Why do some people root for the villains?

More Than Mortal · November 30, 2014, 02:21:30 PM

What're the psychological motivators behind people rooting for the obvious villains of a series. This can happen when the sheer ridiculousness of the situation - such as Patriot by Mel Gibson, which tried to paint the British as borderline Nazis and just didn't work. And, of course, it can happen when the villain just absolutely steals the show, like Heath Ledger's Joker.

The explanation I find most interesting, however, is that in these instances where the prior cases don't apply, people will root for the side most similar to them. It bodes ill, to say the least, as I always root for the East India Training Company and the Galactic Empire.

Although, to be honest, rooting for the Empire isn't particularly unusual. This is in Serious because I'm interesting in the psychological motivations behind rooting for the baddies when they aren't A) just a joke B) the focus. It's similar to the way people (not even Germans or alive at the time) can feel nostalgic, respectful or otherwise sympathetic to the Nazis.

BC · November 30, 2014, 02:34:47 PM

I'd say it's the opposite

Studies show a vast majority of humans express compassion, rather then psychopathic tendencies.

In fact, even infants choose and like compassionate characters over those that are bad.

It's quite interesting though

More Than Mortal · November 30, 2014, 02:36:34 PM

Quote from: BC on November 30, 2014, 02:34:47 PM

Studies show a vast majority of humans express compassion, rather then psychopathic tendencies.

Well, considering only 1pc of human species are psychopaths, that's obvious.

However, there has to be some innate level of respect for something when people root for the baddies? Are they simply cooler? Do people respect order and power? I'd so say, and if so, what're the variables which push this from mere respect to actual support.

BC · November 30, 2014, 02:38:19 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on November 30, 2014, 02:36:34 PM

Quote from: BC on November 30, 2014, 02:34:47 PM
Studies show a vast majority of humans express compassion, rather then psychopathic tendencies.
Well, considering only 1pc of human species are psychopaths, that's obvious.

However, there has to be some innate level of respect for something when people root for the baddies? Are they simply cooler? Do people respect order and power? I'd so say, and if so, what're the variables which push this from mere respect to actual support.

Perhaps people go for the enemy because they usually lose in media, be it games, movies, or books. Rooting for the underdog I guess.

Either that, or going against the norm and the whole rebel complex. Even I'd they themselves don't express it, they might have favor for the opposition because of their own beliefs.

More Than Mortal · November 30, 2014, 02:44:07 PM

Quote from: BC on November 30, 2014, 02:38:19 PM

Perhaps people go for the enemy because they usually lose in media, be it games, movies, or books. Rooting for the underdog I guess.

That's an interesting point, to be honest. We know the Empire will lose in the end, but are they really the underdog? Given how they're represented, it doesn't seem like. Do people, knowing or unknowingly, think about underdogs based on likely outcomes or how they operate.

BC · November 30, 2014, 02:47:10 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on November 30, 2014, 02:44:07 PM

Quote from: BC on November 30, 2014, 02:38:19 PM
Perhaps people go for the enemy because they usually lose in media, be it games, movies, or books. Rooting for the underdog I guess.
That's an interesting point, to be honest. We know the Empire will lose in the end, but are they really the underdog? Given how they're represented, it doesn't seem like. Do people, knowing or unknowingly, think about underdogs based on likely outcomes or how they operate.

I'd say likely outcomes

You can tell throughout the plot that the Rebels were going to beat the Empire. Regardless of the "impossible odds" the whole story arc makes it obvious the Empire will lose. Another thing is, perhaps people preferred the empire because of the way they are structured and their aesthetics? A big powerful army is likely to grab more attention then a small insurrection.

I'm sure there are many variables and finding one main reason would be hard to find.

BrenMan 94 · November 30, 2014, 02:50:43 PM

Nearly all films are political or social commentary. I don't "root" for anyone. I watch the film and appreciate the performances put on by the actors. If there's an underlying political or social message, I've most likely made up my mind about it before watching the movie, and will then judge the story based on the biases of the writers and director.

The Lord Slide Rule · November 30, 2014, 03:04:15 PM

In some cases rooting for the bad guy might just be a side effect of being media savvy.

DAS B00T x2 · November 30, 2014, 03:13:29 PM

Who doesn't love tragedy (and therefore the driving force of said tragedy)?

Turkey · November 30, 2014, 03:50:09 PM

I like it when stories aren't so black and white that the villains aren't relatable.

Korra · November 30, 2014, 03:50:49 PM

The Prophet of Truth was a real dick.

Mr. Psychologist · November 30, 2014, 04:28:48 PM

The Patriot had me rooting for the Redcoats from start to finish.

As for why people side with the baddies, I think it depends on their own views/how the bad guys are portrayed/context and all that.

In the patriot, the britbongs were made out to be the nastiest monsters on the planet which is to be expected from a piece of gibson propaganda (See Braveheart for more). It's stupid and it's quite fun to watch yanks get shit on for once, even if they do win at the end.

With the Empire, your post in the flood sums it up pretty well.

The joker is funny and likeable, even if he's a psychotic terrorist. I'd say that's more to do with cherry picked scenes though, considering he blew up a hospital full of people and sank a few cruiseliners iirc. He had a very smooth and witty way of talking, people like that.

A better example might be Raas al ghul in Batman Begins, I was pretty hacked off when Batman turned on the league considering they were completely right. The farmer he refused to lop killed someone out of sheer greed, so instead of killing him he butchers about 20 ninjas and blows up the entire complex. GG you 'pacifist' dolt.

Isara · November 30, 2014, 04:36:44 PM

I find disgusting that the hero without any particular talent wins against a villain who possesses reason, and logic. Western cartoons, some anime, and many films do that.

Naoto · November 30, 2014, 04:39:28 PM

I think Psy had a similar thread on bnet about Deathnote.

I tend to look at it from a more artistic perspective than a psychological one. Good guys are over done. That story has been told a million times in a million ways. I don't really enjoy black and white stories since that doesn't reflect life well. I enjoy stories that make me question myself, or put me in a position I'm not used to being in.

Its interesting examining the villian, and seeing things from their perspective since I'd never see that perspective in real life. So I find the Empire in Star Wars, Helghast in Killzone, Evil Desmond in inFamous SS, etc. all to be more interesting than their 'good' counterparts.

I'd say this is no more a reflection on the self than violent videogames/movies/music make you violent.
Its a fantasy world and an opportunity to explore areas of morality and thought that you can't irl without harming others.

Mr. Psychologist · November 30, 2014, 04:51:38 PM

Quote from: Keyu on November 30, 2014, 04:39:28 PM

I think Psy had a similar thread on bnet about Deathnote.

*grinds teeth*

Even to this day it pisses me off how that ended.

Kinder Graham · November 30, 2014, 05:14:35 PM

Because life isn't all sunshine and rainbows. It sucks and the bad guys do get away with things. Rooting for the "wrong" team is just to show that

Magos Domina · December 01, 2014, 07:35:00 AM

Well you root for Israel so you tell us.

challengerX · December 01, 2014, 07:38:00 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

More Than Mortal · December 01, 2014, 09:37:26 AM

Quote from: Priscilla on December 01, 2014, 07:35:00 AM

Well you root for Israel so you tell us.

And you root for Islamic Nazis.

I'm willing to try and split the difference, there.