France declares war on terror

Lemy the Lizerd · January 13, 2015, 04:45:28 PM

Fucking pussies. It took 3000 to get us going. 12 is nothing. We lose that to diabetes every day.

More Than Mortal · January 13, 2015, 04:46:25 PM

Quote from: Lemy the Lizerd on January 13, 2015, 04:45:28 PM

Fucking pussies. It took 3000 to get us going. 12 is nothing. We lose that to diabetes every day.

17*

gats · January 13, 2015, 04:50:56 PM

Quote from: Lemy the Lizerd on January 13, 2015, 04:45:28 PM

We lose that to diabetes every day.

I actually lol'd

Anonymous (User Deleted) · January 13, 2015, 05:16:36 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on January 13, 2015, 04:43:13 PM

Quote from: Kupo on January 13, 2015, 04:27:16 PM
That's what they said (and still say) about US domestic spying, and we know how that turned out.
Except we know this to be the case with the U.S.

Show me some evidence that France is equally unscrupulous in its intelligence applications and then we can get down a cost-benefit analysis.

Excuse my skepticism. You have a point, though.

Camnator · January 13, 2015, 05:21:53 PM

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rC · January 13, 2015, 05:37:05 PM

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHHHAHAHAA HOLY FUCKING SHIT, AGAIN? LOL, SENDING OUR BOYS TO DIE SOME MORE YAY!

Spoiler

Fucking pathetic, france.

More Than Mortal · January 13, 2015, 05:41:28 PM

Quote from: RC on January 13, 2015, 05:37:05 PM

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHHHAHAHAA HOLY FUCKING SHIT, AGAIN? LOL, SENDING OUR BOYS TO DIE SOME MORE YAY!

Spoiler
Fucking pathetic, france.

Did it escape your razor-sharp perception that people are already dying and will continue to die if something isn't done?

rC · January 13, 2015, 05:46:17 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on January 13, 2015, 05:41:28 PM

Quote from: RC on January 13, 2015, 05:37:05 PM

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHHHAHAHAA HOLY FUCKING SHIT, AGAIN? LOL, SENDING OUR BOYS TO DIE SOME MORE YAY!

Spoiler
Fucking pathetic, france.
Did it escape your razor-sharp perception that people are already dying and will continue to die if something isn't done?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War#Tables

Hundreds of thousands, approaching millions, of civilian deaths in Iraq alone since 2003. What the west is doing there isn't helping.

More Than Mortal · January 13, 2015, 05:59:10 PM

Quote from: RC on January 13, 2015, 05:46:17 PM

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War#Tables

Hundreds of thousands, approaching millions, of civilian deaths in Iraq alone since 2003. What the west is doing there isn't helping.

So first of all you criticise France for sending more soldiers to die, when there's no evidence for them even planning to do that, and now you're trying to make a tenuous link to Iraq? You know you're misrepresenting the statistics, too, given the obviously controversial nature of the numbers which, as your source states, ranges from around 100,000 to 1,000,000; if you want to try and claim some authority between there, you have a heavy burden.

This still doesn't prove anything, though. If you want to dumb it down so much as to play the numbers game, then Saddam killed around 180,000 Kurds with WMDs, at least the same number of Shi'a Muslims, raped Kuwait and drained the Mesopotamian Marshes--one of the greatest ecological disasters of our time. Not to mention goons under Saddam's protection murdered Said Hammami and further radicalised the Palestinian population, and the man who founded ISIS was living under his protection.

Iraq is in its position now because of Nouri al-Maliki's sectarianism and his unwillingness to incorporate the Sons of Iraq into the country's security apparatus, as well as the Coalition pulling out when they did which allowed ISIS to capture Syrian oilfields in the east of the country.

Naoto · January 13, 2015, 05:59:52 PM

Further progress. Nothing is gained by ignoring or capitulating to extremism. A lot is lost though.

gats · January 13, 2015, 06:19:54 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on January 13, 2015, 05:59:10 PM

Quote from: RC on January 13, 2015, 05:46:17 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War#Tables

Hundreds of thousands, approaching millions, of civilian deaths in Iraq alone since 2003. What the west is doing there isn't helping.
then Saddam killed around 180,000 Kurds with WMDs

Wasn't the Halabja massacre the only time Saddam gassed the Kurds?

More Than Mortal · January 13, 2015, 06:28:18 PM

Quote from: gooootsby on January 13, 2015, 06:19:54 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on January 13, 2015, 05:59:10 PM
Quote from: RC on January 13, 2015, 05:46:17 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War#Tables

Hundreds of thousands, approaching millions, of civilian deaths in Iraq alone since 2003. What the west is doing there isn't helping.
then Saddam killed around 180,000 Kurds with WMDs
Wasn't the Halabja massacre the only time Saddam gassed the Kurds?

No, I'm talking about the al-Anfal Campaign, which was ongoing at the time of the massacre but recognised as a separate event.

Super Irish · January 13, 2015, 06:52:16 PM

Oh would you look at that. France has their rallies, and David Cameron tries to rationalise an increase in security, in the form of giving more powers to the intelligence services.

And once again, Cleggy has opposed it...sort of.

Good France (so far...), Bad Britain.

Forgewolf · January 13, 2015, 07:01:26 PM

inb4francerightslost

Korra · January 13, 2015, 08:09:20 PM

Meta, why are you arguing with RC who has less brain cells than a rock.

rC · January 13, 2015, 08:38:47 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on January 13, 2015, 05:59:10 PM

when there's no evidence for them even planning to do that

Why wouldn't this escalate to that? What else could that mean? When Bush announced the war on terror in the days after 9/11, I don't think anyone expected that "war" to take us into Iraq, but it did. Expecting France to establish a presence in the Middle East considering this announcement isn't unreasonable.

Quote from: Meta Cognition on January 13, 2015, 05:59:10 PM

You know you're misrepresenting the statistics, too, given the obviously controversial nature of the numbers which, as your source states, ranges from around 100,000 to 1,000,000; if you want to try and claim some authority between there, you have a heavy burden.

The exact number isn't important, but the low end of 100,000 deaths is a lot, and for what? What's been gained from this conflict? Certainly not the seizure of WMDs, which was the goal in the first place, and certainly not stability. So, what?

rC · January 13, 2015, 08:39:19 PM

Quote from: Jill Valentine on January 13, 2015, 08:09:20 PM

Meta, why are you arguing with RC who has less brain cells than a rock.

Fuck off back to your anime.

challengerX · January 13, 2015, 08:55:37 PM

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Naru · January 13, 2015, 09:02:53 PM

What're the Frenchies gonna do?

Surrender?

Raptorx7 · January 13, 2015, 09:08:17 PM

Quote from: Naru (っ◕‿◕)っ on January 13, 2015, 09:02:53 PM

What're the Frenchies gonna do?

Surrender?

It took two pages for someone to say that, color me impressed.

Genghis Khan · January 14, 2015, 10:36:54 AM

French are as tough as the Maginot Line.

More Than Mortal · January 14, 2015, 12:09:18 PM

Quote from: RC on January 13, 2015, 08:38:47 PM

Why wouldn't this escalate to that? What else could that mean? When Bush announced the war on terror in the days after 9/11, I don't think anyone expected that "war" to take us into Iraq, but it did. Expecting France to establish a presence in the Middle East considering this announcement isn't unreasonable.

The point is that, unlike you, I'm not pretending to know what the French government is planning. Although, given their success in Mali, I'd trust France to fight an insurgency better than the U.S. or the U.K.

Quote

The exact number isn't important, but the low end of 100,000 deaths is a lot, and for what? What's been gained from this conflict? Certainly not the seizure of WMDs, which was the goal in the first place, and certainly not stability. So, what?

Actually, yes, the seizure of WMDs is one thing. Not just about 5,000 chemical weapons in Iraq, but the entire stockpile of Libya, too. Through which, by the way, we were able to trace the A.Q. Khan network. We removed a vital gulf state from the ownership of a genocidal, mass murdering psychopath and his Nazi-linked party; unearthed the international criminals he was harbouring; and turned Iraq into a secular republic, rather than a fundamentalist Islamic state.

Our original mistake was leaving him in power in 1992.