US fully lift arms ban on Vietnam

Luciana · May 23, 2016, 03:00:27 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/23/politics/obama-vietnam-trip/index.html?adkey=bn

"We're totally not doing this in response to China"

Yeah, okay.

Thun · May 23, 2016, 03:04:04 AM

Good. Fuck China.

Luciana · May 23, 2016, 03:09:11 AM

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · May 23, 2016, 12:39:20 PM

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big sponge · May 23, 2016, 12:49:09 PM

Because it makes sense to keep in place an arms embargo 20 years after the Cold War ended.

Turkey · May 23, 2016, 03:05:13 PM

Quote from: LC on May 23, 2016, 12:49:09 PM

Because it makes sense to keep in place an arms embargo 20 years after the Cold War ended.

It does, in the face of the Vietnamese government's numerous human rights violations. An embargo is a nice alternative to an invasion.

big sponge · May 23, 2016, 03:31:55 PM

Quote from: Hold the Turkey on May 23, 2016, 03:05:13 PM

Quote from: LC on May 23, 2016, 12:49:09 PM
Because it makes sense to keep in place an arms embargo 20 years after the Cold War ended.

It does, in the face of the Vietnamese government's numerous human rights violations. An embargo is a nice alternative to an invasion.

If we cared about that we wouldn't be selling to the Saudis and other governments that do the same kinds of things. An arms embargo won't force them to change their ways since they can just as easily get their shit from Russia. Engaging in trade is what will open places like Cuba and Vietnam up.

Jocephalopod · May 23, 2016, 08:20:38 PM

thought this said verbatim

Turkey · May 24, 2016, 07:31:06 AM

Quote from: LC on May 23, 2016, 03:31:55 PM

Engaging in trade is what will open places like Cuba and Vietnam up.

Engaging in arms trade will open up Vietnam...to what, exactly? Lifting the embargo is a good thing, and is strategically important in preparing for a conflict with China, but you're acting like embargoes and sanctions aren't standard alternatives to occupation these days.

challengerX · May 24, 2016, 09:26:24 AM

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big sponge · May 24, 2016, 10:36:16 AM

Quote from: Hold the Turkey on May 24, 2016, 07:31:06 AM

Quote from: LC on May 23, 2016, 03:31:55 PM
Engaging in trade is what will open places like Cuba and Vietnam up.

Engaging in arms trade will open up Vietnam...to what, exactly? Lifting the embargo is a good thing, and is strategically important in preparing for a conflict with China, but you're acting like embargoes and sanctions aren't standard alternatives to occupation these days.

Not really, you're the one who's acting as if you have to occupy a place if you don't put an embargo on them.

Turkey · May 24, 2016, 11:28:32 AM

Quote from: LC on May 24, 2016, 10:36:16 AM

Quote from: Hold the Turkey on May 24, 2016, 07:31:06 AM
Quote from: LC on May 23, 2016, 03:31:55 PM
Engaging in trade is what will open places like Cuba and Vietnam up.

Engaging in arms trade will open up Vietnam...to what, exactly? Lifting the embargo is a good thing, and is strategically important in preparing for a conflict with China, but you're acting like embargoes and sanctions aren't standard alternatives to occupation these days.

Not really, you're the one who's acting as if you have to occupy a place if you don't put an embargo on them.

I'm not

But k

Luciana · May 24, 2016, 03:33:05 PM

Quote from: challengerX on May 24, 2016, 09:26:24 AM

Quote from: Hold the Turkey on May 24, 2016, 07:31:06 AM
Quote from: LC on May 23, 2016, 03:31:55 PM
Engaging in trade is what will open places like Cuba and Vietnam up.

Engaging in arms trade will open up Vietnam...to what, exactly? Lifting the embargo is a good thing, and is strategically important in preparing for a conflict with China, but you're acting like embargoes and sanctions aren't standard alternatives to occupation these days.
Turning them into "allies".

This. And it promotes them to be more in line with human rights. China for example was horrible for a long ass time, but compare China now to how it was in the 80's, and it miles ahead. It's still not ideal, but yeah.