Is there a difference between hunting for sport and hunting for food?

DAS B00T x2 · May 31, 2015, 06:46:01 AM

Quote from: Pendulate on May 31, 2015, 06:22:21 AM

Quote from: DAS "كافر" B00T on May 31, 2015, 05:56:42 AM
Well, first off it's illegal and unregulated, meaning no tags, limits, or firearm/ammo restrictions.
I don't see how that's pertinent to the ethical side of the issue, but okay.

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Secondly, if done enough, it can completely deplete game populations for legal hunters.
So by killing animals illegally you make it harder to kill even more animals legally?

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Third, and this seems to mostly be an asian/african issue anymore (though I think there's issues down in Delaware with their endangered fox squirrel population), it directly hinders and opposes conservation efforts.
That's true. I noticed that none of your objections are with the act of killing the animal itself, though?

1, undocumented over harvesting utilization of lead core shot should be a problem.
2. Well yeah, that pretty self explanatory.
3. I don't see a problem with it, just how I grew up. Animals are a source of food, clothing, and other products.

Pendulate · May 31, 2015, 06:56:22 AM

Quote from: DAS "كافر" B00T on May 31, 2015, 06:46:01 AM

3. I don't see a problem with it, just how I grew up. Animals are a source of food, clothing, and other products.

You think a person's upbringing is the ultimate arbiter of morality? Like, they shouldn't think critically about the beliefs that were instilled into them in childhood?

DAS B00T x2 · May 31, 2015, 07:01:10 AM

Quote from: Pendulate on May 31, 2015, 06:56:22 AM

Quote from: DAS "كافر" B00T on May 31, 2015, 06:46:01 AM
3. I don't see a problem with it, just how I grew up. Animals are a source of food, clothing, and other products.
You think a person's upbringing is the ultimate arbiter of morality? Like, they shouldn't think critically about the beliefs that were instilled into them in childhood?

Of course not, otherwise we'd never have people denouncing religion.
I have thought about it. It's not something that bothers me nor does proper hunting truly conflict with my own core beliefs.

Pendulate · May 31, 2015, 07:19:13 AM

Well yeah, but I'm trying to dig at the logic behind your views, not just how you feel about them.

Not to be pushy, but when people say that something "doesn't bother them" it sounds as though they're just going off their emotions instead of thinking rationally. I mean, there are quite a lot of things that don't really bother me emotionally, but I can still recognize that they are important moral issues.

Girl of Mystery · May 31, 2015, 07:31:24 AM

What a dumb question

Verbatim · May 31, 2015, 07:34:20 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on May 31, 2015, 04:28:24 AM

Don't you get it? Meat tastes good, Pendulate! That's all that matters! Why are you so concerned about animal welfare, anyway? They're just stupid animals! They probably don't even realize that they're being eaten! Maybe you should be more concerned with the welfare of your own species before comparing us to lowly animals, you inconsiderate prick! I know I sound just like an ignorant bigot, but you have to ignore that because none of it matters! As long as it tastes good and it makes me happy, everything is okay! My addictions and personal gratification are WORTH endless holocausts of suffering! Don't you see?

God PUT these animals here to be eaten!
Oops, I mean Gaia.
OOPS, I mean evolution.

I'm not a crypto-religious fuck at all!
I promise! I'm an atheist! Really!

Mmm, by the way, your post just made me hungry for a big juicy steak, Pendulate.
~~I'm a glib cunt!~~
~~I'm a glutton!~~
I'm a good person!

i think this is legit one of the best things i've ever posted

i should write scripted debates

Girl of Mystery · May 31, 2015, 08:16:29 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on May 31, 2015, 07:34:20 AM

Don't you get it? Meat tastes good, Pendulate! That's all that matters! Why are you so concerned about animal welfare, anyway? They're just stupid animals! They probably don't even realize that they're being eaten! Maybe you should be more concerned with the welfare of your own species before comparing us to lowly animals, you inconsiderate prick! I know I sound just like an ignorant bigot, but you have to ignore that because none of it matters! As long as it tastes good and it makes me happy, everything is okay! My addictions and personal gratification are WORTH endless holocausts of suffering! Don't you see?

Exactly.
Glad you understand.

PSU · May 31, 2015, 09:36:54 AM

But we have supermarkets!!!!!!

Terrible example. Maybe I want to know exactly how and when my food was killed. There is zero wrong with hunting for food. It's literally how our species survived up until like 200 years ago.

cxfhvxgkcf-56:7 · May 31, 2015, 09:40:15 AM

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challengerX · May 31, 2015, 09:57:20 AM

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Mordo · May 31, 2015, 11:02:19 AM

Hunting for sustenance is less morally reprehensible because there is a meaningful purpose besides just perverse entertainment. It's a necessary facet of the animal kingdom as well as maintaining ecosystems. I thought this was obvious.

Protein is also an essential part of our diet, and meat is a direct source for that. (And yeah I'm aware you can obtain protein from nuts etc but it's hardly as viable as meat is).

Verbatim · May 31, 2015, 11:07:11 AM

Quote from: Madman Mordo on May 31, 2015, 11:02:19 AM

Hunting for sustenance is less morally reprehensible because there is a meaningful purpose besides just perverse entertainment.

there's meaningful purpose in choosing to starve to death rather than to take the life of another organism just to live for a few minutes longer, as well, though

there's positive meaningful purpose and negative meaningful purpose

taking from something is negative meaningful purpose

i don't think it's that much a stretch to claim that they're just as morally reprehensible, though i'm inclined to agree with you

i'm just saying, i don't think it's as easy a question as you're trying to make it

Forgewolf · May 31, 2015, 11:16:39 AM

If nothing goes to waste, there is no difference. The fur, the skin, the bones, etc can be cleaned and sold to make other things.

CK97 · May 31, 2015, 11:25:39 AM

There's nothing wrong with hunting as long you eat most of the animal and it isn't endangered.

OhMeOhMy · May 31, 2015, 11:30:53 AM

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Is there a difference between hunting for sport and hunting for food?

Certainly not to the animal that is hunted.

And in most cases, not the the hunters either. Sport-Hunting and Food-Hunting are neither binary nor are they polar opposites, at least to the hunters. To some non-hunters, a "food-hunter" is someone who "is unable to get their food any other way and any hunter who has the means to purchase food is therefor, by deduction, a sport-hunter."

As I said, it's not that simple. Nearly all sport hunters still harvest and utilize the meat of the hunt (either themselves or through a meat-sharing program). And similarly, those who hunt to stock their own freezer, can (and usually do) enjoy the sport of hunting.

Depending on the game and other considerations (for example, it may not be logistically feasible to pack out all of the meat from an elk kill) some meat may be left in the field. Another example would be wild feral hogs, which depending on the season, their diet, and the health of the animal, may not be fit for human consumption.

eggsalad · May 31, 2015, 12:02:29 PM

The hunting for food argument isn't sound. No one in a first world nation is hunting something for the purpose of food, there are easier and cheaper and faster ways for them to attain food. Food is just a byproduct of them hunting the animals for sport. When these people who get their own venison and whatever talk down to sports hunters for "wasting" things, they're just trying to feel above someone. That said it doesn't really matter all that much why someone hunts, animals are still killed. I'm not going to argue for the rights of wild animals or anything, but ecologically speaking hunting does serve many purposes, at least in North America. States keep track of populations and set game limits for reasons, they are managing game populations, and hunters are amazing contributors to this conservation effort.

Girl of Mystery · May 31, 2015, 12:28:16 PM

Vegan plebs go to hell

My life > some random animal

Dopameme · May 31, 2015, 01:28:26 PM

Back in high school one of my friends owned a ranch out in central Florida and he would always invite me to go hunt wild hogs with his dad for a weekend. Not sure what the laws are like currently, but back then there was such a surplus in the hog population that they were literally trashing the ecosystem around their ranch and driving native species away from their homes, so the Fish and Wildlife Organization pretty much told all landowners in that area that any wild hogs they see were free game, no permits required. These hogs are invasive species from god-knows-where and we as humans served the purpose of being the apex predator to wipe them out and restore balance to that local ecosystem.

So, to answer the OP, I personally don't see a real meaningful difference between "food-hunting" and "sport-hunting," since most people who do hunt for sport keep the meat and any other useful items obtained from the deceased animal. However, the hunters who just kill and just leave the entire corpse there to rot should have their hunting privileges revoked, because that's just wasteful and immoral.

gats · May 31, 2015, 01:31:06 PM

Quote from: Lemön on May 31, 2015, 12:28:16 PM

Vegan plebs go to hell

My life > some random animal

Very debatable

nͫiͤcͫeͤ · May 31, 2015, 01:43:15 PM

if you're some north dakota mountain man that hunts for his food that doesn't bother me one bit

humans are animals too

hunting other animals is a part of being an animal

i am karjala takaisin · May 31, 2015, 01:47:47 PM

Quote from: Ketameme Cat on May 31, 2015, 01:43:15 PM

if you're some north dakota mountain man that hunts for his food that doesn't bother me one bit

humans are animals too

hunting other animals is a part of being an animal

this is the first time ive seen north dakota used as an example for anything

Girl of Mystery · May 31, 2015, 01:47:51 PM

Quote from: goots on May 31, 2015, 01:31:06 PM

Quote from: Lemön on May 31, 2015, 12:28:16 PM
Vegan plebs go to hell

My life > some random animal
Very debatable

wow

rude

nͫiͤcͫeͤ · May 31, 2015, 01:49:45 PM

Quote from: Emberor on May 31, 2015, 01:47:47 PM

Quote from: Ketameme Cat on May 31, 2015, 01:43:15 PM
if you're some north dakota mountain man that hunts for his food that doesn't bother me one bit

humans are animals too

hunting other animals is a part of being an animal
this is the first time ive seen north dakota used as an example for anything

well the place is overpopulated with elk like all the time

Hahahaha very funny Zonda · May 31, 2015, 01:52:20 PM

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Ingy · May 31, 2015, 02:05:17 PM

This is like saying that there's no difference between using water for a slip and slide and giving it to African kids because the water is getting 'wasted' anyways

Dopameme · May 31, 2015, 02:10:46 PM

Quote from: Ingloriouswho98 on May 31, 2015, 02:05:17 PM

This is like saying that there's no difference between using water for a slip and slide and giving it to African kids because the water is getting 'wasted' anyways

um, have you ever been on a slip and slide? those things are fun as fuck, especially with a little booze in your system

i'd rather just mass produce slip and slides for african children

DAS B00T x2 · May 31, 2015, 02:11:59 PM

Quote from: Tryptameme on May 31, 2015, 02:10:46 PM

Quote from: Ingloriouswho98 on May 31, 2015, 02:05:17 PM
This is like saying that there's no difference between using water for a slip and slide and giving it to African kids because the water is getting 'wasted' anyways
um, have you ever been on a slip and slide? those things are fun as fuck, especially with a little booze in your system

i'd rather just mass produce slip and slides for african children

but nasty, they gots no waters to slide on

Ingy · May 31, 2015, 02:13:36 PM

Quote from: Tryptameme on May 31, 2015, 02:10:46 PM

Quote from: Ingloriouswho98 on May 31, 2015, 02:05:17 PM
This is like saying that there's no difference between using water for a slip and slide and giving it to African kids because the water is getting 'wasted' anyways
um, have you ever been on a slip and slide? those things are fun as fuck, especially with a little booze in your system

i'd rather just mass produce slip and slides for african children

When you cum on a slip and slide and people keep sliding and no one knows there's cum on the slip and slide but you

Dopameme · May 31, 2015, 02:13:47 PM

Quote from: DAS "كافر" B00T on May 31, 2015, 02:11:59 PM

Quote from: Tryptameme on May 31, 2015, 02:10:46 PM
Quote from: Ingloriouswho98 on May 31, 2015, 02:05:17 PM
This is like saying that there's no difference between using water for a slip and slide and giving it to African kids because the water is getting 'wasted' anyways
um, have you ever been on a slip and slide? those things are fun as fuck, especially with a little booze in your system

i'd rather just mass produce slip and slides for african children
but nasty, they gots no waters to slide on

they can use the blood of their tribal enemies, problem solved

Dopameme · May 31, 2015, 02:27:31 PM

i mean seriously, take a look at this

Spoiler

how can you say that you'd rather give all of that water to some underprivileged african children instead of getting drunk and sliding down this bad boy? oh wait, you can't

your move, humanitarians

Poll

Well?

Is there a difference between hunting for sport and hunting for food?