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44281
« on: January 11, 2015, 08:05:11 AM »
I don't support making animals suffer. Oxymoron.
44282
« on: January 11, 2015, 08:03:01 AM »
No.
44283
« on: January 11, 2015, 08:01:03 AM »
I wouldn't attack you for enjoying vegetables. There's no rational statement to be made against eating vegetables. My entire contention is suffering--you are perpetuating, supporting, promoting the suffering of sentient beings. That's the statement you're making as a meat-eater. I'm saying that's wrong. I don't "attack" meat-eaters, I argue with them. And when they act like selfish cunts, I tell them what they are. PS I fucking hate vegetables. I don't eat them, because I don't personally enjoy them. I would love to go back to meat-eating, because meat tastes so much better. But I'm ethically opposed to the torture and killing of animals, so I won't. It's that simple.
44284
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:57:45 AM »
Actually their brains could be incredibly different from ours. Not to mention their environment, culture, society. Even if they were humanoids with similar brains they'd be extremely different. The argument being made is that they'd be just as intelligent as us. If the most intelligent person you could ever think of is not a vegan, you're doing it wrong.
44285
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:55:55 AM »
If they could kill me, sure. I wouldn't call it their right, but if they have the power to do so, tough cookie. Well then, there you go. At least you're consistent with your beliefs. It's still irrational, though, because killing for no justified reason will always be wrong.
44286
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:52:44 AM »
But you see, they'd still have different brains from us. No, they wouldn't. A brain is a brain. Do you understand biology? At all?
44287
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:51:36 AM »
I wouldn't kill a chimp and eat him, but I'd kill a cow. That's about as humane and respectful killing gets, because at the end of the day I'm ending a creature's life to extend my own. Well, it would be great if someone else killed you, ate you, just to extend their own life. And they would be well within their right to do that, wouldn't they?
44288
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:48:33 AM »
No proof? I think the meat industry disproves that. How the fuck does the meat industry prove that? Slave owners proved that the only thing blacks are good for is slavery, then. That's your logic. And what about those? They provide different nutrients. They cover literally everything that you need. Meat is redundant and unneeded. It destroys any reason to take you seriously, sure. Hypothetical scenarios can't do shit because they're hypothetical and don't match reality. Therefore, it's retarded and meaningless and you have nothing to rely on but hypothetical fantasies You're such a bad troll.
44289
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:46:05 AM »
If they were as intelligent as us, do you even think they'd give one fuck what we think is right or wrong? Yes. Because they'd be as intelligent as us.
44290
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:43:40 AM »
But amoebas still eat other organisms, even if they aren't sentient. It doesn't MATTER if they're not fucking sentient. That's the whole goddamn issue. Eating things isn't inherently bad. Suffering is bad. How many times do I have to say this shit? It's natural. You say it as if it's a bad thing. No, I'm saying it as if it's the most horrible thing ever. Because it is. Just because something is natural doesn't make it okay. You have to demonstrate WHY it's okay. That's an appeal to nature fallacy. Not to mention most of the animals we use for food were bred over thousands of years for that specific purpose. AND THAT'S FUCKING HORRIBLE DO YOU NOT REALIZE HOW FUCKING HORRIBLE THAT IS
44291
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:40:48 AM »
No, I'm not religious. And yes, it's their purpose. They have no other reason to exist but to die for us. No proof. Apples? LOL no. Meat provides us with nutrients that veggies can't. You're forgetting grains, nuts, legumes, and vitamins. I understand hypothetical scenarios, it's just they're fucking retarded and completely pointless because they won't happen. So there's no reason to take them seriously. You're only not taking it seriously because it completely destroys your argument.
44292
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:39:06 AM »
It kind of eliminates the possibility. An organism from another planet, another planet would be so drastically different that we couldn't even begin to imagine it. It would have evolved (or maybe even something else) completely separate from us. So I fail to see why it would even entertain the thought of consuming organisms from another planet. 1. You're evading the point again. 2. You have no evidence that that would be the case. There's nothing wrong with it. Do what you like. But I'm going to keep eating animals. The only wrong thing is you think you're right and we're scumbags for eating food. Get over it. Like I said a couple pages ago when this all began. You can eat meat--just don't act like that's a good thing to do, and don't advocate that future generations do it. That's all I ask. And don't be a gluttonous piece of shit about it, either. Have an appreciation or a level of accounting for the sacrifice. Right, but they're not heartless. In fact, rarely does an animal kill another animal if isn't for food or territory. I classify that as heartless, unethical behavior. If carnivores had functioning brains capable of rationality, they'd recognize that killing things is bad, and they'd probably feel remorse over their kills.
44293
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:32:44 AM »
That fish getting chomped in half by a shark isn't okay with it. That protozoa being consumed by an amoeba isn't okay with it. That cow thrown into a grinder to make us food isn't okay with it. ...Exactly. Thanks for making the argument for me. Yes, sharks are pieces of shit. Except protozoans and amoebas aren't fucking sentient, so that example was just plain stupid. And I fail to see why it regresses our intelligence, either. Because we don't have to resort in taking the life of another feeling, sentient being-- taking it--for our petty desires. We don't have to kill animals to survive anymore. There are worthy alternatives. Arguably more healthy ones. The only argument you can possibly make is, "it tastes good." Which isn't an argument, but a concession to one's own selfish pusillanimity. Their addiction. It's an insult to our fucking intelligence. We don't need to kill animals anymore, and it causes a fuckton of suffering for them, so why not stop doing it. Just because we have the capacity to kill only plants instead of animals doesn't mean that we have to. I'd actually like to enjoy my meals, you know? Is that what it's about? You? Your personal enjoyment? Your personal enjoyment is worth the suffering of millions of sentient creatures. No, it isn't. We are naturally gluttonous, just like every other organism. And nothing will ever change that. 3% of adults in the US identify as vegetarians, and 1% of that 3% are vegans. Not a large figure, but it's there. And that's just the US. They represent living examples of people who prove you wrong. I am a living example of someone who proves you wrong. Nothing will ever change that? I did change it.
44294
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:19:28 AM »
Wonderful, then I'm golden.
Fetch me a cow and a .22, please. I want a flank steak. I'm saying it's just as bad, if not worse, but you know, whatever.
44295
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:16:44 AM »
The only execrable thing you've done is give your money to industries that slaughter and kill animals--the sort of thing you probably wouldn't do if you actually saw the cow you were about to eat getting brutally killed in front of you.
Can't be much different than having watched the venison that you're frying get decapitated and gutted.
You're right, it isn't.
44296
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:15:46 AM »
No such animal exists, so that'll never happen. Again, not the point. You don't know if there's not aliens out there that will find this fucking planet and find your ass incredibly tasty. The chances of that happening are infinitesimally low, but that's not the point. The point is, it should. Happen.
A hypothetical being from another planet would have a completely different chemistry to us. How would we even know it uses a metabolism? How would we even know it's a carbon based life form?
Not the point.What if they DID have the same chemistry? Seriously, what kind of argumentation is that? I'm not referring to any possibility--I'm referring to one specific type of possibility.
44297
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:13:48 AM »
Edit: I also never said it was okay to treat them like shit.
Don't put words in my mouth. My entire fucking argument is that killing animals in order to eat them is mistreatment. Full-stop. Explain to me what exactly is so wrong with us killing and eating animals? Do you want to be killed and eaten? No? Then what gives you the right to eat animals? Do you think they're okay with it? We're animals, and other animals do it, too. Like a Lion mauling an antelope to death. Why should we be like the stupid animals? We have the capacity to be much smarter and more responsible and more graceful than that. You talk about this great intelligence that we have--why are you asking us to regress? Except we do what humans do best, be gluttonous pieces of shit. Yep.
44298
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:09:25 AM »
No such animal exists, so that'll never happen. Again, not the point. You don't know if there's not aliens out there that will find this fucking planet and find your ass incredibly tasty. The chances of that happening are infinitesimally low, but that's not the point. The point is, it should. Happen.
44299
« on: January 11, 2015, 07:05:00 AM »
I'm not zealous... i'm just kidding anyway you are the biggest avatar fan i've met across the internet, though i mean, enough to name yourself after a character from the show, anyway
44300
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:57:30 AM »
Why would and should I care about them? I have absolutely no reason to care. Because you wouldn't want it to happen to you.I wish I could italicize that enough. Don't cry about it if someone much bigger and stronger and smarter than you hunts you down for someone else's food. And that's what you deserve to have happen to you, in my opinion, if you're going to say it's okay to treat animals like shit as long as you don't know the animal personally.
44301
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:47:29 AM »
...We've been going.
44302
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:44:58 AM »
Okay. Here's a scenario.
A building is on fire, and there's 10 people and 10 pigs trapped inside. Which do you try and save?
Spoiler If you say the pigs then you're morally backwards. How is that a relevant scenario to veganism? Oh right, it's not. Saying hou hope multiple people in this thread get killed is you just spazzing out as usual and shitting up a thread because you're argument is shit and because you're a hypocrite. I've demonstrated why I think you and those other people should get killed--it's simply a matter of reciprocation. You getting what you levy onto others. If you're okay with consuming sentient beings, and you see nothing at all wrong or reprehensible about torturing animals for our gain, I hope a sentient being tortures and consumes you. That's not "spazzing out". Not even a little bit. It's applying your OWN LOGIC to your garbage statements. My argument isn't shit. I actually have an argument. You're just upset because I have more empathy than you. And you have no argument. "But I like to eat meat!" Tough.
44303
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:27:32 AM »
Because it simply isn't.
A human life is more valuable than an animal. It's just the way things are. I don't accept your premise, at all. This will get nowhere if you can't come up with an actual reason. Verbatim shitting up yet another thread. Really? I honestly feel like this has been a pretty good discussion, ignoring your inability to make an argument. Go ahead and stir more shit, though, hypocrite.
44304
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:25:33 AM »
"Design" implies there's a designer. Well, that's obviously not what I meant. I'm sorry, but I didn't invent the language. When I use words like "design," I mean to imply that they've underwent a series of complex changes throughout their evolutionary history such that they'd most efficiently be able to kill other animals without remorse for their own gain, so they can be the #1 predatory threat in their area. Because they fuck, but they're mammals, so they can't fuck too often to survive--they have to be carnivorous, heartless killing machines to be able to propagate and sustain their own species. They're not like frogs, giving birth to a hundred or so of their offspring. They've evolved with a different ecological strategy. That's what I'm talking about when I'm talking about design. And still, I would argue that "evolution" is the "designer". It's not a person, it's a force of nature, but really, what difference does that make? It's a metaphor, for all intents and purposes.
44305
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:20:52 AM »
I don't care if somebody kills a cow I've never even seen that provides me with something to eat. Had I known the cow, I'd obviously feel different. If I had to kill animals myself every day to eat, I don't know if I could. I'd probably end up getting attached to all of them and wind up eating nuts, fruits, and vegetables. See? There you go. That's a good... well, it's not a GREAT mentality, but it's a good mentality to be in. If you have to have familial attachments to animals to feel any empathy towards them, I think that's a problem, but at least you're capable of thinking, "Yeah, maybe this isn't right." I'm glad. The difference between you and me here lies only with empathy. It doesn't matter to me if I don't know the animal personally--I still can't justify killing it if I have all the resources in the world. That's why I say, if you're okay with killing an animal for food, you should be okay with someone killing you for food. And I get so angry about it because I look around and all I see are people who are proud of their lack of empathy. And it disgusts me. It's revolting. It's like when you see or hear about people dying and suffering across the world. You care, but you don't spend the rest of the day crying about it. Right. So what's your point? I mean, I don't spend my time crying about the suffering of humans or animals, but I do speak up about it. I'm the only one who's really accounting for it. What's wrong with that?
44306
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:13:38 AM »
No, I wouldn't be okay with that because I'm not a sociopath.
Animals being killed isn't at all the same as people being killed. Says who? This is why I'd like you to get hunted down and eaten, and see how you like it.
44307
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:11:28 AM »
They're not "designed" to do anything. Yes, they are. Do you know what evolution is? Do you know what evolution has been doing? Fuck you for associating me with PETA.
44308
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:04:50 AM »
Is eating meat a bad thing? Not at all. I never said it was. I've attested to that very fact. Su-ffer-ing is bad.
44309
« on: January 11, 2015, 06:02:10 AM »
I know they suffer when they're slaughtered, but that's not going to affect me in the slightest and it's not going to stop me from eating meat. It doesn't affect you, so it's okay. All right then. Your friends and family get slaughtered and eaten, then. How does that swim with you? Humans are omnivores by nature. We eat meat because it provides the body with things it needs. Things that are very easily replaced, yes.
44310
« on: January 11, 2015, 05:59:16 AM »
They serve their purpose Any proof that that's their purpose? Do you believe in God? If so, we can stop having this discussion now, because I won't have a discussion about ethics with some religious kook. If there's any sacrifice better than keeping us from starving, I'd love to hear it. They're called fucking "apples," guy. Boom. That's implying there's an animal smarter than a human, which there isn't. You're missing the point again, unsurprisingly. I'm not surprised at all to know you don't understand the purpose of a hypothetical scenario. I should've used the word "if" instead of "when", but then again, maybe you should just be smart enough to know that that's what I meant.
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