Recent shifts in any of your views? Let's talk about them.

cxfhvxgkcf-56:7 · November 21, 2015, 07:24:11 PM

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Cindy · November 21, 2015, 07:26:13 PM

I really just don't get the thought process

>9/11 happens
>Things like the patriot act happen in response
>More terrorist things happen
>"Yeah, this really makes me have faith in the patriot act"

Wut

Azumarill · November 21, 2015, 07:27:16 PM

Quote from: Luciana on November 21, 2015, 07:21:35 PM

Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:20:26 PM
Quote from: Luciana on November 21, 2015, 07:10:43 PM
Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:02:27 PM
refugees and the possibility of extremists hiding among them is what prompted me to have a little more faith in the PATRIOT Act and America's ability to keep the people safe.
Even though they were all european nationals

screening for refugees here is already more thorough than you'd think
You don't have to tell me that. Believe me, I know about the 18-24 month long vetting process. I'm not anti-refugee and I've never made any claims that refugees were responsible for the Parisian massacre. All I'm saying is that the existence of America's mass surveillance programs gives me a stronger sense of security. The fact that the 1-2 thousand Syrian refugees who have already entered our country have not committed acts of terror tells me that we're doing something right with regard to both the vetting process and our ability to monitor people within the nation.
That... and they're probably not terrorists and just normal every day middle class citizens trying to get away from a faction that is worse than the Nazi's.

Again, I think you've got me pegged all wrong. I am not anti-refugee. I do not believe that there is a significant chance that refugees will commit acts of terror within our borders. Please stop acting as though I've presented myself that way.

Azumarill · November 21, 2015, 07:28:48 PM

Quote from: Cindo on November 21, 2015, 07:26:13 PM

I really just don't get the thought process

>9/11 happens
>Things like the patriot act happen in response
>More terrorist things happen
>"Yeah, this really makes me have faith in the patriot act"

Wut

You're mischaracterizing my position.

Azumarill · November 21, 2015, 07:32:50 PM

I feel like I'm caught in a game of pedantics because I mentioned the PATRIOT act instead of just saying mass surveillance. My bad. Sorry. I'll do more thorough research before speaking about policy in the future.

Luciana · November 21, 2015, 07:36:24 PM

Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:27:16 PM

Again, I think you've got me pegged all wrong. I am not anti-refugee. I do not believe that there is a significant chance that refugees will commit acts of terror within our borders. Please stop acting as though I've presented myself that way.

Okay :<

Azumarill · November 21, 2015, 07:39:42 PM

Quote from: Luciana on November 21, 2015, 07:36:24 PM

Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:27:16 PM
Again, I think you've got me pegged all wrong. I am not anti-refugee. I do not believe that there is a significant chance that refugees will commit acts of terror within our borders. Please stop acting as though I've presented myself that way.
Okay :<

It's fine; I understand where you're coming from. A lot of people are reacting in very unreasonable ways and treating the refugees unfairly. It's easy to see where my OP might be interpreted in a different way than I meant it. That's my own fault for not being thorough with my rhetoric.

Luciana · November 21, 2015, 07:43:33 PM

Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:39:42 PM

Quote from: Luciana on November 21, 2015, 07:36:24 PM
Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:27:16 PM
Again, I think you've got me pegged all wrong. I am not anti-refugee. I do not believe that there is a significant chance that refugees will commit acts of terror within our borders. Please stop acting as though I've presented myself that way.
Okay :<
It's fine; I understand where you're coming from. A lot of people are reacting in very unreasonable ways and treating the refugees unfairly. It's easy to see where my OP might be interpreted in a different way than I meant it. That's my own fault for not being thorough with my rhetoric.

I was more so stating that you have nothing to be afraid of because they're not terrorists. Not so much you were anti immigration.

Azumarill · November 21, 2015, 07:48:45 PM

Quote from: Luciana on November 21, 2015, 07:43:33 PM

Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:39:42 PM
Quote from: Luciana on November 21, 2015, 07:36:24 PM
Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:27:16 PM
Again, I think you've got me pegged all wrong. I am not anti-refugee. I do not believe that there is a significant chance that refugees will commit acts of terror within our borders. Please stop acting as though I've presented myself that way.
Okay :<
It's fine; I understand where you're coming from. A lot of people are reacting in very unreasonable ways and treating the refugees unfairly. It's easy to see where my OP might be interpreted in a different way than I meant it. That's my own fault for not being thorough with my rhetoric.
I was more so stating that you have nothing to be afraid of because they're not terrorists. Not so much you were anti immigration.

I was never overly concerned about that anyway. The idea is that the already extremely slim possibility is pretty much negated entirely by our thorough national security measures

Verbatim · November 21, 2015, 11:25:19 PM

Anti-natalism, veganism, feminism, socialism:

Nothing has changed, though I'm a bit less "militant" about these subjects. As the weeks go by, I grow more and more jaded. No one walks into a debate prepared to admit that they're wrong, so it all starts feeling a bit pointless. I can't force anyone to be any of the above things--you just have to be smart enough to become them yourself. I'm just the guy who tries to steer you into the right direction, and I'm slowly learning how to do that efficiently.

Immigration:

Last year, I was pretty apathetic about it. I would've been fine with an open-border policy. Now I'm not. While I wouldn't close the borders entirely, people really shouldn't be able to just waltz into our country like it's no big deal.

Transhumanism:

Various misunderstandings of the philosophy that I've held for awhile have been resolved recently. Logically speaking, there's no good reason for me to be against it--my personal distaste for having artificial robotic limbs doesn't really mean anything in the grand scheme, because there are people out there who wouldn't mind being part robot.

And besides, not all transhumanists want to be cyborgs anyway. There is modern technology that is transhumanistic. Spectacles, contact lenses, hearing aids, prosthetic limbs, and nanomachines are all transhuman endeavors, and it's pretty fucking difficult to be "opposed" to any of those things. It's just pragmatic.

Actually, that's what I wish it was called in the first place. "Technological pragmatism."

"Transhumanism" sounds retarded, and it has a negative connotation, thanks to sci-fi and Tumblr.

Luciana · November 21, 2015, 11:40:03 PM

I used to wonder what friendship could mean, honestly.

Until you all showed it's magic to me.

eggsalad · November 21, 2015, 11:40:05 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on November 21, 2015, 11:25:19 PM

"Transhumanism" sounds retarded, and it has a negative connotation, thanks to sci-fi and Tumblr.

Yeah seriously it makes me think that they want to "transcend humanity", which is kind of a semantic mess.

Verbatim · November 21, 2015, 11:43:40 PM

Quote from: eggsalad on November 21, 2015, 11:40:05 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on November 21, 2015, 11:25:19 PM
"Transhumanism" sounds retarded, and it has a negative connotation, thanks to sci-fi and Tumblr.
Yeah seriously it makes me think that they want to "transcend humanity", which is kind of a semantic mess.

Well, I'd certainly like to "transcend humanity", but just not exactly in the same ways transhumanists do.

The term just makes me think of terms like "otherkin" and other dumb shit. In sci-fi, transhumans are often portrayed in a negative, dystopic light, like in Half-Life 2. That's unfortunate, but you know, whatever.

Cindy · November 21, 2015, 11:53:45 PM

Robot bodies pls

RubMyBelly69 · November 22, 2015, 01:36:42 AM

"And then the boy philosopher smiled

For he had discovered that he had discovered nothing new."

challengerX · November 22, 2015, 06:07:51 PM

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Incan · November 22, 2015, 06:22:29 PM

Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:02:27 PM

I'm much more open to the idea that mass surveillance is actually helpful, despite being a unilateral human rights abuse. The recent tensions re: refugees and the possibility of extremists hiding among them is what prompted me to have a little more faith in the PATRIOT Act and America's ability to keep the people safe.

The issue with this is that France passed their own surveillance laws after Charlie Hebedo, yet that didn't manage to stop the attack at all.

Anonymous (User Deleted) · November 22, 2015, 07:04:05 PM

Quote from: Azumarill on November 21, 2015, 07:02:27 PM

I'm much more open to the idea that mass surveillance is actually helpful, despite being a unilateral human rights abuse. The recent tensions re: refugees and the possibility of extremists hiding among them is what prompted me to have a little more faith in the PATRIOT Act and America's ability to keep the people safe.

There's zero evidence to believe that, though. The government likes to say that mass spying has stopped '50' terrorist plots, but that number remains completely unsubstantiated to this day.

Now, clandestine operations such as spying are important to the security of a free state. Targeted spying has centuries of evidence supporting its efficacy. Mass spying has zilch. The only proven thing about it is that it can and will be abused.

OT: Obama is an ineffective foreign policy leader and the US needs to finally intervene against ISIS.

BaconShelf · November 23, 2015, 12:48:41 AM

Well. Before I joined this site, I was well on my way to becoming a tumblrite and everything that entails. So thank you Sep7 for BTFOing everything I used to think was true because looking back it's all fucking retarded and I narrowly avoided that.

Naru · November 23, 2015, 01:07:28 AM

ill say im more open to part of the lgbt community, anything past the T, i still cant really stand

Ásgeirr · November 23, 2015, 07:49:53 AM

Nothing, i dont really have any solid views on anything. Which could be good or bad.

I dont get into silly arguments but i dont have much to talk about more serious stuff.

Genghis Khan · November 23, 2015, 12:15:56 PM

I used to think 3000 asylum seekers a year is too much.

Casper · November 23, 2015, 02:40:26 PM

I've come to dislike the middle-class mainly because of how many dumb people with money I've met. Mostly those who have always had it and don't really know what it's like to go without.

Also, whiners everywhere about petty "social injustices".

DAS B00T x2 · November 23, 2015, 05:43:41 PM

I was some kind of pseudo Marxist progressive when I was like, fourteen.

God damn I'm so glad that I'm a libertarian now.

Cadenza has moved on · November 25, 2015, 03:23:58 AM

I've been reading "Mere Christianity" by C.S Lewis, and while I wouldn't call myself a Christian just yet, I'm in no way the atheist I used to be; I really get the feeling that the answers i've been looking for are closing in on me, or rather they were nearby all along but I lacked the life experience to understand them. In that regard i've also been growing more traditional and nationalistic in my world views, I love my country and my people and want to do my part to help.

Also I've been carefully going through the communist manifesto, and I'm not sure whether it's terrifying or laughable how obvious it's influences are in society and politics; and my opposition to those influences has only grown.

BaconShelf · November 25, 2015, 03:29:14 AM

Quote from: DAS"two in the sloot"B00T on November 23, 2015, 05:43:41 PM

I was some kind of pseudo Marxist progressive when I was like, fourteen.

Same. Except until like, 16.

Basically until I started going on bnet/ here

PSU · November 25, 2015, 11:05:39 AM

Was against gay marriage for the longest time. Now I'm cool with it.

Ginger · November 25, 2015, 12:33:33 PM

Quote from: Cadenza on November 25, 2015, 03:23:58 AM

I've been reading "Mere Christianity" by C.S Lewis, and while I wouldn't call myself a Christian just yet, I'm in no way the atheist I used to be; I really get the feeling that the answers i've been looking for are closing in on me, or rather they were nearby all along but I lacked the life experience to understand them. In that regard i've also been growing more traditional and nationalistic in my world views, I love my country and my people and want to do my part to help.

Also I've been carefully going through the communist manifesto, and I'm not sure whether it's terrifying or laughable how obvious it's influences are in society and politics; and my opposition to those influences has only grown.

Mere Christianity is a very good read!

And I think you mean patriotic rather than nationalistic. At least, I hope you do.

Ginger · November 25, 2015, 12:34:27 PM

Quote from: PSU on November 25, 2015, 11:05:39 AM

Was against gay marriage for the longest time. Now I'm cool with it.

I was afraid of Philly the Fanatic when I was young.

PSU · November 25, 2015, 12:50:51 PM

Quote from: Ginger on November 25, 2015, 12:34:27 PM

Quote from: PSU on November 25, 2015, 11:05:39 AM
Was against gay marriage for the longest time. Now I'm cool with it.
I was afraid of Philly the Fanatic when I was young.

haha many kids are.