except the concept of egalitarianism extends beyond gender

you only have to be human

yes, but my point is that egalitarianism is a big puzzle, and feminism and masculism are two of its pieces

no two pieces are more important than the other, but they are ALL needed to complete the puzzle

so, if you're an egalitarian, that means you are also a feminist, masculist--all of the above

i don't understand why people have trouble with this--maybe it's pride, or fear of association or something

Wiser words have never been said. I don't divulge in pornography, but I'll get to work to fill in the gaps for those who do

you don't indulge in pornography

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:01:40 AM

Wiser words have never been said. I don't divulge in pornography, but I'll get to work to fill in the gaps for those who do

you don't indulge in pornography

I've always been told that using divulge like that was correct

Quote from: Casper on June 21, 2016, 12:51:31 AM

Oh yeah such new ideas as #KillAllMen and #MasculinitySoFragile.  Feminism has gotten worse, and is mostly used to push in favor of women more than equality, and then they cry sexism if you disagree.  If feminists really want to help subjugated women, they should look outside of the US and help those really in need.

not all of them have the know-how or wherewithal to do so, and some of them are actively doing that

it's easy to pick on hyperbolic hashtags like #KillAllMen and pretend as though feminists actually want to kill all men, but that that tends to fall right apart when you realize that, "oh, they don't actually want to kill all men, it's just an expression"

please give an example of modern feminists trying to push women in society above men

For one, pushing for increase of pay for women's soccer, where women's and men's soccer aren't comparable because of how economics work. 

yea i agree femenism has been a good thing overall but people that think they can just flip sexual dynamics completely are just deluded in my opinion

might makes right and since men will always be physically stronger than women our society wont change on a whole. 

Quote from: Tyger on June 21, 2016, 01:03:33 AM

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:00:51 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on June 21, 2016, 12:59:05 AM

but yeah BC, the wage gap has been thoroughly debunked

there are places of work where women get paid $0.07 less than men--that's verified, and that's a problem, but it's not the huge travesty that a lot of uninformed people believe it is

Yet I know people where the case is not that

anecdotal and irrelevant.

Quote

My point about the women's national team pay compared to the men's national team pay is a huge issue however

no it's not

It actually is, because of all the issues that come with it. Look up an article about it, it's a pretty big deal

they don't deserve to be paid more if they get a mere fraction of the tv viewership, which also leads to smaller prize pools.

Sports players are entertainers, it's as simple as that, Just like an actor or a singer you get paid based on how much money you can make the people writing the checks

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:08:36 AM

Quote from: Tyger on June 21, 2016, 01:03:33 AM

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:00:51 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on June 21, 2016, 12:59:05 AM

but yeah BC, the wage gap has been thoroughly debunked

there are places of work where women get paid $0.07 less than men--that's verified, and that's a problem, but it's not the huge travesty that a lot of uninformed people believe it is

Yet I know people where the case is not that

anecdotal and irrelevant.

Quote

My point about the women's national team pay compared to the men's national team pay is a huge issue however

no it's not

It actually is, because of all the issues that come with it. Look up an article about it, it's a pretty big deal

they don't deserve to be paid more if they get a mere fraction of the tv viewership, which also leads to smaller prize pools.

Sports players are entertainers, it's as simple as that, Just like an actor or a singer you get paid based on how much money you can make the people writing the checks

Im fairly certain they get larger turn outs and viewers.

I've always been told that using divulge like that was correct

divulge means to bring up a subject reluctantly, or to reveal sensitive information

so, if you were to talk about what types of porn you watch, you would be divulging

Feminists don't have to fight for the rights of the men and vice versa

If you're for all equal I'd say it's rather you want everyone to have the same slice of the pie as opposed to making sure your own half isn't any less than the other, and you wouldn't have a problem if you had a larger piece either

You could say you're a feminist while women are "oppressed" or the other when the situation calls for it but you cannot be both at the same time

sure you can

look at this way--if you're not a feminist, going by its most fundamental definition, that means you believe that  women should not have all the same rights as men; that they should be societally lesser than men

now, if that's what you believe, you cannot be an egalitarian--period, because you're not treating all humans as equals

the thing about egalitarians is that they do believe that women should have all the rights that human beings ought to have

which is, uh, feminist

i'm working with fundamental definitions, and you're working with... i don't even know, to be honest

Quote from: Tyger on June 21, 2016, 01:15:16 AM

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:08:36 AM

Quote from: Tyger on June 21, 2016, 01:03:33 AM

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:00:51 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on June 21, 2016, 12:59:05 AM

but yeah BC, the wage gap has been thoroughly debunked

there are places of work where women get paid $0.07 less than men--that's verified, and that's a problem, but it's not the huge travesty that a lot of uninformed people believe it is

Yet I know people where the case is not that

anecdotal and irrelevant.

Quote

My point about the women's national team pay compared to the men's national team pay is a huge issue however

no it's not

It actually is, because of all the issues that come with it. Look up an article about it, it's a pretty big deal

they don't deserve to be paid more if they get a mere fraction of the tv viewership, which also leads to smaller prize pools.

Sports players are entertainers, it's as simple as that, Just like an actor or a singer you get paid based on how much money you can make the people writing the checks

Im fairly certain they get larger turn outs and viewers.

they dont. Look it up, all those claims were during and right after their World Cup win. Of course more people will watch them after that. But that's not the norm. Also that claim that the women's team made 4x more was proven bogus

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:09:31 AM

I've always been told that using divulge like that was correct

divulge means to bring up a subject reluctantly, or to reveal sensitive information

so, if you were to talk about what types of porn you watch, you would be divulging

Quote from: 🇵🇪🇵🇸🇮™ on June 21, 2016, 01:09:42 AM

Feminists don't have to fight for the rights of the men and vice versa

If you're for all equal I'd say it's rather you want everyone to have the same slice of the pie as opposed to making sure your own half isn't any less than the other, and you wouldn't have a problem if you had a larger piece either

You could say you're a feminist while women are "oppressed" or the other when the situation calls for it but you cannot be both at the same time

sure you can

look at this way--if you're not a feminist, going by its most fundamental definition, that means you believe that  women should not have all the same rights as men; that they should be societally lesser than men

now, if that's what you believe, you cannot be an egalitarian--period, because you're not treating all humans as equals

the thing about egalitarians is that they do believe that women should have all the rights that human beings ought to have

which is, uh, feminist

i'm working with fundamental definitions, and you're working with... i don't even know, to be honest

Huh, and to think teachers and coworkers have told me it was correct

Quote from: Casper on June 21, 2016, 01:09:45 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on June 21, 2016, 12:56:17 AM

Quote from: Casper on June 21, 2016, 12:51:31 AM

Oh yeah such new ideas as #KillAllMen and #MasculinitySoFragile.  Feminism has gotten worse, and is mostly used to push in favor of women more than equality, and then they cry sexism if you disagree.  If feminists really want to help subjugated women, they should look outside of the US and help those really in need.

not all of them have the know-how or wherewithal to do so, and some of them are actively doing that

it's easy to pick on hyperbolic hashtags like #KillAllMen and pretend as though feminists actually want to kill all men, but that that tends to fall right apart when you realize that, "oh, they don't actually want to kill all men, it's just an expression"

please give an example of modern feminists trying to push women in society above men

For one, pushing for increase of pay for women's soccer, where women's and men's soccer aren't comparable because of how economics work.

The women's team brought in more then 4x the amount of money for the American FA then the Men's team.

Not including overall success.

But the industry as a whole is less profitable than men's.

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:16:18 AM

Quote from: Tyger on June 21, 2016, 01:15:16 AM

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:08:36 AM

Quote from: Tyger on June 21, 2016, 01:03:33 AM

Quote from: BC on June 21, 2016, 01:00:51 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on June 21, 2016, 12:59:05 AM

but yeah BC, the wage gap has been thoroughly debunked

there are places of work where women get paid $0.07 less than men--that's verified, and that's a problem, but it's not the huge travesty that a lot of uninformed people believe it is

Yet I know people where the case is not that

anecdotal and irrelevant.

Quote

My point about the women's national team pay compared to the men's national team pay is a huge issue however

no it's not

It actually is, because of all the issues that come with it. Look up an article about it, it's a pretty big deal

they don't deserve to be paid more if they get a mere fraction of the tv viewership, which also leads to smaller prize pools.

Sports players are entertainers, it's as simple as that, Just like an actor or a singer you get paid based on how much money you can make the people writing the checks

Im fairly certain they get larger turn outs and viewers.

they dont. Look it up. Also that claim that the women's team made 4x more was proven bogus

Mate

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/data-how-does-the-u-s-womens-soccer-team-pay-compare-to-the-men/

Quote from: Casper on June 21, 2016, 01:09:45 AM

For one, pushing for increase of pay for women's soccer, where women's and men's soccer aren't comparable because of how economics work.

neither of them should be paid anything because getting paid to play a sport is a fucking joke

Well regardless of what you think, they get paid for it based on what boils down to supply and demand, and does not equate to equal pay between two separate industries.

Quote from: Verbatim on June 21, 2016, 01:20:44 AM

Quote from: Casper on June 21, 2016, 01:09:45 AM

For one, pushing for increase of pay for women's soccer, where women's and men's soccer aren't comparable because of how economics work.

neither of them should be paid anything because getting paid to play a sport is a fucking joke

Well regardless of what you think, they get paid for it based on what boils down to supply and demand, and does not equate to equal pay between two separate industries.

supply & demand is also a joke, and a very antiquated one at that

Quote from: Casper on June 21, 2016, 01:26:55 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on June 21, 2016, 01:20:44 AM

Quote from: Casper on June 21, 2016, 01:09:45 AM

For one, pushing for increase of pay for women's soccer, where women's and men's soccer aren't comparable because of how economics work.

neither of them should be paid anything because getting paid to play a sport is a fucking joke

Well regardless of what you think, they get paid for it based on what boils down to supply and demand, and does not equate to equal pay between two separate industries.

supply & demand is also a joke, and a very antiquated one at that

...how?