, either.

It's not like the game would force you to pause. If you don't like pausing, then don't ever pause.

And wouldn't that be great, anyway?

It would be yet another thing for you cancerous Dark Souls sycophants to be elitist over!
"You actually PAUSE the game? xDDD LMAO FUCKING CASUALINA"

Additionally, you wouldn't be able to pause online, for obvious reasons--and that's the most popular way to play anyway.
Last Edit: January 23, 2016, 02:36:17 PM by Fuddy Duddy II


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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Some people think maybe magic is a bit cheap, but if that's you're plan there's nothing wrong with it.
Then there should be nothing wrong with having a pause feature, either.

It's not like the game would force you to pause. If you don't like pausing, then don't ever pause.

And wouldn't that be great, anyway?

It would be yet another thing for you cancerous Dark Souls sycophants to be elitist over!
"You actually PAUSE the game? xDDD LMAO FUCKING CASUALINA"
Well there is an issue, because again that would go against the idea the game is built upon directly. The game actively tries to make sure nothing is too overpowered and can exploited. Sometimes things do split through the cracks, like dark magic. But the game shouldn't have to give you the pause feature, it's like the Phoenix mode in the new Fire Emblem game. To many that shouldn't even be an option, as it means you can afford to be wasteful and not think much while playing. I say Dark Souls shouldn't have a pause because it goes against the entire idea of overcoming a challenge, like I've said many times already you shouldn't be able to get your rest so freely in that game, it's something you work for, not something you're just flat out given.

No need for the name calling by the way, I'm just trying to be civil for the most part here.


 
Verbatim
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Well there is an issue, because again that would go against the idea the game is built upon directly. The game actively tries to make sure nothing is too overpowered and can exploited. Sometimes things do split through the cracks, like dark magic. But the game shouldn't have to give you the pause feature, it's like the Phoenix mode in the new Fire Emblem game. To many that shouldn't even be an option, as it means you can afford to be wasteful and not think much while playing. I say Dark Souls shouldn't have a pause because it goes against the entire idea of overcoming a challenge, like I've said many times already you shouldn't be able to get your rest so freely in that game, it's something you work for, not something you're just flat out given.

No need for the name calling by the way, I'm just trying to be civil for the most part here.
You've thus far failed, utterly, to demonstrate what makes the extra challenge worth it.

Why is the gimmick worth sacrificing basic features. You just say that it is worth it, but I don't see how.

The first rule of video games is the game should be fun.
Last Edit: January 23, 2016, 02:49:50 PM by Fuddy Duddy II


Incan | Heroic Posting Rampage
 
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Well there is an issue, because again that would go against the idea the game is built upon directly. The game actively tries to make sure nothing is too overpowered and can exploited. Sometimes things do split through the cracks, like dark magic. But the game shouldn't have to give you the pause feature, it's like the Phoenix mode in the new Fire Emblem game. To many that shouldn't even be an option, as it means you can afford to be wasteful and not think much while playing. I say Dark Souls shouldn't have a pause because it goes against the entire idea of overcoming a challenge, like I've said many times already you shouldn't be able to get your rest so freely in that game, it's something you work for, not something you're just flat out given.

No need for the name calling by the way, I'm just trying to be civil for the most part here.
You've thus far failed, utterly, to demonstrate what makes the extra challenge worth it.

Why is the gimmick worth sacrificing basic features. You just say that it is worth it, but I don't see how.
Because it makes the sweet taste of a bonfire feel better that you've worked hard at it.


 
Luciana
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Anyway, I think we've spent too much time on this tiny subject. No pause feature is bad--the end.

I know Dark Souls fans will defend their precious game to the fucking death, but Jesus Christ.

Gonna start playing again soon.
You get hung up on issues like Congress gets hung up on Obamacare


getting political BAM!


Anyway, are you two done arguing? No one is getting anywhere.


 
Verbatim
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Because it makes the sweet taste of a bonfire feel better that you've worked hard at it.
It's a fucking video game. There's only so much effort that you should want to put into it.

You're not actually accomplishing anything in real life.


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Well there is an issue, because again that would go against the idea the game is built upon directly. The game actively tries to make sure nothing is too overpowered and can exploited.
They were pretty lazy with backstabs.
Which if, the player can freely choose to, devolves the game into an endless spin simulator just trying to loop around enemies with slower turn speed. In DS2 they sometimes created cool solutions to the problem with the turtlebros, but they largely only patched it over by artificially changing the turn speed faster than the animations could compensate for so we have horrible looking sliding in place.

As much as I love how much of a great skill inventory management is in Dark Souls, there is no reason for it to exist.


 
Luciana
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Bonfires actually do feel very relieving when going through a long run and you want to hit a checkpoint. The dilemma of going back to replenish estus or pushing on ahead is most certainly a hard one sometimes. Though in DS2 it's not as much since there is one like every other step.


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It's not like pausing even actually helps you unless you try playing the game frame by frame like some kind of sperg. It's just like shields. The enemy isn't going away just because you have these temporary tools of delaying yourself from taking damage.


 
Luciana
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I don't think he's arguing about pausing helping you though, so much as real life stuff does indeed crop up. I hated being rushed when fighting Manus, because I had gotten further than I ever did.

I do think an offline pause feature would be kinda nice. And I say that for the sake of real life stuff, not some philosophical thing Souls games tend to delve into. I just sometimes have pressing things when I'm in the middle of combat, so it kinda sucks.
Last Edit: January 23, 2016, 03:00:44 PM by Luciana