Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 09:50:32 AM

if you can sit through a game of thrones book, you have the attention span of a 10 year old

I've read longer books and better. Although being a better writer than Martin isn't much of an accomplishment. He's in the same class as Eddings, Feist and Jordan. Mass-produced fantasy dreck. You can practically hear the hum of the conveyor belt behind each page. You're basically an overgrown 10 year old if you can sit through what is essentially a trashy goosebumps-caliber fantasy-cum-days-of-our-lives saga. I mean shit, you might as well be reading something like this: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3251066-unicorn-bride ...at least it knows it's trash.

I am sorry to offend you, kiddies. To be honest I'm happy that you read at all. But there are different classes of writer, and Martin is of a lower tier. Real talk.

Spoiler

also sorry foxby, you were right, this thread is ok

fox clan continues to triumph

Quote from: Comet on April 08, 2015, 10:11:18 AM

Elegiac, no. bad. stop. you cannot talk about "the hum of the conveyor belt of mass-produced fantasy dreck" then put (presumably) Robert Jordan on a pedestal. the man has 14 goddamn books for the same series.

You maybe might want to read what I said again then. Bad Comet. Reading comprehension

i wonder what sorts of credentials you have to justify holding such a lofty position

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 10:28:38 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:24:30 AM

i wonder what sorts of credentials you have to justify holding such a lofty position

*shrugs*

I'm well read, and I've been reading and writing since my early childhood. I'm a paid poet and I'm currently working on the first of my own series of books.

But in simple terms, wouldn't a sausage expert be able to recognise a superior sausage? Same deal.

thats what i figured.

and yes, a sausage expert would be able to do that. but not a sausage enthusiast. a sausage enthusiast has no formal training and simply thinks that their personal experience/expectations dictate objective worth, and as such, he will be implicitly biased and his judgement will be rendered impotent. get what im saying?

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 10:45:09 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:33:31 AM

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 10:28:38 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:24:30 AM

i wonder what sorts of credentials you have to justify holding such a lofty position

*shrugs*

I'm well read, and I've been reading and writing since my early childhood. I'm a paid poet and I'm currently working on the first of my own series of books.

But in simple terms, wouldn't a sausage expert be able to recognise a superior sausage? Same deal.

thats what i figured.

and yes, a sausage expert would be able to do that. but not a sausage enthusiast. a sausage enthusiast has no formal training and simply thinks that their personal experience/expectations dictate objective worth, and as such, he will be implicitly biased and his judgement will be rendered impotent. get what im saying?

I've studied poetry, english, philosophy and journalism at University. I deferred my courses in mid 2010 because I wasn't enjoying it, or learning anything that I couldn't teach myself/already knew/know; but before I left I passed every assessment I was given. You shouldn't set too much store in formal degrees when it comes to writing. These things are helpful, of course, but natural ability and self-teaching can easily take their place.

What are your qualifications?

im a historian. my field is intimately tied to literature and ive spent more time poring through manuscripts than id care to repeat.

ill let you off the hook though. this isnt productive.

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 11:01:27 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:48:24 AM

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 10:45:09 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:33:31 AM

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 10:28:38 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:24:30 AM

i wonder what sorts of credentials you have to justify holding such a lofty position

*shrugs*

I'm well read, and I've been reading and writing since my early childhood. I'm a paid poet and I'm currently working on the first of my own series of books.

But in simple terms, wouldn't a sausage expert be able to recognise a superior sausage? Same deal.

thats what i figured.

and yes, a sausage expert would be able to do that. but not a sausage enthusiast. a sausage enthusiast has no formal training and simply thinks that their personal experience/expectations dictate objective worth, and as such, he will be implicitly biased and his judgement will be rendered impotent. get what im saying?

I've studied poetry, english, philosophy and journalism at University. I deferred my courses in mid 2010 because I wasn't enjoying it, or learning anything that I couldn't teach myself/already knew/know; but before I left I passed every assessment I was given. You shouldn't set too much store in formal degrees when it comes to writing. These things are helpful, of course, but natural ability and self-teaching can easily take their place.

What are your qualifications?

im a historian. my field is intimately tied to literature and ive spent more time poring through manuscripts than id care to repeat.

ill let you off the hook though. this isnt productive.

I'm not on a hook and you know it, if you really have the literary bent that you say you do I'm only here to shit stir anyway. I can dislike Martin's writing, but art is subjective up to a point. He may seem like a Shakespearean genius to you.  But for me, he can be as grammatically correct as he likes, (or whatever merits you're judging him on) but that won't make his mind or his penmanship any more eloquent.

Anyway, I just finished this the other day: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/86745.A_History_of_the_Byzantine_State_and_Society

I like History, what sorts of things are you doing at the moment?

ill give you a pass on martin. he cant appeal to everyone.

that looks like a neat book. byzantine history is really cool. ive always been intrigued by Justinian, because his eccentric ways gave us so much cool art. gotta love the byzantine obsession with gold in their art, gaudy fuckers that they were.

right now, im critiquing a book on masculinity in america and working on a research project about the american homefront/domesticity during WWII.

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 11:12:44 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 11:07:20 AM

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 11:01:27 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:48:24 AM

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 10:45:09 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:33:31 AM

Quote from: Elegiac on April 08, 2015, 10:28:38 AM

Quote from: Azumarill on April 08, 2015, 10:24:30 AM

i wonder what sorts of credentials you have to justify holding such a lofty position

*shrugs*

I'm well read, and I've been reading and writing since my early childhood. I'm a paid poet and I'm currently working on the first of my own series of books.

But in simple terms, wouldn't a sausage expert be able to recognise a superior sausage? Same deal.

thats what i figured.

and yes, a sausage expert would be able to do that. but not a sausage enthusiast. a sausage enthusiast has no formal training and simply thinks that their personal experience/expectations dictate objective worth, and as such, he will be implicitly biased and his judgement will be rendered impotent. get what im saying?

I've studied poetry, english, philosophy and journalism at University. I deferred my courses in mid 2010 because I wasn't enjoying it, or learning anything that I couldn't teach myself/already knew/know; but before I left I passed every assessment I was given. You shouldn't set too much store in formal degrees when it comes to writing. These things are helpful, of course, but natural ability and self-teaching can easily take their place.

What are your qualifications?

im a historian. my field is intimately tied to literature and ive spent more time poring through manuscripts than id care to repeat.

ill let you off the hook though. this isnt productive.

I'm not on a hook and you know it, if you really have the literary bent that you say you do I'm only here to shit stir anyway. I can dislike Martin's writing, but art is subjective up to a point. He may seem like a Shakespearean genius to you.  But for me, he can be as grammatically correct as he likes, (or whatever merits you're judging him on) but that won't make his mind or his penmanship any more eloquent.

Anyway, I just finished this the other day: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/86745.A_History_of_the_Byzantine_State_and_Society

I like History, what sorts of things are you doing at the moment?

ill give you a pass on martin. he cant appeal to everyone.

that looks like a neat book. byzantine history is really cool. ive always been intrigued by Justinian, because his eccentric ways gave us so much cool art. gotta love the byzantine obsession with gold in their art, gaudy fuckers that they were.

right now, im critiquing a book on masculinity in america and working on a research project about the american homefront/domesticity during WWII.

Neat. Thanks for the pass, hahaha. Christ, I'm letting Fox Clan down, I'm supposed to be being obnoxious here. Are you actually a doctor or professor of history or whatever? How old are you?

Have you ever read Guy Gavriel Kay? He might appeal to a historian.

no, just a devoted student. im a junior in college, patiently awaiting the day i am released from my academic obligations so that i can pursue my own literary interests. im much more interested in philosophy/religion/aspects of culture than i am in political/military history, so theres no chance that ill pursue a postgrad history degree. my plan is to finish the bachelors and then get into a library science program, and after that i want to seal myself away in a library for the rest of my life.

ive never heard of that guy, but youve piqued my interest. are any of his works in the public domain?

elegiac what do you think is good fantasy?