Worst thing you've done to an animal?

challengerX · January 11, 2015, 06:11:45 AM

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Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 06:13:38 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 06:10:25 AM

No, I wouldn't be okay with that because I'm not a sociopath.
Animals being killed isn't at all the same as people being killed.

Says who?

This is why I'd like you to get hunted down and eaten, and see how you like it.

challengerX · January 11, 2015, 06:13:38 AM

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Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 06:20:52 AM

Quote from: challengerX on January 11, 2015, 06:11:45 AM

I don't care if somebody kills a cow I've never even seen that provides me with something to eat. Had I known the cow, I'd obviously feel different. If I had to kill animals myself every day to eat, I don't know if I could. I'd probably end up getting attached to all of them and wind up eating nuts, fruits, and vegetables.

See? There you go. That's a good... well, it's not a GREAT mentality, but it's a good mentality to be in. If you have to have familial attachments to animals to feel any empathy towards them, I think that's a problem, but at least you're capable of thinking, "Yeah, maybe this isn't right." I'm glad.

The difference between you and me here lies only with empathy. It doesn't matter to me if I don't know the animal personally--I still can't justify killing it if I have all the resources in the world. That's why I say, if you're okay with killing an animal for food, you should be okay with someone killing you for food. And I get so angry about it because I look around and all I see are people who are proud of their lack of empathy. And it disgusts me. It's revolting.

Quote

It's like when you see or hear about people dying and suffering across the world. You care, but you don't spend the rest of the day crying about it.

Right. So what's your point? I mean, I don't spend my time crying about the suffering of humans or animals, but I do speak up about it. I'm the only one who's really accounting for it. What's wrong with that?

Girl of Mystery · January 11, 2015, 06:22:00 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 06:13:38 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 06:10:25 AM
No, I wouldn't be okay with that because I'm not a sociopath.
Animals being killed isn't at all the same as people being killed.
Says who?

This is why I'd like you to get hunted down and eaten, and see how you like it.

Because it simply isn't.
A human life is more valuable than an animal. It's just the way things are.

That being said, if the animal being killed was my pet, then I'd care because I'm attatched to it.
I'm not attatched to sone random fucking cow that's somewhere around the world, which is why I don't care and why I eat meat.

You've only just stopped eating meat, so you're in no position to judge any of us on what we eat.

Girl of Mystery · January 11, 2015, 06:22:38 AM

Verbatim shitting up yet another thread.

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 06:25:33 AM

Quote from: challengerX on January 11, 2015, 06:13:38 AM

"Design" implies there's a designer.

Well, that's obviously not what I meant. I'm sorry, but I didn't invent the language. When I use words like "design," I mean to imply that they've underwent a series of complex changes throughout their evolutionary history such that they'd most efficiently be able to kill other animals without remorse for their own gain, so they can be the #1 predatory threat in their area. Because they fuck, but they're mammals, so they can't fuck too often to survive--they have to be carnivorous, heartless killing machines to be able to propagate and sustain their own species. They're not like frogs, giving birth to a hundred or so of their offspring. They've evolved with a different ecological strategy. That's what I'm talking about when I'm talking about design.

And still, I would argue that "evolution" is the "designer". It's not a person, it's a force of nature, but really, what difference does that make? It's a metaphor, for all intents and purposes.

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 06:27:32 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 06:22:00 AM

Because it simply isn't.
A human life is more valuable than an animal. It's just the way things are.

I don't accept your premise, at all. This will get nowhere if you can't come up with an actual reason.

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 06:22:38 AM

Verbatim shitting up yet another thread.

Really? I honestly feel like this has been a pretty good discussion, ignoring your inability to make an argument. Go ahead and stir more shit, though, hypocrite.

Girl of Mystery · January 11, 2015, 06:40:28 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 06:27:32 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 06:22:00 AM
Because it simply isn't.
A human life is more valuable than an animal. It's just the way things are.
I don't accept your premise, at all. This will get nowhere if you can't come up with an actual reason.

Okay. Here's a scenario.
A building is on fire, and there's 10 people and 10 pigs trapped inside. Which do you try and save?

Spoiler

If you say the pigs then you're morally backwards.

Quote

Really? I honestly feel like this has been a pretty good discussion, ignoring your inability to make an argument. Go ahead and stir more shit, though, hypocrite.

Except you have.
Saying hou hope multiple people in this thread get killed is you just spazzing out as usual and shitting up a thread because you're argument is shit and because you're a hypocrite.

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 06:44:58 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 06:40:28 AM

Okay. Here's a scenario.
A building is on fire, and there's 10 people and 10 pigs trapped inside. Which do you try and save?
Spoiler
If you say the pigs then you're morally backwards.

How is that a relevant scenario to veganism?

Oh right, it's not.

Quote

Saying hou hope multiple people in this thread get killed is you just spazzing out as usual and shitting up a thread because you're argument is shit and because you're a hypocrite.

I've demonstrated why I think you and those other people should get killed--it's simply a matter of reciprocation. You getting what you levy onto others. If you're okay with consuming sentient beings, and you see nothing at all wrong or reprehensible about torturing animals for our gain, I hope a sentient being tortures and consumes you. That's not "spazzing out". Not even a little bit. It's applying your OWN LOGIC to your garbage statements.

My argument isn't shit. I actually have an argument. You're just upset because I have more empathy than you. And you have no argument. "But I like to eat meat!" Tough.

clum clum · January 11, 2015, 06:46:17 AM

Oh boy.

Here.

We.

Go.

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 06:47:29 AM

...We've been going.

Girl of Mystery · January 11, 2015, 06:54:57 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 06:44:58 AM

You're just upset because I have more empathy than you.

I am? Okay.

You're just a hypocrite that's upset because I don't give a shit about some animals that I'm never ever going to see or even know existed until I'm eating it.
Why would and should I care about them? I have absolutely no reason to care.

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 06:57:30 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 06:54:57 AM

Why would and should I care about them? I have absolutely no reason to care.

Because you wouldn't want it to happen to you.

I wish I could italicize that enough.

Don't cry about it if someone much bigger and stronger and smarter than you hunts you down for someone else's food. And that's what you deserve to have happen to you, in my opinion, if you're going to say it's okay to treat animals like shit as long as you don't know the animal personally.

Girl of Mystery · January 11, 2015, 07:06:34 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 06:57:30 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 06:54:57 AM
Why would and should I care about them? I have absolutely no reason to care.
Because you wouldn't want it to happen to you.

Don't cry about it if someone much bigger and stronger and smarter than you hunts you down for someone else's food. And that's what you deserve to have happen to you, in my opinion, if you're going to say it's okay to treat animals like shit as long as you don't know the animal personally.

No such animal exists, so that'll never happen. And even if that was to happen, I still wouldn't care about some random cow or pig that I don't even know exists. I can't give a shit about something I don't know exists.
You're logic is incredibly shit.

It must be fun being edgy and autistic, huh?

Edit: I also never said it was okay to treat them like shit.
Don't put words in my mouth.

DAS B00T x2 · January 11, 2015, 07:08:01 AM

Quote from: Kiyohime on January 10, 2015, 10:31:18 PM

Quote from: Kinder Graham on January 10, 2015, 10:22:40 PM
I feel like Kiyo is trolling right now. Nobody can be this anti-cruelty among humans, be an animal lover, yet subject an animal to one of the most cruel forms of torture on the planet that was used against 6 million people
The only one to see through the bs, well done lol

As if my posts about eating it weren't indication enough...

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 07:09:25 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 07:06:34 AM

No such animal exists, so that'll never happen.

Again, not the point. You don't know if there's not aliens out there that will find this fucking planet and find your ass incredibly tasty. The chances of that happening are infinitesimally low, but that's not the point. The point is, it should. Happen.

clum clum · January 11, 2015, 07:09:30 AM

Explain to me what exactly is so wrong with us killing and eating animals?

We're animals, and other animals do it, too. Like a Lion mauling an antelope to death.

Except we do what humans do best, use tools and our brains to our advantage.

clum clum · January 11, 2015, 07:11:20 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 07:09:25 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 07:06:34 AM
No such animal exists, so that'll never happen.
Again, not the point. You don't know if there's not aliens out there that will find this fucking planet and find your ass incredibly tasty. The chances of that happening are infinitesimally low, but that's not the point. The point is, it should. Happen.

A hypothetical being from another planet would have a completely different chemistry to us. How would we even know it uses a metabolism? How would we even know it's a carbon based life form?

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 07:13:48 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 07:06:34 AM

Edit: I also never said it was okay to treat them like shit.
Don't put words in my mouth.

My entire fucking argument is that killing animals in order to eat them is mistreatment. Full-stop.

Quote from: Numb Digger on January 11, 2015, 07:09:30 AM

Explain to me what exactly is so wrong with us killing and eating animals?

Do you want to be killed and eaten?

No?

Then what gives you the right to eat animals? Do you think they're okay with it?

Quote

We're animals, and other animals do it, too. Like a Lion mauling an antelope to death.

Why should we be like the stupid animals? We have the capacity to be much smarter and more responsible and more graceful than that. You talk about this great intelligence that we have--why are you asking us to regress?

Quote

Except we do what humans do best, be gluttonous pieces of shit.

Yep.

DAS B00T x2 · January 11, 2015, 07:13:58 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 05:17:13 AM

The only execrable thing you've done is give your money to industries that slaughter and kill animals--the sort of thing you probably wouldn't do if you actually saw the cow you were about to eat getting brutally killed in front of you.

Can't be much different than having watched the venison that you're frying get decapitated and gutted.

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 07:15:46 AM

Quote from: Numb Digger on January 11, 2015, 07:11:20 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 07:09:25 AM
Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 07:06:34 AM
No such animal exists, so that'll never happen.
Again, not the point. You don't know if there's not aliens out there that will find this fucking planet and find your ass incredibly tasty. The chances of that happening are infinitesimally low, but that's not the point. The point is, it should. Happen.
A hypothetical being from another planet would have a completely different chemistry to us. How would we even know it uses a metabolism? How would we even know it's a carbon based life form?

Not the point.

What if they DID have the same chemistry?
Seriously, what kind of argumentation is that?

I'm not referring to any possibility--I'm referring to one specific type of possibility.

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 07:16:44 AM

Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on January 11, 2015, 07:13:58 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 05:17:13 AM
The only execrable thing you've done is give your money to industries that slaughter and kill animals--the sort of thing you probably wouldn't do if you actually saw the cow you were about to eat getting brutally killed in front of you.
Can't be much different than having watched the venison that you're frying get decapitated and gutted.

You're right, it isn't.

Isara · January 11, 2015, 07:17:07 AM

I watched a dog being dragged through the street and abused by some kids when I was younger. I regret to this day not doing anything at that time.

DAS B00T x2 · January 11, 2015, 07:18:07 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 07:16:44 AM

Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on January 11, 2015, 07:13:58 AM
Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 05:17:13 AM
The only execrable thing you've done is give your money to industries that slaughter and kill animals--the sort of thing you probably wouldn't do if you actually saw the cow you were about to eat getting brutally killed in front of you.
Can't be much different than having watched the venison that you're frying get decapitated and gutted.
You're right, it isn't.

Wonderful, then I'm golden.
Fetch me a cow and a .22, please. I want a flank steak.

Verbatim · January 11, 2015, 07:19:28 AM

Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on January 11, 2015, 07:18:07 AM

Wonderful, then I'm golden.
Fetch me a cow and a .22, please. I want a flank steak.

I'm saying it's just as bad, if not worse, but you know, whatever.

clum clum · January 11, 2015, 07:23:57 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 07:13:48 AM

Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 07:06:34 AM
Edit: I also never said it was okay to treat them like shit.
Don't put words in my mouth.
My entire fucking argument is that killing animals in order to eat them is mistreatment. Full-stop.

Quote from: Numb Digger on January 11, 2015, 07:09:30 AM
Explain to me what exactly is so wrong with us killing and eating animals?
Do you want to be killed and eaten?

No?

Then what gives you the right to eat animals? Do you think they're okay with it?
Quote
We're animals, and other animals do it, too. Like a Lion mauling an antelope to death.
Why should we be like the stupid animals? We have the capacity to be much smarter and more responsible and more graceful than that. You talk about this great intelligence that we have--why are you asking us to regress?
Quote
Except we do what humans do best, be gluttonous pieces of shit.
Yep.

That fish getting chomped in half by a shark isn't okay with it. That protozoa being consumed by an amoeba isn't okay with it. That cow thrown into a grinder to make us food isn't okay with it. And I fail to see why it regresses our intelligence, either.

Just because we have the capacity to kill only plants instead of animals doesn't mean that we have to. I'd actually like to enjoy my meals, you know?

We are naturally gluttonous, just like every other organism. And nothing will ever change that.

clum clum · January 11, 2015, 07:26:26 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 07:15:46 AM

Quote from: Numb Digger on January 11, 2015, 07:11:20 AM
Quote from: Verbatim on January 11, 2015, 07:09:25 AM
Quote from: BritishLemön on January 11, 2015, 07:06:34 AM
No such animal exists, so that'll never happen.
Again, not the point. You don't know if there's not aliens out there that will find this fucking planet and find your ass incredibly tasty. The chances of that happening are infinitesimally low, but that's not the point. The point is, it should. Happen.
A hypothetical being from another planet would have a completely different chemistry to us. How would we even know it uses a metabolism? How would we even know it's a carbon based life form?
Not the point.

What if they DID have the same chemistry?
Seriously, what kind of argumentation is that?

I'm not referring to any possibility--I'm referring to one specific type of possibility.

It kind of eliminates the possibility. An organism from another planet, another planet would be so drastically different that we couldn't even begin to imagine it. It would have evolved (or maybe even something else) completely separate from us. So I fail to see why it would even entertain the thought of consuming organisms from another planet.

challengerX · January 11, 2015, 07:29:32 AM

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challengerX · January 11, 2015, 07:31:53 AM

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