Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 12:01:48 PM1) so killing someone is ok now?2) if you were the one being aborted, would you still support abortion? Support the fact that you never get a chance to live or breathe, simply because of somebody's preference?1) That's not the claim I was making. I'm saying it isn't innately, inherently, in-and-of-itself immoral to end another human life. 2) If I was the one being aborted? That really is a non-question. I wouldn't have any experience or intellectual capacity to know about what I was missing out on. It's virtually the same as complaining about the fact that many potential persons have been lost because a guy wanks into a sock. What a shame none of them will ever be able to live or breathe.
1) so killing someone is ok now?2) if you were the one being aborted, would you still support abortion? Support the fact that you never get a chance to live or breathe, simply because of somebody's preference?
.You don't believe every sperm is a person, and neither do I. However when conception has happened, and a human being is developing (meaning its going to be like you and me), that's totally different. As I said: deeming that future person as "inhuman" because people believe somehow that "doesn't look like a baby yet = not human" is just a cop-out.
As I said: deeming that future person as "inhuman" because people believe somehow that "doesn't look like a baby yet = not human" is just a cop-out.
Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 12:17:26 PM.You don't believe every sperm is a person, and neither do I. However when conception has happened, and a human being is developing (meaning its going to be like you and me), that's totally different. As I said: deeming that future person as "inhuman" because people believe somehow that "doesn't look like a baby yet = not human" is just a cop-out.Okay. You still have to justify how that's of any consequence.
Ending a life using a gun, or an abortion clinic, either way your murdering somebody. But only one is illegal.But I suppose we'll agree to disagree, because morals also play a factor.
Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:30:52 AMif your parents were pro abortion, you wouldn't even be here to argue about this.That really is a stupid thing to say. No one is "pro abortion". People are either pro choice, meaning that to some extent they support others' right to choose whether or not they have an abortion, or pro life, meaning that they oppose abortion in (almost) all cases.You're making it seem like there's people who just love getting abortions and will end every pregnancy with an abortion. That is of course utterly retarded, since there's other and more preferable ways of preventing pregnancy.
if your parents were pro abortion, you wouldn't even be here to argue about this.
Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:30:52 AMif your parents were pro abortion, you wouldn't even be here to argue about this.That really is a stupid thing to say. No one is "pro abortion".
Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 12:17:26 PMAs I said: deeming that future person as "inhuman" because people believe somehow that "doesn't look like a baby yet = not human" is just a cop-out.And saying that you can't kill something just because "IT LOOKS TOO HUMAN" is just a bunch of emotional heartstring propaganda bullshit.
It looks like a human because HOLY CRAP its a human baby. No duh.
I'd have no problem with life itself if life itself was voluntary, so that's why I'm an anti-natalist. So, unless you declare yourself an anti-natalist, you can't make the "right to choose" argument. It's internally inconsistent and hypocritical to do so.
Out of interest, if a person were to absolutely declare that his parents made the right choice - almost like an ex post declaration of consent - would that absolve the parents of any wrongdoing?
If a thief steals your money, wins the lottery, and gives the winnings to you, making you a profit, are you angry at him? He could have lost, he literally gambled your money away. If he lost, he would have nothing to return. Personally, I would've stomped a mudhole in him, verbally or otherwise.
And that's your prerogative, as I stated, but really, recognize the basic truth that theft is wrong and realize that's just what he did.^β I hate when that shit happens.
I'm talking about people who are capable of full empathy, now. That is, 90% of the rational population.
I don't understand. Are you saying moral truths exist for those who are empathetic?
Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 12:30:36 PMIt looks like a human because HOLY CRAP its a human baby. No duh.So you're telling me that it looks human because it is human....As if anyone was trying to tell you anything different.Patronizing prick.By the way, this "right to choose" argument is really bogus. I'd have no problem with life itself if life itself was voluntary, so that's why I'm an anti-natalist. So, unless you declare yourself an anti-natalist, you can't make the "right to choose" argument. It's internally inconsistent and hypocritical to do so.And I don't mean to change the subject or inject my philosophy into the discussion, but Jesus, that shit drives me UP the fucking wall.
Quote from: SecondClass on September 14, 2014, 02:48:13 AMQuote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 01:55:50 AMAs soon as 18 days after conception, there is a heartbeat.I just can't believe the number of people who never got a chance to live because of abortion.Millions and millions.Living =/= sentient. We kill billions of cows, chickens, and pigs every year. Logically and scientifically, a fetus in the first trimester is beneath those animals.Either way it'll become a human in time. Saying its "inhuman" before a certain point is simply self-justification.And no, animals are not comparable to a human life.
Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 01:55:50 AMAs soon as 18 days after conception, there is a heartbeat.I just can't believe the number of people who never got a chance to live because of abortion.Millions and millions.Living =/= sentient. We kill billions of cows, chickens, and pigs every year. Logically and scientifically, a fetus in the first trimester is beneath those animals.
As soon as 18 days after conception, there is a heartbeat.I just can't believe the number of people who never got a chance to live because of abortion.Millions and millions.
Name calling will get you nowhere kid.
And also yes, they WERE saying it isn't human, because murder is wrong but abortion isn't "up to a point". That point is when they think there is finally a human involved, when in fact its a human being the whole time.
It gets my dick hard.
Parents release picture of baby born at 24-week abortion limit
