Halo 5 Story specific discussion thread (Admirals get in here!!)

I know there's already a Halo 5 mega-thread but I felt the need to make a story specific one to have constructive discussion about the game and it's pre-release advertising campaign's story questionable discussions and what they did both wrong and right as well as it's implications for future material without having 2 billion "Fuck Pizza skins" complaints in a row.

My opinion on the game

Now with that out of the way in my opinion Halo 5 is extremely curious. I honestly don't hate the ending like most people. In fact I love the ending! The prospect for this war against the Forerunner's overwhelming technology and the possibilities for what comes next excites me. I instead feel that the problem is with the events leading up to it. The game does not earn the big cliffhanger ending. I think the big problem is that they advertised the game's story at it's core is a search for Cortana and trying to uncover her intentions, but it get's sidetracked with so much other stuff that it almost completely loses focus at points and thus loses out on the part of the story that really matters.
I realize now that the hunt for John was only supposed to be a front in the first place and the intrigue was supposed to be that of figuring out what's going on with Cortana, but the game gets way too distracted with Locke and Sangelios which ultimately accomplish nothing that acting as filler, and taking up time that could have been better spent on the main story of Cortana's reappearance.
They could have easily condensed and consolidated certain levels (like Glassed, Meridian Station, Unconfirmed and Evacuation) to make room for more important things, like missions on Genesis or cutscenes that actually advance the main story, and even cut certain levels entirely like Enemy Lines and put the Kraken into the Battle of Sunaion.

I think the problem of the story losing it's focused is the most pronounced when Locke finally Catches up with John and John already knows Cortana's goals aren't exactly the best. We never got to see what brings him to that conclusion. Exuberant Waifu even states that they have been wandering the Conduit for hours. You'd think seeing what happens between then that lead John to be suspicious of Cortana would be more important to show than Mike Colter and friends going to find a pet sentinel.

I think 343 was just desperate to fit the fall of the covenant into the game and the whole thing suffered because of it. Maybe they should have waited for Halo Wars 2 or done a completely different project for the sake of giving both stories the space they need.

If they had focused more on the real point of the story, and constructed it in a way that felt less like everything had just gotten started at the end, I think the prospect of Cortana beginning her takeover of the galaxy. In fact I think the main events of the main story-line lend themselves to this very well. John finding  out Cortana is alive and has plans for this forced control over the galaxy over a mislead idea of peace and ends up being captured out of his compasion for Cortana, and then meanwhile Locke, who was sent on a manhunt for John who went AWOL, has his mission changed to a rescue when he realises the truth of what's happening by the clues John left behind. You take those elements of the story develop those without all the needless filler and you have a full narative that makes the ending woth it.

Other than that, Loke was boring. No idea what 343 wanted to accomplish by introducing him. In fact everyone  other than John, Warden Eternal and Cortana are pretty anemic or nonexistant in terms of anything other than backstory. They needed to do more with the characters that had or simply not had them at all.

John seems to be growing as a character. He has at some point between Halo 4 and now developed his own opinions and convictions including about what was done to him, but despite that he hasn't gone full Karen Traviss like everyone else (Including Halsey herself apparently) although I do question his comparison of the Spartan program to Coranta's forced peace.

Warden Eternal is an interesting fellow. He clearly shares the sentiment of the Didact and plently other forerunners that humanity are dangerous and animalistic, but still defaults his goals to Cortana. Why he belives AI's are to inherit the Mantle is unknown and an interesting prospect. It is very likely that he has an ultirior motive and may have just made the entire thing up, especially since the only other Forerunner AI we see in the game thinks he's gone apeshit and is firmly agains his and Cortana's goals.
And everyone makes white knight jokes about the Warden which is an absolutely hilarious interpretation of his charachter but ultimately what his is doing, in subverting Cortana to stop John is exactly what he should be doing in his role. He knows John only as a warrior of what he considers a dangerous and savage race, and what we gather from his dialogue, probably knows a good bunch about the Spatan program in general and even John personally. At the end of the day he knows John wont agree with Cortana's plan and will likely do everything in his power to stop her, making him a threat to Cortana and their plans.

There's still the issues of the Domain and the audio logs
As much as I do like about the campaign and  think they had some good ideas, I still think it was the weakest story in the series by far.

but that was just my 2 cents on the matter for now, so with that what are you guys' thoughts, oppinions and theories on Halo 5

The Greatest Hunt in Gaming History

"You know that race that got completely demolished by the Flood, forcing them to commit a Galaxy-wide Genocide in order to protect all life from being infected? Well guess who has a few handfulls of enforcers that can each singlehandedly keep shit under control in an entire Solar System?"

"You know that race that got completely demolished by the Flood, forcing them to commit a Galaxy-wide Genocide in order to protect all life from being infected? Well guess who has a few handfulls of enforcers that can each singlehandedly keep shit under control in an entire Solar System?"

Admirals explained to me in another thread that the even Guardians would not have been capable of containing the Flood.
They had already gotten into slipspace by the time the forerunners had to deal with them so the EMP's wernt going to do much good, plus there was still the massive issue of the Logic Plauge that turned everything that thought in 1s and 0s to the flood's side.

The Greatest Hunt in Gaming History

No offense but I was hoping we could keep the thread less cynical and more on constructive criticism of specific aspects of the story. Plus this is the billionth time we've made that exact joke anyway.
The Greatest Hunt in Gaming History

Here's the thing, Halsey never went 'Karen Traviss'. From the earliest facets of Halo lore, she was very hard on herself. However, she buried it down deep as she ultimately knew the Spartans were the best chance the UNSC had to avert billions dead and humanity fractured.

Chief always knew something weird was going on from the moment he arrived on Genesis.

"Chief, back there, on Meridian. There were civilians"
"I know."

In my opinion though, the biggest failure Halo 5 suffers from is being structured like a prologue. It sets all the pieces in motion, then bam. Nothing. More than that, there wasn't enough elaboration on how Cortana survived, or what the Warden's role is. Keeper of the Domain and Her Secrets, sure, but why does that entail combat roles. Why are his bodies powered by slipspace bubbles? And what gives him the authority to invoke the Mantle of Responsibility?

The Didact was Protector of the Ecumene - defender of trillions of Forerunners - yet he didn't have the authority to reclaim the Mantle remotely during Halo 4 which we know he attempted to thanks to Catalog. Maybe a bit of a leap, but perhaps the Mantle isn't just a concept, but is actually tangibly connected to the Domain.

Anyway, I've come to the conclusion Halo 6 will feature human enemies. 343i's laid the plot point that the UNSC no longer is the sole creator of Spartans, and that many mega-corporations dealing with the military industrial complex are more or less under Created control.

Halo 6 should be pretty good though. There's A LOT of plot-threads that could be connected and used.

UNSC no longer has a fleet? Go find Admiral Cole and use his civlization's fleet.
Need a base of operations? They've got the Refuge with Enduring Bias - a Contender-class ancilla as well as a compliment of Sangheili.
Need access to powerful tech and secrets? They've got Rtas tracking down the San'Shyuum that survived the Great Schism with an offer of peace.

Then we've also got the Builder stuck in the Domain (composed?) who's looking for Bastion.

A bit random, but what also popped into my mind is how Rho 'Barutamee was looking for Maethrillian - and that his death on Reach was ambiguous.

Anyway, what just popped into my head just as I was about to press submit is an explanation as to why the Warden chose Cortana. Spartan Ops and Escalation sets up the plot-point that Halsey is meant to be the herald of mankind's ascension. Whatever geas she has are serving as some kind of marker for this. Well, guess what, Cortana is a copy of Halsey's brain; it's not far fetched that she carries those same markers which is why the Warden is so certain of Cortana.

Well, I should get back to linear algebra.

"You know that race that got completely demolished by the Flood, forcing them to commit a Galaxy-wide Genocide in order to protect all life from being infected? Well guess who has a few handfulls of enforcers that can each singlehandedly keep shit under control in an entire Solar System?"

Admirals explained to me in another thread that the even Guardians would not have been capable of containing the Flood.
They had already gotten into slipspace by the time the forerunners had to deal with them so the EMP's wernt going to do much good, plus there was still the massive issue of the Logic Plauge that turned everything that thought in 1s and 0s to the flood's side.

The Greatest Hunt in Gaming History

No offense but I was hoping we could keep the thread less cynical and more on constructive criticism of specific aspects of the story. Plus this is the billionth time we've made that exact joke anyway.
The Greatest Hunt in Gaming History

lol my bad

but i couldn't help it

"You know that race that got completely demolished by the Flood, forcing them to commit a Galaxy-wide Genocide in order to protect all life from being infected? Well guess who has a few handfulls of enforcers that can each singlehandedly keep shit under control in an entire Solar System?"

Devices designed to only emit EMP bursts to combat and stifle troublesome emerging civilizations. Hell, if you still think their existence is dumb, then take a reference to them all the way back in Halo 3:

L: The Mantle. You still hold to that [fairy tale] after all that has happened? After this thing has consumed a million worlds? Can't you see? Belief in the Mantle sealed our doom! Weakened our [protectorates], bred dependence and sloth. Our [so-called Guardianship] has stripped those we would keep safe of any capacity for self-defense!Were we such noble [Guardians] when we drew our line and abandoned billions to the parasite?

"You know that race that got completely demolished by the Flood, forcing them to commit a Galaxy-wide Genocide in order to protect all life from being infected? Well guess who has a few handfulls of enforcers that can each singlehandedly keep shit under control in an entire Solar System?"

Devices designed to only emit EMP bursts to combat and stifle troublesome emerging civilizations. Hell, if you still think their existence is dumb, then take a reference to them all the way back in Halo 3:

L: The Mantle. You still hold to that [fairy tale] after all that has happened? After this thing has consumed a million worlds? Can't you see? Belief in the Mantle sealed our doom! Weakened our [protectorates], bred dependence and sloth. Our [so-called Guardianship] has stripped those we would keep safe of any capacity for self-defense!Were we such noble [Guardians] when we drew our line and abandoned billions to the parasite?

If their main form of attack is to disable all power-operated equipment within their reach rather than being capable of outright destruction, then it's significantly less far fetched to me. All Halo 5 mentions of them (aside from the Concussive blasts pre-slipspace and the EMP at the end) is that each one is capable of patrolling an entire solar system, which leaves the specific armaments very open to the imagination.

"You know that race that got completely demolished by the Flood, forcing them to commit a Galaxy-wide Genocide in order to protect all life from being infected? Well guess who has a few handfulls of enforcers that can each singlehandedly keep shit under control in an entire Solar System?"

Devices designed to only emit EMP bursts to combat and stifle troublesome emerging civilizations. Hell, if you still think their existence is dumb, then take a reference to them all the way back in Halo 3:

L: The Mantle. You still hold to that [fairy tale] after all that has happened? After this thing has consumed a million worlds? Can't you see? Belief in the Mantle sealed our doom! Weakened our [protectorates], bred dependence and sloth. Our [so-called Guardianship] has stripped those we would keep safe of any capacity for self-defense!Were we such noble [Guardians] when we drew our line and abandoned billions to the parasite?

If their main form of attack is to disable all power-operated equipment within their reach rather than being capable of outright destruction, then it's significantly less far fetched to me. All Halo 5 mentions of them (aside from the Concussive blasts pre-slipspace and the EMP at the end) is that each one is capable of patrolling an entire solar system, which leaves the specific armaments very open to the imagination.

Of course, but then at the end of Halo 5 you see it using an EMP blast to take out all of what is presumebly Earth.

Of course, but then at the end of Halo 5 you see it using an EMP blast to take out all of what is presumebly Earth.

I know, I mentioned that. It just wasn't made clear if a Guardian had any other weaponry.

The Emergency Slipspace implied that either the UNSC Infinity wasn't confident their MAC rounds could do any damage, or charge up in time, which leaves room for speculation on the Structural integrity of a Guardian, and what we know of existing Forerunner tech with the Mantle's approach.

Of course, but then at the end of Halo 5 you see it using an EMP blast to take out all of what is presumebly Earth.

I know, I mentioned that. It just wasn't made clear if a Guardian had any other weaponry.

The Emergency Slipspace implied that either the UNSC Infinity wasn't confident their MAC rounds could do any damage, or charge up in time, which leaves room for speculation on the Structural integrity of a Guardian, and what we know of existing Forerunner tech with the Mantle's approach.

Honestly, there isn't much structural integrity to begin with. It's a giant archipelago of polygons held together by gravity fields. Damaging it with pinpoint shots like a MAC round I imagine would be tedious and difficult.

"You know that race that got completely demolished by the Flood, forcing them to commit a Galaxy-wide Genocide in order to protect all life from being infected? Well guess who has a few handfulls of enforcers that can each singlehandedly keep shit under control in an entire Solar System?"

Devices designed to only emit EMP bursts to combat and stifle troublesome emerging civilizations. Hell, if you still think their existence is dumb, then take a reference to them all the way back in Halo 3:

L: The Mantle. You still hold to that [fairy tale] after all that has happened? After this thing has consumed a million worlds? Can't you see? Belief in the Mantle sealed our doom! Weakened our [protectorates], bred dependence and sloth. Our [so-called Guardianship] has stripped those we would keep safe of any capacity for self-defense!Were we such noble [Guardians] when we drew our line and abandoned billions to the parasite?

If their main form of attack is to disable all power-operated equipment within their reach rather than being capable of outright destruction, then it's significantly less far fetched to me. All Halo 5 mentions of them (aside from the Concussive blasts pre-slipspace and the EMP at the end) is that each one is capable of patrolling an entire solar system, which leaves the specific armaments very open to the imagination.

Gotta agree with Zonda on this one, Admirals. I'm sure the forerunners didnt build 2 mile tall robot Phoenixes to protect the galaxy to only give then the ability to teleport and fart EMPs.

Also

Anyway, I've come to the conclusion Halo 6 will feature human enemies. 343i's laid the plot point that the UNSC no longer is the sole creator of Spartans, and that many mega-corporations dealing with the military industrial complex are more or less under Created control.

I thought it was only the new models of Mjolnir armor that were being made by private corperations. When was it said that they were producing Spartans as well?

But yeah I do suspect that we are going to see Created loyalists as sympathisers. Im convinced Cortana contacted Dasc and is using his cult for her own purposes.

Gotta agree with Zonda on this one, Admirals. I'm sure the forerunners didnt build 2 mile tall robot Phoenixes to protect the galaxy to only give then the ability to teleport and fart EMPs.

"Guardians had numerous roles and functions in service of the Mantle, but the primary one was the monitoring and subjugation of all local power networks. If necessary, Guardians could instantaneously neutralize these networks through a series of debilitating attenuation pulses. The deployment of multiple Guardians allowed the constructs to strategically coordinate their strike, rendering all but the most sophisticated foe completely inefficacious. This method of control was largely unchallenged."

I thought it was only the new models of Mjolnir armor that were being made by private corperations. When was it said that they were producing Spartans as well?

"Surreptitious recovery of Spartan tissue and organs, industrial espionage, independent research, and the release of some augmentation protocols for medical usage has substantially eroded the UNSC’s monopoly on super-soldiers. Though the knowledge and tools are now available for any sufficiently motivated (and wealthy) private party to replicate a Spartan-equivalent enhancement package, few see the need to match the recruiting standards and scope of enhancement afforded to UNSC Spartans – and are willing to settle for cheaper and more invasive augmentations with unknown medical drawbacks and psychological costs. Many of the gene therapies, artificial organ implants, and cybernetic enhancements used in the SPARTAN-IV program are also irreversible, with few within the military or government forecasting the impact these men and women will have when they leave military service and re-enter civilian life. It remains even more of an open question what will happen with potentially unstable, partially-augmented personnel that lack the training and support available to former Spartans."

"Story"

Surreptitious recovery of Spartan tissue and organs,

Oh shit, how'd this end up happening? Are people hunting spartans or something? Is someone at ONI letting this happen?

Surreptitious recovery of Spartan tissue and organs,

Oh shit, how'd this end up happening? Are people hunting spartans or something? Is someone at ONI letting this happen?

No, but if a Spartan falls in battle, I imagine its corpse will be of great medical interest. To the UNSC, or groups looking to reverse engineer Spartan augmentations.

Surreptitious recovery of Spartan tissue and organs,

Oh shit, how'd this end up happening? Are people hunting spartans or something? Is someone at ONI letting this happen?

No, but if a Spartan falls in battle, I imagine its corpse will be of great medical interest. To the UNSC, or groups looking to reverse engineer Spartan augmentations.

It's just that I's expect in the cases where a Spartan does end up dead it's usually not somewhere where recovery of said body is viable since a vast majority of the time those places end up exploding or being glassed not long afterward.

 By the way I havent listened to all of the Audiologs. What does that forerunner in the domain actualy say? anything important, and are there any other important audiologs?

Surreptitious recovery of Spartan tissue and organs,

Oh shit, how'd this end up happening? Are people hunting spartans or something? Is someone at ONI letting this happen?

No, but if a Spartan falls in battle, I imagine its corpse will be of great medical interest. To the UNSC, or groups looking to reverse engineer Spartan augmentations.

It's just that I's expect in the cases where a Spartan does end up dead it's usually not somewhere where recovery of said body is viable since a vast majority of the time those places end up exploding or being glassed not long afterward.

 By the way I havent listened to all of the Audiologs. What does that forerunner in the domain actualy say? anything important, and are there any other important audiologs?

Well, not very many glassings are being done in the post-war era.

As far as the Builder, the most interesting thing he says is that the Domain is burned but recovering, but the Organon is gone. The rest of his recordings are essentially regarding Bastion (with a few talking about Cortana and Warden).

Other than it being the worst Halo to date, what's there to discuss?

The story was shit

343 sucks

Fuck pizza skins

Making Cortana the villain along with the whole Created shit was the worst decision the writing team made with this game. It not only completely invalidated the events of Halo 4, but also the Human vs AI thing has been done to death in sci-fi before and I have no interest in it being in Halo.
The only redeeming part of the campaign for me was the Sanghelios arc and even then, that was incredibly underwhelming, and has been basically negated seeing as Sali 'Nyon now has his own Covenant fleet.

There should have been a more intense rivalry between John and Locke. I was expecting Locke to be this super-patriotic ONI operative but ONI doesn't get as much as a passing mention in this game. They have only one confrontation, and that confrontation is incredibly forced with John acting very out-of-character. There's no case of "which side do you root for" as Chief and Locke are basically trying to do the same thing.

Also, the Battle of Kamchatka was a shitty opening. We are given no indication as to who's fighting who or why the battle is happening. We just watch 4 random Spartans who we don't give a shit about flying around a battlefield we don't give a shit about.

Genesis isn't a particularly interesting planet. It could be, if the story was written to make it so.

The game doesn't feel like a sequel to Halo 4 at all. There's no continuation of anything set up by that game. The Didact is barely mentioned, and he should have been the antagonist of this game.

The quality of writing being complete shit. Cutscenes would always end before a conversation was about to start, the characterisation was poor, the Warden Eternal (and Cortana for that matter) were written as cliche, shitty cartoon villains.

A problem I have with 343i's Halo in general is it lacks the atmosphere and charisma of Bungie's games. Halo 4's SP sort of managed the atmosphere, but everything from Spartan Ops, to Halo 4's MP, to Escalation, to the entirety of Halo 5 has given off this weird SyFy-tier comic book feel that leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Which kinda makes sense seeing as Brian Reed is a comic book writer.

Fuck pizza skins

oh yeah and this

For the reason why Locke was hunting the chief to me this would be a far better reason than what we got. It strats off the same but when we catch up with the Chief this is what we see. The Chief ends up getting tricked into activating the guardians which Locke doesn't know, but he still see's him doing it. Before they can have their encounter they both end up getting separated and when Locke gets back up to the surface. He see's the guarding leaving and the whole colony is destroyed before anybody was able to make it out. Due to this along with the mass destruction on other human colonies he ends up having the hatred for the Chief we see in the trailer. 

For the reason why Locke was hunting the chief to me this would be a far better reason than what we got. It strats off the same but when we catch up with the Chief this is what we see. The Chief ends up getting tricked into activating the guardians which Locke doesn't know, but he still see's him doing it. Before they can have their encounter they both end up getting separated and when Locke gets back up to the surface. He see's the guarding leaving and the whole colony is destroyed before anybody was able to make it out. Due to this along with the mass destruction on other human colonies he ends up having the hatred for the Chief we see in the trailer.

It would've been even better if they'd have added Biko to the story so that all that business could have been pinned on him, too

"spesific"

spe|cif¦ic

For the reason why Locke was hunting the chief to me this would be a far better reason than what we got. It strats off the same but when we catch up with the Chief this is what we see. The Chief ends up getting tricked into activating the guardians which Locke doesn't know, but he still see's him doing it. Before they can have their encounter they both end up getting separated and when Locke gets back up to the surface. He see's the guarding leaving and the whole colony is destroyed before anybody was able to make it out. Due to this along with the mass destruction on other human colonies he ends up having the hatred for the Chief we see in the trailer.

It would've been even better if they'd have added Biko to the story so that all that business could have been pinned on him, too

It's sad that people can come up with something withing minutes which is a better story than what 343 did.

Fuck pizza skins

oh yeah and this

"spesific"

Are we really doing this shit? Why the fuck do I even try?

Are we really doing this shit? Why the fuck do I even try?

Fuck pizza skins

oh yeah and this

"spesific"

Are we really doing this shit? Why the fuck do I even try?

Welcome to Sep7agon, here's your free shitpost and guaranteed criticism.

There's a reason I don't post Halo threads here anymore.