Quote from: Meta Cognition on October 04, 2014, 04:50:44 PM

Quote from: The Hån on October 04, 2014, 04:47:02 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on October 04, 2014, 04:42:31 PM

Quote from: The Hån on October 04, 2014, 04:41:47 PM

WBC aren't fundamentalists. Does anyone believe that?(besides WBC themselves)

What else are they?

They're hypocrites and ignorant of their own beliefs. such should never considered fundamentalists.

The fundamentalists who protest against gays are ignorant of their scripture which protests against gays?

The bible teaches against Christians condemning others. Not supporting gay people is one thing, but actively harassing them and telling them they're gonna burn in hell is the exact opposite of what Christ teaches.

Corinthians 6:9: "Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,"

Timothy 1:9-10: "Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;"

Jude 7-8: "Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities."

All from the New Testament. This is also to discount several mentions of God's wrath delivered until Sodom and Gomorrah.

WBC aren't fundamentalists. Does anyone believe that?(besides WBC themselves)

What else are they?

Yes, we know that these kids will get their candy back in the end. But the kids themselves don’t know it, and the betrayal they feel is heartbreakingly genuine. This is no way to treat children.

Quote from: Yutaka on September 29, 2014, 02:29:50 PM

Usually most religion's fundamentals preach very good things, its just how some people interpret and twist it to fit their needs, thats my problem. Political systems now a days are good examples of this, especially in the US.

Neither of you obviously read the OP in which the actual scriptural teachings preach some ridiculously and profoundly immoral things.

I went to two primary schools, one private and one State, both secular.

They taught the creation story (symbolically, not literally) as truth.

I even remember one occasion in the State school where the teacher said "We're all Christians, here, aren't we?" and began nodding her head. As I looked around, I was the only kid not nodding my head.

I legit don't understand how you could have a problem with mother Theresa.i stopped reading there by the way.

She thought abortion was the biggest threat to peace on Earth.

She supported Indira Gandhi.

She didn't discriminate between people who could be cured or not, thought poverty and suffering brought people closer to religion, encouraged her sisters to rely largely on faith instead of medicine and forcefully baptised the dying.

She also accepted stolen money from Charles Keating and refused to return it.

To name but a few.

I'm confused by what you're trying to say here, it this a tie-in to your earlier thread on moral facts?

Why did you refer to antisemitism but leave out racism in general? Also cruelty to animals needs a bit more of a definition, as that could be twisted to saying eating meat, medical research and exterminating pests are immoral.

Anti-semitism, historically, has earned its exceptional status in comparison to other forms of racism out of sheer brutality. I'm not denying racism is, of itself, brutish also.

In terms of animal cruelty - sadistic activities for mere pleasure, as opposed to some measurable social gain.

Quote from: Meta Cognition on October 03, 2014, 03:36:02 PM

Quote from: IcyWind on October 03, 2014, 03:35:04 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on October 03, 2014, 03:32:35 PM

We really can't condemn them.

And why is that?

Spoiler

I was parodying an unfortunately large number of secular liberals.

I don't know anyone who would even think or say that phrase regarding ISIS - UK thing?

Eh, I was pushing the envelope with ISIS. You generally find it with religion as a whole, particularly Islam though, as well as the contingent cultures associated with such groups.

I'm sure a lot of liberals could and do condemn ISIS for the suffering they cause, but I imagine at least some of them would be queasy to do it on explicitly moral grounds.

We really can't condemn them.

Who are we to claim cultural superiority?

>piers morgan

And no that isn't a joke, even though that last bit sounds funny.

No, not at all. I agree.

More out of inevitability than desire, but it certainly doesn't look as bleak as some people would have us believe.

Well that wouldn't be very capitalist.

I'm surprised to find how true that statement actually is, to be honest.

Seriously?

What.

The.

Hell.

So I guess there are moral facts, but also some grey areas.

Oh, of course.

I feel (though open to other ideas) as though our morals change as we become smarter, similar to our understanding of the universe.  100's of years ago things like chemical imbalances in the brain or retardations weren't taken into consideration when determining the punishment for crimes.  Today, we better understand these things and do look at them.  We also better understand what predisposes people to certain misbehaviors and think about it too. There may be other things we can't grasp as we don't know about them and therefore can't factor them into our decisions.  Down the road we may find out about them and it could alter what we think of as moral.

So?

You could say exactly the same about any other area of scientific enquiry.