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Ask an anti-natalist anything.

Jocephalopod | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
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Then let me ask you a question then, bubba. Why does humanity NEED to exist?



humanity is the product of a life sustaining planet


there is no reason as to why we exist, only how

 
 
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Verbatim | Komm, süßer Tod
 
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Quote from: Meta Cognition on September 11, 2014, 06:26:07 PM
Doesn't anti-natalism rely on the general assumption that suffering is a vice and pleasure a virtue?
No, because... What? I mean, a "vice" is basically morally wrong behavior, and "virtue" morally good behavior. "Suffering" and "pleasure" aren't... behaviors, in the sense that they're not voluntary. They're involuntary responses to stimuli. One is negative, one is positive. You're measuring a chicken with a yardstick.

A better v-word associated on the suffering end is "value". Suffering has value, and pleasure has value. If there are no organisms that have a capacity to suffer in the universe, then the universe has no value.
Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 06:36:40 PM by Verbatim

 
 
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Quote from: Jocephalopod on September 11, 2014, 06:26:09 PM
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Then let me ask you a question then, bubba. Why does humanity NEED to exist?
humanity is the product of a life sustaining planet

there is no reason as to why we exist, only how
But I'm not asking you that. I'm asking you why humanity NEEDS to exist. Why do we need to be here. Why do we need to continue. I'm not asking you why we're here. That's why I put big letters on the word "NEED", so that you wouldn't miss it.

I put big letters on it, and you STILL missed it.

 
 
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I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
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Quote from: challengerX on September 11, 2014, 06:41:42 PM
Yes, as far as I'm concerned. I will do everything in my power to make my child's life good. But inevitably someone will do something bad to them.
It's astounding to me how little people listen to themselves when they talk. You admitted that you'd voluntarily allow your child to get hurt, because it's "inevitable". Instead of taking the moral high ground and not having kids that can get hurt at all. Now THAT'S protection. But you're not into that.
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I don't need to account for anything. I don't hurt innocent people, and I'm not going to cry and whine that innocent people are being hurt everyday. Tough fucking luck.
Then I hope it happens to you. I hope you get cancer, I hope you end up paraplegic. And then I'll say "Tough fucking luck."
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I know plenty of happy crippled people and people with prosthetics.
People's opinions on their own lives mean nothing. I've already established this.
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extinction isn't a solution. It's failure.
Failure to what? To not perpetuate stupid bullshit? Yeah, I wanna be a failure, then.
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Nothing should be done to make suicide easier.
"People shouldn't have the personal choice to end their lives peacefully."
So you want people to suffer when they commit suicide.

Why am I talking with you?
Good question.
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I'm not discussing this further
Oh, good. I'm glad. 'Cause... this is getting really dumb.

 
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I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
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Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 07:03:11 PM by challengerX

 
 
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If you think your life is worth living and you don't even have legs, you're an idiot.
If you think that person's opinion matters, you're an even bigger idiot.

 
 
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I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
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Quote from: challengerX on September 11, 2014, 07:11:15 PM
Funny, you tell me I'm a piece of shit for not worrying about every bad thing that happens in the world yet you call people who lost their legs idiots.

2 thumbs way up
Yes. If you're incapable of understanding that not having legs is horrible, you're an idiot. I hope you get your legs hacked off.

 
 
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I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
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Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 07:15:40 PM by challengerX

 
 
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Quote from: challengerX on September 11, 2014, 07:15:02 PM
It's horrible.
But no, it isn't! Because people still enjoy their lives anyway!!! That makes it all okay!!!!!

 
 
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I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
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Jocephalopod | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
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Quote from: Verbatim on September 11, 2014, 06:35:34 PM
Quote from: Jocephalopod on September 11, 2014, 06:26:09 PM
Quote
Then let me ask you a question then, bubba. Why does humanity NEED to exist?
humanity is the product of a life sustaining planet

there is no reason as to why we exist, only how
But I'm not asking you that. I'm asking you why humanity NEEDS to exist. Why do we need to be here. Why do we need to continue. I'm not asking you why we're here. That's why I put big letters on the word "NEED", so that you wouldn't miss it.

I put big letters on it, and you STILL missed it.


i don't understand why you need to justify humanities existence/absence but i'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say humanity doesn't need to exist nor does anything else

 
 
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Quote from: challengerX on September 11, 2014, 07:18:58 PM
Sure it does. People continue to enjoy and live their lives without legs/hands. Not to mention you can get prosthetics. The more we progress as a species, the more we can treat people.

But you of course, have no interest in that. All you care about is being a miserable hypocrite.
I'm not saying we shouldn't help these people and I'm not saying you shouldn't enjoy your life. I'm saying the exact opposite. But I'm also saying that you have to recognize your position and conclude that, rationally, you wouldn't put anyone else in your position. Just because you might enjoy your life the way it is doesn't mean your life is objectively enjoyable, and it CERTAINLY doesn't justify having kids, imposing life on other people. Chances are, they might not agree that life is all that special. They might loathe you. They ought to to loathe you if they aren't satisfied with your irresponsible choice to give birth to them.

You gave them the ability to SUFFER.
I mean, that's probably the worst thing you can ever, ever do, right.
Quote from: Jocephalopod on September 11, 2014, 07:21:56 PM
i don't understand why you need to justify humanities existence/absence but i'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say humanity doesn't need to exist nor does anything else
I need justification so that we can then justify life's current existence. If life doesn't need to exist, it creates more bad than good, then it should stop. Simple.

And life as we know it DOES create far more bad than good, I would argue.
Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 07:26:33 PM by Verbatim

 
 
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<.<
I'm sleep-posting at the moment, so I'll just leave my question and return to this thread when I get back home on saturday <.<

I always find it interesting because the basic concept is so alien, but that aside - What brought you to this stance? A detailed path would be appreciated, I obviously won't be able to read it right away but I'll be looking forwards to reading it as soon as possible >.>

How did you end up as an Anti-Natalist?

 
 
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Quote from: challengerX on September 11, 2014, 07:28:54 PM
I gave them life. With it comes enjoyment and suffering. As a good person I will increase the enjoyment as much as I can and teach them how to deal with suffering and avoid it.
And as a better person, you're not gonna have kids at all. Every time you masturbate, you're preventing millions of unborn children from suffering. Or, if you have a kid, give them a perfect life. And I mean perfect. Otherwise, you have no right to have kids.
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Other than that, that's all I can do. I'm not a god.
You'll play God, though. You're gonna take his role and act like you have any right to create such an impact on the world.
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I'm not going to feel guilty for having a kid because somebody ELSE gives them grief. I'm not going to refrain from having a kid because they will inevitable have bad experiences.
You've never really stated why, which is interesting to me. I can give you all these reasons why you shouldn't have kids, and all you're gonna say is, "NO. I THINK LIFE IS COOL, WHICH MEANS EVERYONE THINKS LIFE IS COOL. AND IF YOU DON'T, OFF YOURSELF. BUT I'M NOT GONNA LET YOU TO IT PAINLESSLY."
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If I'm poor and the world is headed towards shit fast, I definitely won't have a kid.
We're already there, bucko.

 
Jocephalopod | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
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I need justification so that we can then justify life's current existence. If life doesn't need to exist, it creates more bad than good, then it should stop. Simple.

And life as we know it DOES create far more bad than good, I would argue.



I really cannot see why anyone would want to believe that we either have to exist or perish


Life is Life. If you believe that every planet that supports life is somehow creating all the "bad" in the world which in itself is an entirely moral justification that holds no weight in our actual realm/scope of existence, you're basing this whole ideology on nonsense.

 
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I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
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Quote from: challengerX on September 11, 2014, 07:38:53 PM
Life isn't perfect, god doesn't exist. I said there's nothing to explain because if you can't value life yourself, how am I going to make you value it through an argument on an internet forum?
I said nothing ABOUT God existing, you silly fuck. That's precisely why I said you're taking his role.

I'm not asking you to convince me to value life. I'm asking you why you would have kids.

I already know the answer, of course (selfish, egocentric desire), but humor me.

 
i am karjala takaisin | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
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Ember used to be cool and funny

Now he's just gay
just before b.next hit

why did you change your coup from the magikarp thing to the edgy whatever you have as your avatar now

 
 
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Quote from: Ember on September 11, 2014, 07:49:47 PM
just before b.next hit

why did you change your coup from the magikarp thing to the edgy whatever you have as your avatar now
It's me. I chose it because it is me.

 
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Comms Officer is a freaking retard.
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Quote from: Weed Commando on September 11, 2014, 07:52:06 PM
What;s it like being butthurt that you couldn't get any?
I STAPLE TAPEWORMS ON MY PENIS SO THE FLESHWORM WILL DRINK BRAINJUICE FROM YOUR FETUS
I STAPLE TAPEWORMS ON MY PENIS SO THE FLESHWORM WILL DRINK BRAINJUICE FROM YOUR FETUS
I STAPLE TAPEWORMS ON MY PENIS SO THE FLESHWORM WILL DRINK BRAINJUICE FROM YOUR FETUS
I STAPLE TAPEWORMS ON MY PENIS SO THE FLESHWORM WILL DRINK BRAINJUICE FROM YOUR FETUS
Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 07:58:25 PM by Verbatim

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Comms Officer is a freaking retard.
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Quote from: Verbatim on September 11, 2014, 07:08:53 PM
If you think your life is worth living and you don't even have legs, you're an idiot.
If you think that person's opinion matters, you're an even bigger idiot.

I was trying to take you seriously in this thread but this post did it in for me.

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If you truly believe humanity needs to cease, why haven't you killed yourself yet?

You don't think humanity is pointless, or that any other species is more deserving of this planet than we are.
You're just a poser trying to be dark and edgy, and though you may believe that you adhere to your ideology, on your most intrinsic layer, you are just alone, and in denial of your loneliness.

You don't hate people.
You don't hate society.
You hate yourself.

So just get the fuck over it and an hero on a livestream.

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