Star Wars Question: Why is Return of the Jedi considered the Worst?

Nick McIntyre · November 28, 2014, 01:01:58 AM

I've seen many people accuse Return of the Jedi for being the worst Star Wars movie of the original trilogy. I want to know why you think so.

To me, Empire (considered the greatest Star Wars movie in the history of ever) was long and boring as shit. I didn't mind the Jedi training bits and the Han/Leia chemistry was pretty good, but the movie was just paced so slowly you could fall asleep. After a huge, adrenaline-pumping opening sequence, the rest of the movie just seemed to drag as if it put all its energy into the beginning and end of the movie while half-assing the middle.

Return seemed to have that near-perfect mix of action, story, and character development. I can understand people hating the Ewoks as a "Children's marketing ploy", but Lucas was pretty much all about the money at that point anyway. I thought it had a great pacing to it, a solid opening and a nice closure at the end of the movie. Palpatine was fucking wicked and the Vader/Luke fight was one of the best fights in all of Star Wars. It didn't need flashy techno-dance kung-fu moves, it had a powerful story between father and son backing it up.

Discuss.

Septy · November 28, 2014, 01:03:18 AM

After how dark the series got in The Empire Strikes Back it made Return of the Jedi laughable.

Casper · November 28, 2014, 01:03:29 AM

My gripe with VI is the ending. That's all I can really think of.
Still better than III.

R o c k e t · November 28, 2014, 01:09:10 AM

I was a kid so I didn't dislike any of the movies at the time.

But now I like Return of the Jedi the most. Empire strikes Back doesn't have as many of my favorite scenes in it, and as you said: its rather slow.

The fight between Luke and Vader in RotJ was AMAZING

The Lord Slide Rule · November 28, 2014, 01:25:13 AM

Ewoks go to hell.
Endor holocaust best day of my life.

Mat Cauthon · November 28, 2014, 01:28:34 AM

I prefer Empire because it has some amazing scenes, not that Jedi doesn't.
But Empire just has something more to it. I haven't watched the mobies in a while.

Maybe I'll go refresh my memory.

Juuzou · November 28, 2014, 02:10:21 AM

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Jono · November 28, 2014, 02:16:50 AM

Return of the Jedi has Admiral Ackbar and he says one of the most memorable lines in all of cinema history.

Mordo · November 28, 2014, 05:17:29 AM

Really? You didn't find the Ewoks or the weak opening scene detracting from the movie at all?

I mean, I love it too, but I don't think you really got Empire if you think RotJ is better than Empire. The only thing that really salvages RotJ is the the third act of the film minus the Ewoks magically fucking up the Empire. ETB was fantastic throughout.

Chakas · November 28, 2014, 05:30:21 AM

The change of tone, absurdly ridiculous choreography, over-use of greenscreen, childish colors and humor, and plot holes might have something to do with it.

challengerX · November 28, 2014, 05:32:22 AM

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BaconShelf · November 28, 2014, 05:41:46 AM

I thought ANH was the worst. Didn't really get going until the last 45 minutes. RoTJ was the lite-wookies for me (Original plans were for it to be on Kashyyyk too) and that whole Jabba ordeal that overstayed its welcome.

BaconShelf · November 28, 2014, 05:45:37 AM

Quote from: The First Noelle on November 28, 2014, 02:10:21 AM

I have never heard of anyone calling it the worst in the original trilogy, that would have to be A New Hope. Not that any of the films are bad, but A New Hope was the slowest and most predictable, which is not bad. Still an amazing movie, and Empire is the greatest Star Wars film, and likely always will be. Jedi had some kinda ridiculous scenes, especially with the Ewoks, but that final space battle is one of the best to ever be in a movie.

As much as people hate the prequels, I have to say that the Battle of Coruscant was the best space battle in the entire series. The prequels were great for their battle scenes and lightsaber duels, though lacking elsewhere (Geonosis remains my favourite battle in the entire series, unless Umbara from TCW counts)

Anonymous (User Deleted) · November 28, 2014, 08:24:07 AM

-Ewoks on Endor instead of Wookiees on Kashyyyk
-A derivative second Death Star as opposed to, you know, the Super Star Destroyer Executor that was hyped up in Empire to replace the Death Star
-Luke and Leia being siblings
-The acting generally not being as good as it was in Empire
-Boba Fett becomes a punchline
-Generally not as emotionally deep as Empire, although Luke vs. Vader was the exception
-No female pilots (they never made it into the final edit)
-Lucas' insistence on selling out ('no kid wants to buy a dead Han figure') meaning Gary Kurtz was left out in the cold; Star Wars became what it was because of both of them, and some of Kurtz's objections were the same points I listed above

It's closer to ANH than Empire in terms of artistic merit. Otherwise, it's still really good. The effects are stellar as always, we get a sort of prison break, speeder bike chase, space battle, lightsaber battle, more Lando, Ian McDiarmid's wonderfully hammy acting--it's a lot of what we've already come to expect from Star Wars. It's by no means a terrible movie, but it is bad in that it seemingly didn't even try to reach the high bar set by Empire.

Mega Sceptile · November 28, 2014, 08:39:12 AM

>No info on wookie rebellion AT ALL
>No Super Star Destroyer
>Death Star II Electric Boogaloo
>Ewok stupid bear things
>Hammy as shit ending with vader turning to a force ghost
>"Redemption of the anti-hero" troupe
>Han didn't die because of merchandising
>Boba Fett a joke

More Than Mortal · November 28, 2014, 09:59:48 AM

It was a completely retarded change of tone in comparison to Empire.