It comes off as borderline schizophrenic.The US has been backing so many competing groups, almost none of whom actually like us. I have to wonder if anyone in Washington actually has a grasp of what's going on, or if the CIA, US Army and other fed organizations are competing internally for power or some shit.
As well as his push to pivot America from the Middle East to the Pacific Asia region. With his push to try to get the nation to give more attention to areas like Africa and the Latin America.
As for Latin America, I don't see much of a problem. Most of the countries there seem to be fine so it continues to make no sense by moving attention to a place that doesn't need it.
This is folly in his part. Not because I'm very anti-Obama, but because that would be a wasted effort. Africa is even more tribal-like than the Middle East. A major chunk of the continent is untamed wilderness and what civilizations that do exist outside of the southern countries is in constant civil war and strife. It's hard to look at a map of Africa with all its different countries and think that half of them are as stable as they are with their existence. Yes, we could go in and solidify peace, but the people there are barbaric. As soon as we leave they'll just go back to killing one another off civilian trucks with mounted machine guns through huts constructed out of cardboard and tin metal. As for Latin America, I don't see much of a problem. Most of the countries there seem to be fine so it continues to make no sense by moving attention to a place that doesn't need it. Unless of course he's a fan of Brazil and he's still butthurt about Germany raping them in soccer years ago. Quote from: Risay117 on September 21, 2016, 11:12:38 AMAs well as his push to pivot America from the Middle East to the Pacific Asia region. With his push to try to get the nation to give more attention to areas like Africa and the Latin America.
You do realize a direct cause of our immigration issue is the strife and conflict occurring in Latin American nations? While they are doing better than other parts of the world, I would hardly say the region, as a whole, is doing fine.
The Norks deserve no attention whatsoever, Ian.
Their leader's constant threats demands more attention than whatever is going on in Honduras unless there's something that will immediately put our country at risk. Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on September 21, 2016, 02:02:46 PMThe Norks deserve no attention whatsoever, Ian.
Obama flipped this plea on its head. “When you have a professional army,” he once told me, “that is well armed and sponsored by two large states”—Iran and Russia—“who have huge stakes in this, and they are fighting against a farmer, a carpenter, an engineer who started out as protesters and suddenly now see themselves in the midst of a civil conflict …” He paused. “The notion that we could have—in a clean way that didn’t commit U.S. military forces—changed the equation on the ground there was never true.” The message Obama telegraphed in speeches and interviews was clear: He would not end up like the second President Bush—a president who became tragically overextended in the Middle East, whose decisions filled the wards of Walter Reed with grievously wounded soldiers, who was helpless to stop the obliteration of his reputation, even when he recalibrated his policies in his second term. Obama would say privately that the first task of an American president in the post-Bush international arena was “Don’t do stupid shit.”
The only strife anyone ever mentions is from the country we're right next door to. I'd be more inclined to believe in problems in the other Latin countries if people actually talked about them. And in the case that they do, are they so important that they focus our attention away from other, more important areas that are far more deserving of our concern, such as Russia's increasing aggression or North Korea's increasing threats? Quote from: Icy on September 21, 2016, 01:13:43 PMYou do realize a direct cause of our immigration issue is the strife and conflict occurring in Latin American nations? While they are doing better than other parts of the world, I would hardly say the region, as a whole, is doing fine.
TIL there's no strife anywhere in latin america aside from mexico because "no one talks about it" (lol)ty for informing me of this wonderful fact™
The only strife anyone ever mentions is from the country we're right next door to.
I'd be more inclined to believe in problems in the other Latin countries if people actually talked about them.
And in the case that they do, are they so important that they focus our attention away from other, more important areas that are far more deserving of our concern, such as Russia's increasing aggression or North Korea's increasing threats?
Quote from: Ian on September 21, 2016, 02:01:37 PMThe only strife anyone ever mentions is from the country we're right next door to.Simply because we only discuss problems in Country A does not mean there aren't issues in Countries B-Z that impact us. Yes, it may be less of an impact because we don't share a land border with them, but to say "There's no strife because no one talks about it!" is, to be blunt, stupid.Quote from: Ian on September 21, 2016, 02:01:37 PM I'd be more inclined to believe in problems in the other Latin countries if people actually talked about them.Or you could just spent ten minutes doing research on the Internet, studying aid efforts going on to assist, etc. Quote from: Ian on September 21, 2016, 02:01:37 PM And in the case that they do, are they so important that they focus our attention away from other, more important areas that are far more deserving of our concern, such as Russia's increasing aggression or North Korea's increasing threats? What is "Multi-tasking" for $1,000, Alex?You do realize that our government doesn't all operate with eyes on one objective, correct? That the various branches of government are divided up to focus on multiple issues at the same time.
We don't need to waste time, money, and people on problems going on in Chile or Brazil or wherever. They never asked for help in these problems nor is it affecting us.
Simply because we only discuss problems in Country A does not mean there aren't issues in Countries B-Z that impact us. Yes, it may be less of an impact because we don't share a land border with them, but to say "There's no strife because no one talks about it!" is, to be blunt, stupid.
Or you could just spent ten minutes doing research on the Internet, studying aid efforts going on to assist, etc.
What is "Multi-tasking" for $1,000, Alex?You do realize that our government doesn't all operate with eyes on one objective, correct? That the various branches of government are divided up to focus on multiple issues at the same time.
Sure, Chile and Brazil don't need our help (And even that notion is questionable). Chile and Brazil aren't the only Latin American countries though. And once again, to stick your fingers in your ear and say the problem impacting nations to our south isn't affecting us is asinine.
We don't have unlimited resources and manpower, surely you understand that. It's a pipe dream to say that we can devote our attention equally to every problem in the world.
Regardless of what you think, immediate threats to us like the Middle East and ISIS are objectively more deserving of our government's concern than whatever is going on in Central and South America that's affecting them first before it affects us.
I'm saying the idea that we should abandon a very real threat to us for something that isn't immediately impacting us is what's asinine. That's like saying I should ignore the guy pointing a gun to me just because I have skin cancer.
We have (by far) the largest military in the world, one of the most robust volunteer agencies in the world through the Peace Corps, and are home to some of the larger charitable organizations in the world (Not including the Catholic Church). Yes, resources and manpower is going to finite. However, that isn't to say that we aren't one of the best equipped to actually assist nations that are in need. Not to mention we often conduct assistance alongside countries who, like us, have similar abilities in terms of military and volunteer manpower.
The needs of the people in the Middle East are not nearly equivalent to the needs of people in, say, Honduras. One requires aid that is more military based, while the other is much more humanitarian. And again, I'll repeat that the government of the United States is massive - the point where hundreds (if not thousands) can be focused on various issues at any given moment. That's the beauty of bureaucracy.
Nowhere did I say that the issues in the Middle East should be ignored, nor do I believe anyone else in this thread did.
Quote from: Icy on September 21, 2016, 06:48:24 PMWe have (by far) the largest military in the world, one of the most robust volunteer agencies in the world through the Peace Corps, and are home to some of the larger charitable organizations in the world (Not including the Catholic Church). Yes, resources and manpower is going to finite. However, that isn't to say that we aren't one of the best equipped to actually assist nations that are in need. Not to mention we often conduct assistance alongside countries who, like us, have similar abilities in terms of military and volunteer manpower. QuoteThe needs of the people in the Middle East are not nearly equivalent to the needs of people in, say, Honduras. One requires aid that is more military based, while the other is much more humanitarian. And again, I'll repeat that the government of the United States is massive - the point where hundreds (if not thousands) can be focused on various issues at any given moment. That's the beauty of bureaucracy. We are mostly involved with the Middle East because it affects our people and not the people in the country. We wouldn't do anything with military forces if it didn't affect our citizens. It's why we only give humanitarian aid in Africa to feed starving children and why we don't waste military might on stopping African warlords from savagely killing each other every other Tuesday. QuoteNowhere did I say that the issues in the Middle East should be ignored, nor do I believe anyone else in this thread did. I never said anyone in this thread did, I said Obama did. The whole argument was brought up from: QuoteAs well as his push to pivot America from the Middle East to the Pacific Asia region. With his push to try to get the nation to give more attention to areas like Africa and the Latin America. If we are so massive and omnipresent we have no reason to avert attention away from the Middle East. Either it is as you say and we have the resources to be able to focus on multiple areas at once or we don't and we need to make a hierarchy of what we must focus on. What you're saying is in conflict with what Obama is doing according to what OP and the article are stating.
Quote from: DAS B00T x2 on September 21, 2016, 02:02:46 PMThe Norks deserve no attention whatsoever, Ian. Their leader's constant threats demands more attention than whatever is going on in Honduras unless there's something that will immediately put our country at risk.
Obama and the Middle East
