The Taliban's Psychiatrist [BBC]

 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-29944329

This is actually a very good article on the effects of war and conflict on mental health, even on the insurgents/terrorists who cause it. I'd really recommend you all read it >.> I've embedded the text as usual for those who'd rather not click the link.

There are two bits that really stood out to me, the first was how 2/3rds of the country (Afghanistan) is estimated to have some form of mental health issues. This isn't exactly surprising considering how war torn the region is but it's one of those figures that doesn't get a lot of attention, whenever there is a bloody conflict the statistics that get churned out are always to do with the number of dead - when it is the dead that don't actually need any help to continue living.

The second part was this 'Alemi found many of the soldiers wanted to die. "They told me they [wanted] to commit suicide, but couldn't because of Islamic values." One said: "Every time I go to the frontline, I wish someone would shoot me and bring an end to my life. But I still survive and hate this sort of living." '
I think that offers a good piece of insight into some of the fanaticism seen from the terrorists, whilst their desire to die in jihad initially would stem from extreme interpretations of the Quran, after a while I think it might explain why they don't just give up and go home >.>

Thoughts?

Spoiler
Quote
In the late 1990s the Taliban controlled Afghanistan, but the fighting that brought them to power left many militants struggling with the psychological effects of war. One doctor recognised the problem and, although he disagreed with the Taliban's ideology, agreed to treat them.

"I remember the first group of Taliban who came to see me," says Afghan psychiatrist Nader Alemi. "They used to come in groups, not as individuals. When I treated one, he would spread the word.

"Fighters would turn up with my name on a piece of paper. They would say that I'd cured their friend, and now they wanted to be cured too. Most of them had never been to a doctor before."

A familiar figure in Afghanistan, Alemi is based in Mazar-e-Sharif in the north of the country. Taliban forces captured the city in August 1998 and won control of much of the surrounding area.

But while they were succeeding on the battlefield, Alemi saw the mental strain of years of fighting.

He was the only psychiatrist in northern Afghanistan to speak Pashto, the language of most Taliban.

"Language was very important - because I spoke their language, they felt comfortable opening up," he says.

One day the Taliban's provincial governor Akthar Osmani summoned Alemi to see him - Mullah Akhtar was second in command to Mullah Omar, the group's spiritual leader.
Afghan psychiatrist Nader Alemi in his clinic in Mazar-e-Sharif Afghan psychiatrist Nader Alemi at his clinic in Mazar-e-Sharif

"He was hearing voices and he was delusional - his bodyguards told me they could hear him raving during the night," says Alemi. Mullah Akhtar's staff also said their boss often didn't recognise them.

"This man had been on the front line for goodness knows how long, and seen goodness knows how many people killed in front of him. All those explosions and screams may still have been echoing in his head, even sitting in the comfort of his office."

Alemi wanted to see Mullah Akhtar regularly to provide long-term treatment, but his patient would go off on missions every three months, and only kept a few appointments. Much later, in 2006, Mullah Akhtar was killed in an airstrike.
A group of Islamic militants, members of the Afghan religious Taliban militia, move toward the front line on a tank, near Kabul, on February 18, 1995 Taliban fighters near the front line in 1995

Alemi treated other high-ranking Taliban officials too. "We became sort of friends. [One] asked me to see him at his headquarters - he was suffering from depression and chronic pain, and I prescribed him drugs to alleviate his symptoms."

"I don't remember the exact numbers who came to me, but it must have been in the thousands. I treated them for almost three years, before Mazar was recaptured in November 2001."

Because most of these patients had never been to a doctor before, Alemi asked if their commanders forbade it but that wasn't the case. "To be honest, they were so into their mission and daily routine that they didn't have time for medication. Surprisingly, all of them believed in my treatments.
Map showing location of Mazar-e-Sharif

"The reason they gave me for the turmoil in their minds was the uncertainty in their lives. They had no control over what was happening to them. Everything was in the hands of their commanders. They got depressed because they never knew what would happen from one minute to the next.

"Most of them hadn't seen their families for months - they hadn't seen their children who had grown big."

Alemi found many of the soldiers wanted to die. "They told me they [wanted] to commit suicide, but couldn't because of Islamic values."

One said: "Every time I go to the frontline, I wish someone would shoot me and bring an end to my life. But I still survive and hate this sort of living."

"I used to treat the Taliban as human beings, same as I would treat my other patients… even though I knew they had caused all the problems in our society," says Alemi. "Sometimes, they would weep and I would comfort them."
line

Mental health in Afghanistan
A resident of Kabul's 15 patient men's mental institution, sits in his bed October 15, 2002

    In 2010 the health ministry said that two thirds of the population had a mental illness
    Problems are mainly caused by continued violence, poverty, unemployment, domestic violence and drug addiction
    A nationwide survey conducted by the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in 2002 found high levels of depression, anxiety, and PTSD (post-traumatic stress disorder) - women and people with disabilities were most affected
    In 2006, the WHO reported that less than 1% of medical training was devoted to mental health
    The few specialist hospitals that once existed have been replaced by a Mental Consultation Section in big state-run hospitals

One of the main problems was that Alemi's patients were often sent off on missions and could never commit to follow-up sessions.

Consultations cost the equivalent of $1 and the Taliban sometimes sent their wives and daughters to Alemi for treatment as well. "They too were suffering depression, because they wouldn't see their husbands, fathers for a long time and they didn't know what the future held for them."

Even the notorious religious police, the Amr Bil Ma'ruf, let him get on with his business. Alemi remembers how one day they were shouting on their loudspeakers, telling people to leave their jobs and get to mosque for prayers, but he was still seeing patients.

"One of my staff shouted from the building and said: 'The doctor is busy seeing patients'," says Alemi. The Amr Bil Ma'ruf shouted back and said: "It is alright, let him do his job."

Incredibly, at the same time that Alemi was treating the Taliban, his wife ran an underground school for about 100 girls - under the Taliban girls were not allowed to study.
Afghan pupils attend class at a girls school in Kabul on September 20, 2010. Girls' schools reopened after the Taliban were removed from power

Parvin Alemi taught them about literature, language, maths and Islamic books. "All I wanted was to educate girls," she says. "Now some are doctors, engineers and teachers. They all appreciate what I did for them. They say they would have remained illiterate if I didn't educate them."

The pupils included the Alemis' own daughters - one is now a doctor and two are teachers.

But weren't they running a terrible risk? "I asked them to come separately, not in groups, to avoid any problems," says Parvin Alemi. "We kept the school secret. We asked our students not to tell anyone either. It was a dangerous decision, but I am proud to have taken the risk."

The couple were worried that the Taliban might catch them, but Alemi says they seemed to look upon him kindly. "Since I didn't have any political ambitions or interest, I am sure even if they caught our underground school, they would be cool about it because they knew all we wanted was to help others."

More than 15 years later, Alemi is still treating Afghans traumatised by conflict. The queues in his hospital stretch down the corridors, men and women in separate groups. They complain of depression, mood swings and nightmares.

Alemi says the biggest underlying problem in their lives is still uncertainty - they face hardship and deprivation and have no idea what the future holds.


 
More Than Mortal
| d-d-d-DANK ✡ 🔥🔥🔥 🌈ðŸ‘
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam: MetaCognition
ID: Meta Cognition
IP: Logged

15,060 posts
This is the way the world ends. Not with a bang but a whimper.
I want the 68pc of British Muslims who oppose freedom of speech to go to Iraq and Syria. They should fight for ISIS. They should behead innocents, murder children and proclaim genocide against the Jews. And those that aren't completely psychopathic should develop depression, PTSD, epilepsy and anxiety. They should suffer.

Then, and only then, will they realise the true extent of the suffering their despicable ideology causes.


 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
I want the 68pc of British Muslims who oppose freedom of speech to go to Iraq and Syria. They should fight for ISIS. They should behead innocents, murder children and proclaim genocide against the Jews. And those that aren't completely psychopathic should develop depression, PTSD, epilepsy and anxiety. They should suffer.

Then, and only then, will they realise the true extent of the suffering their despicable ideology causes.

I'm not entirely sure how one would get epilepsy from beheading people >_>


 
More Than Mortal
| d-d-d-DANK ✡ 🔥🔥🔥 🌈ðŸ‘
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam: MetaCognition
ID: Meta Cognition
IP: Logged

15,060 posts
This is the way the world ends. Not with a bang but a whimper.
I'm not entirely sure how one would get epilepsy from beheading people >_>
Physical trauma to the head can cause epilepsy. More a side-effect of warfare than beheading people specifically; it's actually quite a big problem for our own military.


 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
I'm not entirely sure how one would get epilepsy from beheading people >_>
Physical trauma to the head can cause epilepsy. More a side-effect of warfare than beheading people specifically; it's actually quite a big problem for our own military.

Ah right, of course <.<
I thought you were talking about some sort of psychosomatic epilepsy >.>


 
Sandtrap
| Mythic Sage
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Sandtrap
IP: Logged

11,702 posts
Rockets on my X
Simple human nature at work. We demonize "the other side" too easily while forgetting about the bigger picture. And that's the fact that there's a human being on the other side of the wall. Bad or no, horrible and despicable as a person, in that shell of a person lies things that can be broken. Their mind, their emotions.

I was around folks when they killed Suddam. They cheered and celebrated. Held parties. I didn't. As bad as a person as he was, he had a family. A wife, kids. His wife at one time even described him as "delicate" when he worked in the garden.

Even Hitler, as much of an ass as he was, was a person.

It's just that they're all a jumbled up mess of things.

I've seen videos of attack choppers in the air firing on targets on the ground. You see gunfire rip across the ground in front of their targets, and they freeze. They flinch. They run and zig zag and try to get away. You see rockets hit people and the survivors are completely lost. They're dazed from the explosion no doubt, but at the same time, you can see what's in their movements.

Fear. Fear of death. Pure, ingrained human instinct to survive.

These folks may be monsters as people, capable and by all accounts performing horrible acts. But they're not soulless, blank walls that don't flinch and don't blink.

All they need is to have a little common sense, and turn things around. Violence makes violence. Negative people, bring people down around them. Peace makes peace, positive folks raise folks up around them.

So the real thing that I wonder, is how do you break through their walls? Some people, on their side, are too far gone. You can't fix them, you can't help them. So you shoot them. But there's other folks, on the fringes, that have a better chance.

You can't stamp these people out with physical force. Not without catching the wrong people in the crossfire. So the question is, how do you influence subtle change in them?


Super Irish | Legendary Invincible!
 
more |
XBL: Superirish19
PSN: Superirish19
Steam: Superirish19
ID: Super Irish
IP: Logged

6,013 posts
If I'm not here, I'm doing photography. Or I'm asleep. Or in lockdown. One of those three, anyway.

The current titlebar/avatar setup is just normal.
So the real thing that I wonder, is how do you break through their walls?

Well, there's your problem...

Breaking through their walls got them mad, and now they fight. They could have started fighting for a cause, and now so wrapped up (and warped-up) in the wider scale of it, that there is no escape.

It's a side-effect of killing, the psychological trauma. While we've been killing each other for thousands of years, it generally goes against the grain of our... morals? human nature? psyche? That sort of thing, anyway... and frankly I think that while for the person it's terrible (even to get that far to kill, and now suffering trauma), it's a good thing we have that "flaw".

If we didn't, killing would mean nothing to us, we would be cold in that regard, and that would mean a much worse scenario on a global scale in general.

Sorry, went mildly off-topic there. While I'm thinking about the OP; "Wow, these people suffer from such things too", I'm now also repulsed that that thought was the first to my mind. It's good that the BBC are at least somewhat impartial in their journalism, otherwise I'd still be thinking that out of sheer ignorance.

Aaaaaaand I've gone mildly off-topic again.


 
DAS B00T x2
| Cultural Appropriator
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: DAS B00T x2
IP: Logged

37,633 posts
This is not the greatest sig in the world, no. This is just a tribute.
Yeah, enemy combatants are still humans. That's why they bleed and die too... It's just a little too easy to forget that they're not all bloodthirsty savages who have never felt remorse or regret, but it's also just as hard to accept that at the end of the day, your average Hadji was just some fourteen year old kid pushed into the shitty life of an Islamic militant and still bears all of the mental trauma any soldier would. Makes them seem human; a lot of folk don't like to think of them as such.

That was pretty good thing to read. Thanks, OP.
Last Edit: November 26, 2014, 06:18:20 PM by DAS B00T x2


 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
So the real thing that I wonder, is how do you break through their walls?

Well, there's your problem...

Breaking through their walls got them mad, and now they fight. They could have started fighting for a cause, and now so wrapped up (and warped-up) in the wider scale of it, that there is no escape.

It's a side-effect of killing, the psychological trauma. While we've been killing each other for thousands of years, it generally goes against the grain of our... morals? human nature? psyche? That sort of thing, anyway... and frankly I think that while for the person it's terrible (even to get that far to kill, and now suffering trauma), it's a good thing we have that "flaw".

If we didn't, killing would mean nothing to us, we would be cold in that regard, and that would mean a much worse scenario on a global scale in general.

Sorry, went mildly off-topic there. While I'm thinking about the OP; "Wow, these people suffer from such things too", I'm now also repulsed that that thought was the first to my mind. It's good that the BBC are at least somewhat impartial in their journalism, otherwise I'd still be thinking that out of sheer ignorance.

Aaaaaaand I've gone mildly off-topic again.

I hate to admit that I was mildly surprised whilst reading the article, it's far too easy to just write them off as all die hard fanatics ready to detonate in a room full of children at a moments notice.

Even if that is the case, they are still humans and they suffer like ordinary humans.

I would hope that this can perhaps stimulate thought into how to prevent this more effectively, if you have a country with 2/3rds of the population scarred and fucked up to all hell and back - you are going to need to up the ante on the mental healthcare if you want to stop giving the taliban broken people to turn into weapons.


 
Luis
| Legendary Invincible!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam: exige
ID: Luis
IP: Logged

6,172 posts
 
I have a feeling you're obsessed with Muslim terrorists.


 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
I have a feeling you're obsessed with Muslim terrorists.

I have two answers for you

#1
I am Ayatollah Psychologis of the glorious Islamic sultanate and caliphate of britbongistan after all.
#2
It's an interesting subject, but I'm by no means obsessed with the idiots who behead children and blow up schools.


 
Luis
| Legendary Invincible!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam: exige
ID: Luis
IP: Logged

6,172 posts
 
I have a feeling you're obsessed with Muslim terrorists.

I have two answers for you

#1
I am Ayatollah Psychologis of the glorious Islamic sultanate and caliphate of britbongistan after all.
#2
It's an interesting subject, but I'm by no means obsessed with the idiots who behead children and blow up schools.
Ok then…


 
 
Mr. Psychologist
| Imperial Forum Ninja
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: Mr Psychologist
IP: Logged

17,215 posts
<.<
I have a feeling you're obsessed with Muslim terrorists.

I have two answers for you

#1
I am Ayatollah Psychologis of the glorious Islamic sultanate and caliphate of britbongistan after all.
#2
It's an interesting subject, but I'm by no means obsessed with the idiots who behead children and blow up schools.
Ok then…
ALLAH AKBAR


 
Luis
| Legendary Invincible!
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam: exige
ID: Luis
IP: Logged

6,172 posts
 
I have a feeling you're obsessed with Muslim terrorists.

I have two answers for you

#1
I am Ayatollah Psychologis of the glorious Islamic sultanate and caliphate of britbongistan after all.
#2
It's an interesting subject, but I'm by no means obsessed with the idiots who behead children and blow up schools.
Ok then…
ALLAH AKBAR

Last Edit: November 27, 2014, 08:51:33 AM by Santa Luis


 
challengerX
| custom title
 
more |
XBL:
PSN:
Steam:
ID: challengerX
IP: Logged

41,942 posts
I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.