Quote from: Ushan on April 19, 2015, 10:25:49 PM

So, you'd rid a being of the chance for happiness, on the assumption that it's only ever going to amount to being a chronically depressed blob of shit?

it's not an assumption; it will happen
that's been the process for all 100 billion humans thus far

even then, it's still probably not okay to gamble with another sentient being's welfare
because sure, maybe your kid will get lucky and have an awesome life

but maybe he won't

and that mere possibility alone should give you pause
you should think, "hmm, maybe we are being a little too reckless about this procreation thing"

That's the biggest, most asinine assumption I've ever seen

except it's not an assumption

Except it is, you have no evidence or substance to back it. Therefore its a gigantic assumption.

Quote from: Ushan on April 19, 2015, 10:25:49 PM

So, you'd rid a being of the chance for happiness, on the assumption that it's only ever going to amount to being a chronically depressed blob of shit?

it's not an assumption; it will happen
that's been the process for all 100 billion humans thus far

even then, it's still probably not okay to gamble with another sentient being's welfare
because sure, maybe your kid will get lucky and have an awesome life

but maybe he won't

Because things haven't improved since we figured out how to bash each other's heads in with largish rocks, right?

what i described is not a "chronically depressed blob of shit", by the way
i summarized the entire human condition in two terms

people consume, and people suffer

that's pretty much ALL we do

You do because you're a fucking childish edgelord, but most people actually have enough self-control to not suffer all the time unlike you.

No it isn't.

Describe what we do that makes life worth imposing on other sentient beings.

You will fail.

Pleasure, happiness, joy, discovery, creativity, satisfaction are some to name.

Pleasure, happiness, joy, and satisfaction are all basically the same exact thing. And they are filed under addiction. You can't get pleasure without getting your "fix" of something, so to speak. There is no free pleasure. All pleasure comes at the cost of something negative. All of it. No matter how small.

Discovery isn't positive. You can DISCOVER that you have pancreatic cancer. That's not a positive discovery. It certainly doesn't make life worth imposing just to discover things.

Creativity isn't necessarily positive either. The nuclear bomb was made by extremely creative/inventive people, but as it turns out, nuclear bombs are actually one of the most evil inventions ever. Even so, looking at all the positive creativity there is, it still does not outweigh the level of suffering endured by all sentient beings in some form or another. It can't justify the holocaust, as it were.

Pleasure, happiness, joy, and satisfaction are all basically the same exact thing. And they are filed under addiction. You can't get pleasure without getting your "fix" of something, so to speak. There is no free pleasure. All pleasure comes at the cost of something negative. All of it. No matter how small.

Okay. I got an A on my test I didn't study for and expected a to receive a D in.

Discovery isn't positive. You can DISCOVER that you have pancreatic cancer. That's not a positive discovery. It certainly doesn't make life worth imposing just to discover things.

hurr life isn't worth it since people can discover they have cancer

Creativity isn't necessarily positive either. The nuclear bomb was made by extremely creative/inventive people, but as it turns out, nuclear bombs are actually one of the most evil inventions ever. Even so, looking at all the positive creativity there is, it still does not outweigh the level of suffering endured by all sentient beings in some form or another. It can't justify the holocaust, as it were.

Not everyone suffers as much as a miserable, moronic edgelord such as yourself.

Quote from: Ushan on April 19, 2015, 11:29:00 PM

Being happy?

Your happiness doesn't justify all the terrors that exist in the world. Not in the slightest. If you think that's a good enough reason to have a kid, you're a moron.

And if you think that everyone suffers as much as you do, you're an even bigger moron. You're basing all of what you're saying on the false fact that everyone suffers as much as you do.

And if you think that everyone suffers as much as you do, you're an even bigger moron. You're basing all of what you're saying on the false fact that everyone suffers as much as you do.

Nope. It's not about me at all.

Quote from: Not Comms Officer on April 19, 2015, 11:31:32 PM

And if you think that everyone suffers as much as you do, you're an even bigger moron. You're basing all of what you're saying on the false fact that everyone suffers as much as you do.

Nope. It's not about me at all.

Then on what basis do you assume that people suffer enough for life to not be worth living? You have to have some sort of reference point.

Then on what basis do you assume that people suffer enough for life to not be worth living? You have to have some sort of reference point.

I just FUCKING went over one.

1 in 5 persons have a disability in the US alone.

Those are GODAWFUL odds.

You think they're "pretty good" odds, which makes you an insane lunatic.
But even then, I'm making the basic argument that you need a 100% safety rate, or bust.

If there's ANY CHANCE WHATSOEVER of your kid not having the perfect life, then it's wrong to have the kid.

And by the way, nobody's talking about what makes "life worth living".

What makes live worth living to you is YOUR business.
I'm talking about what makes life worth IMPOSING.

It's not delusional. Obviously, it's impossible to give your kid the perfect life.

That's why it can never be okay to give birth to one. To FORCE them into existence. To IMPOSE life on them.
It can only ever be wrong.

If you win the lottery, does that mean buying lottery tickets is a good idea?
FUCK no.

Quote from: Ushan on April 19, 2015, 11:29:00 PM

Being happy?

Your happiness doesn't justify all the terrors that exist in the world. Not in the slightest. If you think that's a good enough reason to have a kid, you're a moron.

I was talking more about the general capacity humans have to be happy. As in, not just me.

I agree that we don't live lives of such high quality that we're in danger of crossing into saccharine territory, but life gives you the opportunity to improve things for others and for yourself. And perhaps I am just an overly optimistic twit, but I do believe humanity is capable of treating itself of its self-destructive tendencies along with the other things that ail us that aren't so self-inflicted.

Quote from: Not Comms Officer on April 19, 2015, 11:51:30 PM

If you think that life shouldn't be worth imposing just because they can't live some fantasy life 100% of the time, that's very delusional.

I can make a number of metaphors. If I stole all of your money and spent it all on lottery tickets with the INTENT of making you a profit, is that okay? Would you appreciate that? Would you appreciate it if I didn't win, and I lost you all of your money? Would you like that? What if I won? Would that make it okay?

That's a fucking retarded metaphor since the chance of you living an enjoyable life is far, far higher than the chance of winning a lottery. Say, 85-90% comparing to 0.000000001% chance.

What's it like living in the 10-15% by the way?