Is this immoral?

More Than Mortal · September 14, 2014, 07:47:40 PM

A very wealthy man wants to have sex with young girls. But, he's a utilitarian who would never dream of causing suffering, harm or humiliation.

So, he buys human eggs on the open market and mixes them with his own sperm in a lab. He pays a lot of money for the eggs and the lab, everybody's making money, he pays a woman a lot for her to be a surrogate. At five months of gestation he has a special surgeon come in and perform an operation to sever the brain-stem which would cause the child to be born brain dead. No sensation is ever felt by this person over the course of her life from conception to eventual death.

The child is born, he pays to have the body taken to his house and then when it reaches the age of 11-12 he begins having sex with it.

September 14, 2014, 07:49:00 PM

Not at all. Morality is just the emotional rules governing the relationship between sapient creatures. The thing you described isn't sapient at all.

More Than Mortal · September 14, 2014, 07:50:44 PM

Quote from: Nuka on September 14, 2014, 07:49:19 PM

Purposely removing sentience so you can fuck a child seems rather immoral and crude, yeah.

So the dis-allowance of potential sentience for personal gain is an immoral act?

Super Irish · September 14, 2014, 07:53:36 PM

Let's see...

Incest? Check
An OTT Lobotomy? Check
Essentially paying for sex? Check

Yep, pretty damn immoral.

You could even argue it goes against his utilitarian beliefs seeing as he's making a child brain-dead on purpose, similar to those brain-dead vegetables in hospitals they pull the plugs on. That's total psychological harm by making them husks, and then humiliation by fucking them.

EDIT: Oh, and that's ignoring the elephant in the room with the pedophilia and rape. (Even if this was in the Vatican/Japan, it's still un-consented sex)

DAS B00T x2 · September 14, 2014, 07:56:45 PM

On one hand, he just rendered a child that should be beyond abortion terms essentially dead.
On the other hand, nobody is actually suffering and this placates any desire to harm others from the man (at least until he grows tired of his "living" sex doll.)
On the third hand, I now know what Meta's doing when he wins the lottery.

More Than Mortal · September 14, 2014, 07:57:35 PM

Quote from: SuperIrish on September 14, 2014, 07:53:36 PM

Let's see...

Incest? Check
An OTT Lobotomy? Check
Essentially paying for sex? Check

Yep, pretty damn immoral.

You could even argue it goes against his utilitarian beliefs seeing as he's making a child brain-dead on purpose, similar to those brain-dead vegetables in hospitals they pull the plugs on. That's total psychological harm by making them husks, and then humiliation by fucking them.

EDIT: Oh, and that's ignoring the elephant in the room with the pedophilia and rape. (Even if this was in the Vatican/Japan, it's still un-consented sex)

I wouldn't say it's rape.

Besides that, however, incest, prostitution and paedophilia aren't immoral by any reasonable capacity.

Super Irish · September 14, 2014, 08:08:05 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on September 14, 2014, 07:57:35 PM

I wouldn't say it's rape.

Besides that, however, incest, prostitution and paedophilia aren't immoral by any reasonable capacity.

It's still rape if they don't have the mental capacity to answer. Same as ryhypnol or excessive amounts of alcohol.

And as for the latter, how so? Genuinely intrigued. (excl. Prostitution to be fair, but I'm erring on the the side of immoral)

September 14, 2014, 08:17:00 PM

Quote from: SuperIrish on September 14, 2014, 07:53:36 PM

Incest? Check
Essentially paying for sex? Check

Yep, pretty damn immoral.

Neither incest nor prostitution is immoral.

I_IRONMAN_I · September 14, 2014, 08:40:39 PM

Incest.
Paying to sex young child that's yours.

Immoral as hell.

Kinder Graham · September 14, 2014, 08:41:22 PM

Mr. Psychologist · September 14, 2014, 08:50:28 PM

Just what the literal fuck was going through your mind to make you think up this scenario?

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · September 14, 2014, 08:54:10 PM

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Kinder Graham · September 14, 2014, 08:58:26 PM

Quote from: Mr Psychologist on September 14, 2014, 08:50:28 PM

Just what the literal fuck was going through your mind to make you think up this scenario?

>meta
>not having questionable thoughts

pick one pl0x

Mr. Psychologist · September 14, 2014, 08:59:12 PM

Quote from: Kinder_ on September 14, 2014, 08:58:26 PM

Quote from: Mr Psychologist on September 14, 2014, 08:50:28 PM

Just what the literal fuck was going through your mind to make you think up this scenario?
>meta
>not having questionable thoughts

pick one pl0x

lol

But even by his standards this is twisted.

Kinder Graham · September 14, 2014, 09:00:05 PM

Quote from: Mr Psychologist on September 14, 2014, 08:59:12 PM

Quote from: Kinder_ on September 14, 2014, 08:58:26 PM
Quote from: Mr Psychologist on September 14, 2014, 08:50:28 PM

Just what the literal fuck was going through your mind to make you think up this scenario?
>meta
>not having questionable thoughts

pick one pl0x

lol

But even by his standards this is twisted.

Nah

He even said he was standing over his step-dad and about to stab/kill him

Mr. Psychologist · September 14, 2014, 09:03:19 PM

Quote from: Kinder_ on September 14, 2014, 09:00:05 PM

Quote from: Mr Psychologist on September 14, 2014, 08:59:12 PM
Quote from: Kinder_ on September 14, 2014, 08:58:26 PM
Quote from: Mr Psychologist on September 14, 2014, 08:50:28 PM

Just what the literal fuck was going through your mind to make you think up this scenario?
>meta
>not having questionable thoughts

pick one pl0x

lol

But even by his standards this is twisted.

Nah

He even said he was standing over his step-dad and about to stab/kill him

Call me old fashioned but this is worse.

Mr. Psychologist · September 14, 2014, 09:09:08 PM

ThisMisEenoughTinternetAfor IoneSday,AI'mNgoingFtoEbedGnow.I: /T

Verbatim · September 14, 2014, 09:19:28 PM

I didn't originally respond to this thread, because my answer is a given, but like... I saw the replies, and I was like...

GIVE ME THE RED BUTTON.

Hahahaha very funny Zonda · September 14, 2014, 09:38:17 PM

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Mordo · September 14, 2014, 09:41:39 PM

g💚jira · September 15, 2014, 01:38:45 AM

Holy sh1t I don't even possess the will to respond, how did you even come up with that

Like seriously you could be the next H.R. Giger here if you just funneled this creativity into visual art. And, well, if you started making everything penises, but that's a different story.

Spoiler

PS: Have I ever mentioned that I generally stay out of Serious threads in non philosophy forums? It's just you and Madman Mordo that keep drawing me back with your hilarious and weird comments omg

More Than Mortal · September 15, 2014, 01:41:13 AM

Oh my God, this thread is fucking priceless.

BlitzFiend · September 15, 2014, 01:41:35 AM

You've gone incoherent cuz of your botched lobotomy

velox · September 15, 2014, 01:58:00 AM

I'd say yes, since you're turning a fetus, that was going to develop a human being, into a mindless husk. I'd say that's different from abortion, as abortion is simply ending it early (out of need, I might add) and this is changing it to something else.

If you were to change the genome to never have the fetus grow a brain in the first place, and have it grow in some kind of artificial womb (tank), though? Then that would be more of a biologically grown sex doll, and not a changed human.

To be honest though, this is grey as fuck when it comes to morality. Is human life sacred? Is life in general? Does an entity that not feel or think have rights?

Still, I think that dooming a growing fetus to an existence in limbo is pretty cruel. Not because of any experience you put it through, since it would be void of senses. But rather to rob it of being capable of sensing at all, while still continuing to exist as a hollow shell...

challengerX · September 15, 2014, 03:58:11 AM

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BrenMan 94 · September 15, 2014, 07:11:34 AM

I wouldn't say it's immoral, but it seems fucked up nonetheless.

This is one of those situations where I would just try not to think about what the person is doing, like how I do with people who eat afterbirth.

Mr. Psychologist · September 15, 2014, 07:30:16 AM

Quote from: ねこ on September 14, 2014, 09:38:17 PM

Meta is more like a mad scientist who would use something that would creep the shit out of someone like Mr.Psychologist [even though I'm dessapointed by the fact that he said he enjoys blood and ogre and is being a huge pussy right meow]

FTFY <.<

I do love blood and gore, but this is pretty twisted.

Spoiler

When things go smexual, they become disgusting for me

Korra · September 15, 2014, 07:37:06 AM

What the hell?

More Than Mortal · September 15, 2014, 09:43:15 AM

Quote from: challengerX on September 15, 2014, 03:58:11 AM

He's manipulating things and taking advantage of his own daughter and raping her.

How are any of those things applicable when absolutely no harm is being done to anybody? The daughter was never even really alive; never capable of cognition or (dis)pleasure of emotion.

challengerX · September 15, 2014, 09:50:20 AM

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