Josh McIntosh - "5 Ways Men Can Help End Sexism"

 
Verbatim
| Komm, süßer Tod
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: Verbatim-1
Steam: Jaco230
ID: Verbatim
IP: Logged

48,046 posts
TRIGGER WARNING:
This video contains feminism. If you are a small-minded bigot or misogynist, proceed with caution.



YouTube

Quote
TRANSCRIPT

For many men, it can be hard to know exactly what role we can or should play in working towards an end to sexism.

How can men help; and how much or how little should we be helping? In this video we will explore answers to those questions and share a few suggestions for how men can respectfully approach feminism and – critically – explain why it’s beneficial for men to be involved.

First things first, because there’s so much misinformation about feminism floating around out there in the cultural aether, it’s useful to quickly define what that term actually means. Feminism is a sociopolitical movement with the central goal of ending sexism and dismantling gender-based oppression. So contrary to common misconceptions, feminism is not about “man hating” or “female supremacy.” It’s important to note that the feminist endeavor, as it has been defined by women like bell hooks, does not simply seek equal access for women within current systems of power, instead it seeks to transform these systems of power and the values associated with them.

So where do men fit into all this? Well, women have long been pointing out the ways in which men can benefit from feminism and actively calling for men’s participation in working towards ending sexism.

As bell hooks writes in her landmark book Feminist Theory: From Margin to Center, “Like women, men have been socialized to passively accept sexist ideology. While they need not blame themselves for accepting sexism, they must assume responsibility for eliminating it. [. . .] Men are not exploited or oppressed by sexism, but there are ways in which they suffer as a result of it.” That bears repeating: “Men are NOT exploited or oppressed by sexism, but there are ways in which WE suffer as a result of it.”

We are taught early on that “boys don’t cry,” that to show sensitivity or emotional vulnerability is a sign of weakness. Men are discouraged from practicing nurturing, caregiving, compassion and compromise for the same reason. So there is an enormous amount of pressure placed on men to “prove our manhood” by acting tough, projecting strength and repressing our emotions so as to appear in control at all times. This is compounded by the fact that men are often more admired for being aggressive, dominant and violent than for being cooperative, vulnerable or empathetic. Not only is all of this damaging behavior encouraged in individual men, but those same values are also reflected in our larger political and military institutions, often to disastrous effect.

So while men, as a group, are afforded gender-based privileges at the expense of women, a byproduct of patriarchy is that it also causes real harm to men’s well being.

OK so if we’re on board with ending sexism: what specifically can we do as men to be helpful? Here’s our quick list of 5 tips for respectfully engaging with feminism as a man.

1. Listen to women: It might seem obvious, but too often men have a hard time just listening to what women have to say – and respecting women’s knowledge and experiences. Because of the way we’re socialized to think our voices are most important, men have a tendency to interrupt and interject ourselves into conversations and then dominate those interactions. This behavior is so ingrained that men often don’t even realize we are doing it. Which is why it’s critical to consciously learn to take a step back – to try not to interrupt and instead actively listen and absorb what is being said before responding. Now, of course, this does not then mean that you have to agree with everything every individual woman says – no one person’s perspective can ever represent all of feminism or the experiences of all women – it simply means that, as men, we’re not in a position to define feminism for women, and so, we should actively pay attention to women’s voices. Because for so long women’s experiences, perspectives and ideas – have been dismissed, ignored and silenced.

It’s especially vital to listen to women of color, particularly black and indigenous women, because as feminist scholars have long pointed out, sexism is compounded when it’s combined with racism and/or other forms of oppression – back in 1989, Kimberlé Crenshaw coined the term “intersectionality” as part of her theory to describe these layered experiences that leave some women more disenfranchised by than others.

2. Educate yourself: It’s important for us, as men, to acknowledge that when we talk about feminism, we follow the lead of women. Yet while we should acknowledge that our ideas in this arena originate with women, this does not mean it is the responsibility of women to teach all men about sexism. So we shouldn’t go around interrogating or demanding answers from women. As men, we should instead be proactive in doing the work ourselves by committing to continuous, lifelong learning. Luckily for us, over the past century feminist scholars have written volumes on the topic. So with that in mind here are some suggested readings about feminism and how patriarchy operates as a social system:

Feminism is for Everybody by bell hooks is a good place to start, though definitely put The Will to Change: Men, Masculinity and Love at the top of your list. Sociologist Allan G Johnson’s book The Gender Knot: Unraveling Our Patriarchal Legacy is also essential reading. As well as This Bridge Called My Back edited by Cherríe Moraga and Gloria E. Anzaldúa. For those interesting reading something written in more academic language check out: Masculinities by R.W. Connell and her follow up The Men and the Boys.

3. Challenge other men on sexism: The place where men can be most helpful in regards to feminism is first within ourselves, and then amongst other men. Patriarchy encourages men to buy into sexist thinking and at the very least remain complacent in sexism through our silence. So instead step off the path of least resistance and dare to make yourself and other men uncomfortable about sexism. Let other men around you know that their sexist behavior is not ok. For example, when you stand up and say that a sexist joke is not funny the men telling the sexist joke can no longer be assured that they will go unchallenged the next time they tell it. In other words, those men can no longer count on other men to accept or go along with their sexism. Interrupting the sexist status quo is a simple yet powerful thing that all men can make a difference.

4. Don’t get defensive: If you make a comment and a woman dismisses or disagrees with you, don’t take it personally. She doesn’t owe you anything and her disagreement does not necessarily mean that she herself is angry or frustrated with you as an individual. That being said, it is completely understandable for women to express anger about sexism. Sexism should make everyone angry. After all, most women have firsthand experience with violence, harassment or mistreatment at the hands of men. Sometimes even from men who claim to be allies. So don’t get defensive if individual women don’t want to engage with you, and remember that it’s definitely not our job to police the ways women may choose to speak up about sexism or their experiences. Men’s support of feminism should not be seen as some kind of favor to women. As we have discussed, dismantling the system of sexism benefits people of all genders, and moreover, men shouldn’t expect a reward for deciding not to participate in a terrible system of oppression. Or as many feminist women have said before – you don’t get a cookie for being a decent human being.

5. Learn from your mistakes: It’s really hard to break years of socialization overnight, so messing up is inevitable. I’ve certainly made my fair share of mistakes, the key is what you do next. We always have a choice as to how we respond to our mistakes: be humble, examine your own actions, acknowledge failings and continue to learn how to be better and more supportive. Sexism is not necessarily something that’s done consciously and overtly, it’s something we are socialized to think is normal, and as such it is something we often perpetuate and participate in without meaning to. This is why challenging ourselves and reflecting on our own actions is a vital step in the process but remember to be compassionate and patient with yourself and keep working at it!

That was by no means an exhaustive list of advice, but it should give you a place to start.

Now if you’re feeling a little uneasy at this point that might actually be a good sign. As men, the process of honestly reexamining our own assumptions and questioning our participation in a system that maintains sexism, may often feel uncomfortable. But remember that even though we as individuals didn’t create that system of patriarchy, it does manifest itself in almost every aspect of our lives. Which means we do have a responsibility to challenge it.  We must always recall our own potential for positive impact in the world. And be involved in this work not out of personal guilt or shame, but because, as we have discussed in this video, the desired outcome is ending gender oppression and in so doing make the world better for people of all genders including men.

Figured it was about time to piss some of the misogynists here off again.

Last Edit: December 02, 2015, 11:46:13 AM by Verbatim


 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
Quote
TRIGGER WARNING:
This video contains feminism. If you are a small-minded bigot or misogynist, proceed with caution.

That's nice, dear.


Thun | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam: Thunder
ID: Suarez
IP: Logged

8,991 posts
 
lol the dude in the video even looks like a typical mangina


Mordo | Mythic Invincible!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Madman Mordo
IP: Logged

7,244 posts
emigrate or degenerate. the choice is yours


 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
Quote
For example, when you stand up and say that a sexist joke is not funny the men telling the sexist joke can no longer be assured that they will go unchallenged the next time they tell it.

tbh that's a good way to get punched in the UK


 
Sandtrap
| Mythic Sage
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Sandtrap
IP: Logged

11,702 posts
Rockets on my X
"Men are not exploited or oppressed"

At which point the article goes on to explain how societal norms damage guys or limit in them in their capacity. Just a little bit of a contradiction there.

But, speaking of feminism, me and my sister had an interesting discussion a little while back Verb. We were both talking about how the stay at home mom deal is kind of villainized now, by the forgive my generalization "I don't need no man" kind of mindset that's more predominant in women these days.

It seems like they're brushing off the traditional old values and roles and demonizing them, while forgetting that at the same time, people can choose to live in that style or role if they want to.
Last Edit: December 02, 2015, 11:45:44 AM by Snowtrap


 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
and final post

hilarious and original joke time

How many feminists does it take to change a lightbulb?
Spoiler
none because they can't change anything xdddddddddddddddddddddd


 
Verbatim
| Komm, süßer Tod
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: Verbatim-1
Steam: Jaco230
ID: Verbatim
IP: Logged

48,046 posts

Thank you for reminding me that his preferred name is "Josh".


 
Sandtrap
| Mythic Sage
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Sandtrap
IP: Logged

11,702 posts
Rockets on my X
Rolling on psyche's theme here.

The match has been lit.

The pins have been pulled.

The shells have been loaded.

MLG airhorns are at the ready.

I bet when I come back later on in the evening this thread's gonna be a fucking trip to read through.


N/A | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Zenmaster
IP: Logged

7,823 posts
 
This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.


 
𝑺𝒆𝒄𝒐𝒏𝒅𝑪𝒍𝒂𝒔𝒔
| 𝑪𝒂𝒓𝒎𝒆𝒏
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: ModernLocust
Steam:
ID: SecondClass
IP: Logged

30,019 posts
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
—Judge Aaron Satie
——Carmen
contrary to common misconceptions, feminism is not about “man hating” or “female supremacy.”
it should be


 
Verbatim
| Komm, süßer Tod
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: Verbatim-1
Steam: Jaco230
ID: Verbatim
IP: Logged

48,046 posts
Really though, the only thing that I take issue with is what he said about jokes. Jokes aren't meant to be taken seriously. They're used to satirize, to embellish, they're also used to make light of a terrible situation. No one(sane that is) telling a 9/11 joke is glad that those people burned to death or jumped to escape that fate.
agreed


 
Sandtrap
| Mythic Sage
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Sandtrap
IP: Logged

11,702 posts
Rockets on my X
contrary to common misconceptions, feminism is not about “man hating” or “female supremacy.”
it should be

Well that's dumb. Come on Class. Ya'll know better than that.


Turkey | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
more |
XBL: Viva Redemption
PSN: HurtfulTurkey
Steam: HurtfulTurkey
ID: HurtfulTurkey
IP: Logged

8,077 posts
 
Quote
“Men are NOT exploited or oppressed by sexism, but there are ways in which WE suffer as a result of it.”

We are taught early on that “boys don’t cry,” that to show sensitivity or emotional vulnerability is a sign of weakness. Men are discouraged from practicing nurturing, caregiving, compassion and compromise for the same reason. So there is an enormous amount of pressure placed on men to “prove our manhood” by acting tough, projecting strength and repressing our emotions so as to appear in control at all times. This is compounded by the fact that men are often more admired for being aggressive, dominant and violent than for being cooperative, vulnerable or empathetic. Not only is all of this damaging behavior encouraged in individual men, but those same values are also reflected in our larger political and military institutions, often to disastrous effect.

"Men aren't oppressed or exploited; here's a list of ways in which men are oppressed and exploited."

Isn't it fun when people insult your intelligence?


 
Sandtrap
| Mythic Sage
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Sandtrap
IP: Logged

11,702 posts
Rockets on my X
Article itself is fair, really. I already basically learned how to do what was listed there on my own. But it's got that hitch up, right at the starts.

"Guys ain't oppressed."

And then it goes to talk about how societal norms limit them and are imposed on them.

Really? I mean, really? Isn't that the very definition of being oppressed?





 
Verbatim
| Komm, süßer Tod
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: Verbatim-1
Steam: Jaco230
ID: Verbatim
IP: Logged

48,046 posts
Quote
“Men are NOT exploited or oppressed by sexism, but there are ways in which WE suffer as a result of it.”

We are taught early on that “boys don’t cry,” that to show sensitivity or emotional vulnerability is a sign of weakness. Men are discouraged from practicing nurturing, caregiving, compassion and compromise for the same reason. So there is an enormous amount of pressure placed on men to “prove our manhood” by acting tough, projecting strength and repressing our emotions so as to appear in control at all times. This is compounded by the fact that men are often more admired for being aggressive, dominant and violent than for being cooperative, vulnerable or empathetic. Not only is all of this damaging behavior encouraged in individual men, but those same values are also reflected in our larger political and military institutions, often to disastrous effect.
"Men aren't oppressed or exploited; here's a list of ways in which men are oppressed and exploited."

Isn't it fun when people insult your intelligence?
He never listed ways in which men are oppressed or exploited. Just ways in which we "suffer". They're different.

How is being told that "boys don't cry" oppressive or exploitative.

It's an inane standard to hold males to, but it's still neither of those things.


 
𝑺𝒆𝒄𝒐𝒏𝒅𝑪𝒍𝒂𝒔𝒔
| 𝑪𝒂𝒓𝒎𝒆𝒏
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: ModernLocust
Steam:
ID: SecondClass
IP: Logged

30,019 posts
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
—Judge Aaron Satie
——Carmen
contrary to common misconceptions, feminism is not about “man hating” or “female supremacy.”
it should be

Well that's dumb. Come on Class. Ya'll know better than that.
do I sand

Do I


Oh | Elite Four Invincible!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Simseo
IP: Logged

3,641 posts
 
what if I don't care?


 
Verbatim
| Komm, süßer Tod
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: Verbatim-1
Steam: Jaco230
ID: Verbatim
IP: Logged

48,046 posts
Article itself is fair, really. I already basically learned how to do what was listed there on my own. But it's got that hitch up, right at the starts.

"Guys ain't oppressed."

And then it goes to talk about how societal norms limit them and are imposed on them.

Really? I mean, really? Isn't that the very definition of being oppressed?
Nope, it isn't. Oppression is a very strong word, actually. You don't just toss it here and there like it's nothing.

Slaves were oppressed. Being told that it's socially unacceptable to cry as a male... isn't oppression.

No one's forcing you not to cry--it's just considered "weak" for men to do so.

That's a sexist consideration, but it's... basically nothing. Because who cares what society thinks.
Last Edit: December 02, 2015, 12:04:11 PM by Verbatim


Yu | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Yutaka
IP: Logged

12,707 posts
Almost always, with moderation
smugredman.png


 
Sandtrap
| Mythic Sage
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Sandtrap
IP: Logged

11,702 posts
Rockets on my X
Quote
“Men are NOT exploited or oppressed by sexism, but there are ways in which WE suffer as a result of it.”

We are taught early on that “boys don’t cry,” that to show sensitivity or emotional vulnerability is a sign of weakness. Men are discouraged from practicing nurturing, caregiving, compassion and compromise for the same reason. So there is an enormous amount of pressure placed on men to “prove our manhood” by acting tough, projecting strength and repressing our emotions so as to appear in control at all times. This is compounded by the fact that men are often more admired for being aggressive, dominant and violent than for being cooperative, vulnerable or empathetic. Not only is all of this damaging behavior encouraged in individual men, but those same values are also reflected in our larger political and military institutions, often to disastrous effect.
"Men aren't oppressed or exploited; here's a list of ways in which men are oppressed and exploited."

Isn't it fun when people insult your intelligence?
He never listed ways in which men are oppressed or exploited. Just ways in which we "suffer". They're different.

How is being told that "boys don't cry" oppressive or exploitative.

It's an inane standard to hold males to, but it's still neither of those things.

It's oppressive when everybody tells you. And that's exactly what people do.

I'll give you an example. I'm a writer. If I told any people in my area, that I like writing stories, I would immidiately get waved off, told that I can't accomplish anything with that, and that I should just go out and get a job on an oil rig or something.

That's both guys, and women.

That's an imposed lifestyle, and writing is not one seen as befitting for a guy to do.

And you're telling me that's not oppression?


 
Verbatim
| Komm, süßer Tod
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: Verbatim-1
Steam: Jaco230
ID: Verbatim
IP: Logged

48,046 posts
what if I don't care?
Then you're sexist.


 
Sandtrap
| Mythic Sage
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Sandtrap
IP: Logged

11,702 posts
Rockets on my X
Article itself is fair, really. I already basically learned how to do what was listed there on my own. But it's got that hitch up, right at the starts.

"Guys ain't oppressed."

And then it goes to talk about how societal norms limit them and are imposed on them.

Really? I mean, really? Isn't that the very definition of being oppressed?
Nope, it isn't. Oppression is a very strong word, actually. You don't just toss it here and there like it's nothing.

Slaves were oppressed. Being told that it's socially unacceptable to cry as a male... isn't oppression.

No one's forcing you not to cry--it's just considered "weak" for men to do so.

That's a sexist consideration, but it's... basically nothing. Because who cares what society thinks.

How about the dads who beat their kids because of it? Or other kids? They beat you up because you cry.


 
Verbatim
| Komm, süßer Tod
 
more |
XBL:
PSN: Verbatim-1
Steam: Jaco230
ID: Verbatim
IP: Logged

48,046 posts
How about the dads who beat their kids because of it? Or other kids? They beat you up because you cry.
I'd have to see the numbers.


Oh | Elite Four Invincible!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Simseo
IP: Logged

3,641 posts
 


eggsalad | Heroic Unstoppable!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam: eggsalad
ID: eggsalad
IP: Logged

2,495 posts
 
Quote
“Men are NOT exploited or oppressed by sexism, but there are ways in which WE suffer as a result of it.”

We are taught early on that “boys don’t cry,” that to show sensitivity or emotional vulnerability is a sign of weakness. Men are discouraged from practicing nurturing, caregiving, compassion and compromise for the same reason. So there is an enormous amount of pressure placed on men to “prove our manhood” by acting tough, projecting strength and repressing our emotions so as to appear in control at all times. This is compounded by the fact that men are often more admired for being aggressive, dominant and violent than for being cooperative, vulnerable or empathetic. Not only is all of this damaging behavior encouraged in individual men, but those same values are also reflected in our larger political and military institutions, often to disastrous effect.
"Men aren't oppressed or exploited; here's a list of ways in which men are oppressed and exploited."

Isn't it fun when people insult your intelligence?
He never listed ways in which men are oppressed or exploited. Just ways in which we "suffer". They're different.

How is being told that "boys don't cry" oppressive or exploitative.

It's an inane standard to hold males to, but it's still neither of those things.
Derision and discouragement of emotional expression on a societal level isn't oppression? Encouraging people to go out and do things and to take on responsibility while simultaneously refusing to recognize the struggles that it produces is not exploiting them? These stigmas aren't produced as a result of assumptions of what a gender is supposed to do? You are performing some mental gymnastics to not consider this oppression. Patriarchy means that those who are in power are men, not that all men are in power.


Super Irish | Legendary Invincible!
 
more |
XBL: Superirish19
PSN: Superirish19
Steam: Superirish19
ID: Super Irish
IP: Logged

6,009 posts
If I'm not here, I'm doing photography. Or I'm asleep. Or in lockdown. One of those three, anyway.

The current titlebar/avatar setup is just normal.
He seems to be telling me I should lay down and let women take charge.

Not that I have any involvement with the movement and already thought they were in charge with that, shouldn't I be allowed to criticise aspects of a movement that supposed to be promoting equality when it doesn't in certain cases, rather than having my mouth taped up because I'm a man?

This whole "men should shut-up and get out of the way" thing isn't much better than what the current setting is.


Turkey | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
more |
XBL: Viva Redemption
PSN: HurtfulTurkey
Steam: HurtfulTurkey
ID: HurtfulTurkey
IP: Logged

8,077 posts
 
Nope, it isn't. Oppression is a very strong word, actually. You don't just toss it here and there like it's nothing.

Slaves were oppressed. Being told that it's socially unacceptable to cry as a male... isn't oppression.

This appeal to bigger problems is the exact argument feminists fight when people belittle their claim of oppression.


eggsalad | Heroic Unstoppable!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam: eggsalad
ID: eggsalad
IP: Logged

2,495 posts
 
Article itself is fair, really. I already basically learned how to do what was listed there on my own. But it's got that hitch up, right at the starts.

"Guys ain't oppressed."

And then it goes to talk about how societal norms limit them and are imposed on them.

Really? I mean, really? Isn't that the very definition of being oppressed?
Nope, it isn't. Oppression is a very strong word, actually. You don't just toss it here and there like it's nothing.

Slaves were oppressed. Being told that it's socially unacceptable to cry as a male... isn't oppression.

No one's forcing you not to cry--it's just considered "weak" for men to do so.

That's a sexist consideration, but it's... basically nothing. Because who cares what society thinks.
How then are women oppressed? Who cares if society thinks they shouldn't wear slutty clothes? Who cares if society thinks they should wear makeup? Who cares if society thinks they can't do math?
Last Edit: December 02, 2015, 12:12:03 PM by eggsalad


 
Sandtrap
| Mythic Sage
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Sandtrap
IP: Logged

11,702 posts
Rockets on my X
How about the dads who beat their kids because of it? Or other kids? They beat you up because you cry.
I'd have to see the numbers.

Well that's even fucking worse.

There's some magic number that means it can be constituted as oppression?

So you'd tell me childhood doesn't count as oppression because of a number margin. Or the the stuff I've seen in other people's lives too.

Oh ya, let's talk about exploitation too.

Male child soldiers in third world countries. They're picked to be soldiers because they're guys.

For a guy who takes a lot of emphasis on 100% in things, shunting the bad shit that happens to guys as "not oppression" because it happens in a lower or different frequency, is, to put it politely, dun goofing of you.

Last Edit: December 02, 2015, 12:18:27 PM by Snowtrap