What is the limit of free speech?

CIS · December 05, 2014, 07:16:58 PM

At what point do you think that speech should be restricted? For example, do you think we should have laws against hate speech?

Azumarill · December 05, 2014, 07:25:49 PM

The limit is decided by society... you're free to say anything you like, but the public at large is free to call you out for being an idiot

Alternative Facts · December 05, 2014, 07:38:46 PM

Holy shit, I've been waiting to use this image.

Basically, what Azumarill said. If you want to say we should round up the gays and send them to gas chambers on live TV, you're welcome to. But don't expect to be shielded from punishment, criticism, or vicious mobs running you out of town.

TheOneTrueDesticle · December 06, 2014, 12:38:56 AM

Quote from: CIS Scum on December 05, 2014, 07:16:58 PM

blah blah

No

Naoto · December 06, 2014, 04:33:59 AM

I have a passionate hatred for anyone supportive of laws banning any form of speech.
The rule of 'I may disagree with what you say but I'll defend to the death your right to say it' is pretty solid.

Though obviously you can't falsely yell fire in a crowded movie theater etc. You can't expect to be able to say whatever you want on private media. Though I'm not a huge fan of sites that ban opinions they disagree with. Echo chambers and hugboxes are garbage, but they have a right to run their site that way.

Also you can't expect to somehow be protected from criticism for what you say.
So, there are some limitations to free speech, but not many. Nor should there be. Healthy modern societies should not be silencing discussion, punishing those with differing opinions, or censoring media.

BaconShelf · December 06, 2014, 06:03:19 AM

Everyone has the right so say stupid racist/ other ist shit, but everyone else has the right to call them out or not listen to such stupid shit. Free speech says you can say what you want, it never says anything about being listened to.

Mordo · December 06, 2014, 06:16:28 AM

Quote from: IC on December 05, 2014, 07:38:46 PM

or vicious mobs running you out of town.

Actually, they can expect to be shielded from that. Free speech offers you the right to say what you like without fear of being physically attacked by anyone, including those outwith the government.

Mordo · December 06, 2014, 06:21:08 AM

You have the right to say what you like without fear of being physically assaulted by anyone, but that also means everyone else has the right to call you out on your bullshit and verbally humiliate/disagree/refute whatever rhetoric comes out your mouth. The only time the government should step in on speech, or anyone else for that matter, is when threats are involved in a serious context. Emphasis on serious. A comedian joking about murder/rape/any kind of heinous crime or casual banter between mates are not threats and should never be criminally punishable.

DAS B00T x2 · December 06, 2014, 06:24:54 AM

Quote from: Madman Mordo on December 06, 2014, 06:16:28 AM

Quote from: IC on December 05, 2014, 07:38:46 PM
or vicious mobs running you out of town.
Actually, they can expect to be shielded from that. Free speech offers you the right to say what you like without fear of being physically attacked by anyone, including those outwith the government.

No, I'm pretty sure it just applies to the government.

Mordo · December 06, 2014, 06:30:51 AM

Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on December 06, 2014, 06:24:54 AM

Quote from: Madman Mordo on December 06, 2014, 06:16:28 AM
Quote from: IC on December 05, 2014, 07:38:46 PM
or vicious mobs running you out of town.
Actually, they can expect to be shielded from that. Free speech offers you the right to say what you like without fear of being physically attacked by anyone, including those outwith the government.
No, I'm pretty sure it just applies to the government.

No, actually, it's not. It's how WBC make a lot of their money. The formula goes 1) Picket a funeral/gay rally 2) Get assaulted by angry mobs 3) Sue them for breach of the peace/speech and physical assault. It's disgusting and exploitative sure, but it's a loophole in the system they've discovered. Should they voice their opinions in a less volatile and aggressive context? Sure, but they have every right to picket and voice their opinions without fear of being assaulted physically.

DAS B00T x2 · December 06, 2014, 06:31:41 AM

Quote from: Madman Mordo on December 06, 2014, 06:30:51 AM

Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on December 06, 2014, 06:24:54 AM
Quote from: Madman Mordo on December 06, 2014, 06:16:28 AM
Quote from: IC on December 05, 2014, 07:38:46 PM
or vicious mobs running you out of town.
Actually, they can expect to be shielded from that. Free speech offers you the right to say what you like without fear of being physically attacked by anyone, including those outwith the government.
No, I'm pretty sure it just applies to the government.
No, actually, it's not. It's how WBC make a lot of their money. The formula goes 1) Picket a funeral/gay rally 2) Get assaulted by angry mobs 3) Sue them for breach of the peace/speech and physical assault. It's disgusting and exploitative sure, but it's a loophole in the system they've discovered. Should they voice their opinions in a less volatile and aggressive context? Sure, but they have every right to picket and voice their opinions without fear of being assaulted physically.

That has noting to do with free speech though, and rather the fact that assault is illegal.

Mordo · December 06, 2014, 06:33:17 AM

Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on December 06, 2014, 06:31:41 AM

Quote from: Madman Mordo on December 06, 2014, 06:30:51 AM
Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on December 06, 2014, 06:24:54 AM
Quote from: Madman Mordo on December 06, 2014, 06:16:28 AM
Quote from: IC on December 05, 2014, 07:38:46 PM
or vicious mobs running you out of town.
Actually, they can expect to be shielded from that. Free speech offers you the right to say what you like without fear of being physically attacked by anyone, including those outwith the government.
No, I'm pretty sure it just applies to the government.
No, actually, it's not. It's how WBC make a lot of their money. The formula goes 1) Picket a funeral/gay rally 2) Get assaulted by angry mobs 3) Sue them for breach of the peace/speech and physical assault. It's disgusting and exploitative sure, but it's a loophole in the system they've discovered. Should they voice their opinions in a less volatile and aggressive context? Sure, but they have every right to picket and voice their opinions without fear of being assaulted physically.
That has noting to do with free speech though, and rather the fact that assault is illegal.

They're not mutually exclusive terms.

Word Wizard · December 06, 2014, 07:14:36 AM

YouTube

I think Hitchens does a good job of explaining my view.

Kinder Graham · December 06, 2014, 08:11:46 AM

Quote from: IC on December 05, 2014, 07:38:46 PM

Holy shit, I've been waiting to use this image.

Basically, what Azumarill said. If you want to say we should round up the gays and send them to gas chambers on live TV, you're welcome to. But don't expect to be shielded from punishment, criticism, or vicious mobs running you out of town.

A person can't kill or attack you for what you say, so there even exists a threshold with the people

More Than Mortal · December 06, 2014, 08:22:53 AM

Do you want me to answer as a politician or a citizen?

Super Irish · December 06, 2014, 08:58:08 AM

The limit on free speech is right in the title, none.

Sure, someone may say some bullshit I don't want to hear, but I can just as easily tell them it's bullshit and to fuck off.

DAS B00T x2 · December 06, 2014, 10:13:07 AM

Quote from: KinderEssen on December 06, 2014, 08:11:46 AM

Quote from: IC on December 05, 2014, 07:38:46 PM
Holy shit, I've been waiting to use this image.

Basically, what Azumarill said. If you want to say we should round up the gays and send them to gas chambers on live TV, you're welcome to. But don't expect to be shielded from punishment, criticism, or vicious mobs running you out of town.
A person can't kill or attack you for what you say, so there even exists a threshold with the people

That's not because of Freedom of Speech though, that's because assault and murder are illegal on their own.

DAS B00T x2 · December 06, 2014, 10:13:30 AM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on December 06, 2014, 08:22:53 AM

Do you want me to answer as a politician or a citizen?

Yes.

Statefarm · December 06, 2014, 10:37:30 AM

It can't infringe on other's rights to safety, otherwise everything goes.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · December 06, 2014, 02:17:23 PM

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🍁 Aria 🔮 · December 06, 2014, 10:38:05 PM

Free, to the point that it infringes on the rights of others. On a societal level, rather than legal, it's pretty much up to public opinion what you can get away with.