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Messages - The Lord Slide Rule

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3061
The Flood / Re: HAPPY NEARLY CHRISTMAS!
« on: November 17, 2014, 06:03:16 PM »
nig, it ain't even thanksgiving yet. I like to celebrate my holidays one at the time.

3062
The Flood / Re: Apply hype here
« on: November 17, 2014, 05:01:06 PM »
I have never seen Jurassic park, I've seen bits and I liked what I saw
Watch the first one. You must. The other two are eh at best but the first one is great.

3065
The Flood / Re: Apply hype here
« on: November 17, 2014, 04:33:33 PM »

3067
Serious / Re: True randomness: Does it exist?
« on: November 17, 2014, 03:58:10 PM »
I don't think humans can make true randomness, but the universe is completely random in what it does.


http://fractalfoundation.org/resources/what-is-chaos-theory/
Surely that doesn't make sense.

Humans aren't apart or separate from the functioning of the Universe at a fundamental level.

You are right. I refute what I said. Sleep deprivation makes one not think correctly. Still though, Chaos Theory is worth a read to those interested in randomness.
I wouldn't call chaotic systems, in the theoretical sense, random. From moment to moment, considered as individual subsystems they can appear quite predictable but considered over a whole the system becomes quite unstable and unpredictable. This is simply due to the highly non-linear nature of chaotic systems and heavy dependence on initial conditions of the relevant variables.

3068
The Flood / Re: I was going to study for a test I need to pass.
« on: November 17, 2014, 02:41:37 PM »
>that feel, I know it

3069
The Flood / Re: ITT: Post only bad music
« on: November 17, 2014, 02:40:00 PM »
heh

3070
The Flood / Re: >doesn't listen to music made in london
« on: November 17, 2014, 02:29:48 PM »

3071
The Flood / Re: ITT: usernames for le Dustin-chan
« on: November 17, 2014, 02:27:54 PM »
Dustin Eats Smegma

3072
The Flood / Re: To people who think I'm a white knight
« on: November 17, 2014, 02:20:58 PM »

3073
The Flood / Re: ITT: usernames for le Dustin-chan
« on: November 17, 2014, 02:14:30 PM »
Crustin

3074
The Flood / Re: it's_happening.gif
« on: November 17, 2014, 01:52:34 PM »

3075
Serious / Re: Feminism in decline
« on: November 17, 2014, 01:42:45 PM »
Let me pose a question to you: Why are you so against feminism?
It's so irrelevant and antiquated in the western world that it isn't even funny anymore. I wouldn't have that much a problem with feminism if it weren't for the nutjobs that have hijacked the movement and the amount of reprehensible shit they've tried to pull.

So, your biggest problem is with the extremists in the movement.

Something that happens with any movement.
You'd be hard pressed to find a moderate feminist that doesn't believe in the gender pay gap, or that "teaching men not to rape" is actually a good idea.
inb4urmisunderstood

3076
Serious / Re: Feminism in decline
« on: November 17, 2014, 01:40:35 PM »
Let me pose a question to you: Why are you so against feminism?
Quote
Good causes sometimes have bad consequences. Blacks, women, and other historical out-groups were right to demand equality before the law and the full respect and liberties due to any member of our civilization; but the tactics they used to “raise consciousness” have sometimes veered into the creepy and pathological, borrowing the least sane features of religious evangelism.

One very notable pathology is a form of argument that, reduced to essence, runs like this: “Your refusal to acknowledge that you are guilty of {sin,racism,sexism, homophobia,oppression…} confirms that you are guilty of {sin,racism,sexism, homophobia,oppression…}.” I’ve been presented with enough instances of this recently that I’ve decided that it needs a name. I call this general style of argument “kafkatrapping”, and the above the Model A kafkatrap. In this essay, I will show that the kafkatrap is a form of argument that is so fallacious and manipulative that those subjected to it are entitled to reject it based entirely on the form of the argument, without reference to whatever particular sin or thoughtcrime is being alleged. I will also attempt to show that kafkatrapping is so self-destructive to the causes that employ it that change activists should root it out of their own speech and thoughts.

My reference, of course, is to Franz Kafka’s “The Trial”, in which the protagonist Josef K. is accused of crimes the nature of which are never actually specified, and enmeshed in a process designed to degrade, humiliate, and destroy him whether or not he has in fact committed any crime at all. The only way out of the trap is for him to acquiesce in his own destruction; indeed, forcing him to that point of acquiescence and the collapse of his will to live as a free human being seems to be the only point of the process, if it has one at all.

This is almost exactly the way the kafkatrap operates in religious and political argument. Real crimes – actual transgressions against flesh-and-blood individuals – are generally not specified. The aim of the kafkatrap is to produce a kind of free-floating guilt in the subject, a conviction of sinfulness that can be manipulated by the operator to make the subject say and do things that are convenient to the operator’s personal, political, or religious goals. Ideally, the subject will then internalize these demands, and then become complicit in the kafkatrapping of others.

Sometimes the kafkatrap is presented in less direct forms. A common variant, which I’ll call the Model C, is to assert something like this: “Even if you do not feel yourself to be guilty of {sin,racism,sexism, homophobia,oppression…}, you are guilty because you have benefited from the {sinful,racist,sexist,homophobic,oppressive,…} behavior of others in the system.” The aim of the Model C is to induce the subject to self-condemnation not on the basis of anything the individual subject has actually done, but on the basis of choices by others which the subject typically had no power to affect. The subject must at all costs be prevented from noticing that it is not ultimately possible to be responsible for the behavior of other free human beings.

A close variant of the model C is the model P: “Even if you do not feel yourself to be guilty of {sin,racism,sexism, homophobia,oppression…}, you are guilty because you have a privileged position in the {sinful,racist,sexist,homophobic,oppressive,…} system.” For the model P to work, the subject must be prevented from noticing that the demand to self-condemn is not based on the subject’s own actions or choices or feelings, but rather on an in-group identification ascribed by the operator of the kafkatrap.

It is essential to the operation of all three of the variants of the kafkatrap so far described that the subject’s attention be deflected away from the fact that no wrongdoing by the subject, about which the subject need feel personally guilty, has actually been specified. The kafkatrapper’s objective is to hook into chronic self-doubt in the subject and inflate it, in much the same way an emotional abuser convinces a victim that the abuse is deserved – in fact, the mechanism is identical. Thus kafkatrapping tends to work best on weak and emotionally vulnerable personalities, and poorly on personalities with a strong internalized ethos.

In addition, the success of a model P kafkatrap depends on the subject not realizing that the group ascription pinned on by the operator can be rejected. The subject must be prevented from asserting his or her individuality and individual agency; better, the subject must be convinced that asserting individuality is yet another demonstration of denial and guilt. Need it be pointed out how ironic this is, given that kafkatrappers (other than old-fashioned religious authoritarians) generally claim to be against group stereotyping?

There are, of course, other variants. Consider the model S: “Skepticism about any particular anecdotal account of {sin,racism,sexism,homophobia,oppression,…}, or any attempt to deny that the particular anecdote implies a systemic problem in which you are one of the guilty parties, is itself sufficient to establish your guilt.” Again, the common theme here is that questioning the discourse that condemns you, condemns you. This variant differs from the model A and model P in that a specific crime against an actual person usually is in fact alleged. The operator of the kafkatrap relies on the subject’s emotional revulsion against the crime to sweep away all questions of representativeness and the basic fact thatthe subject didn’t do it.

I’ll finish my catalog of variants with the verson of the kafkatrap that I think is most likely to be deployed against this essay, the Model L: “Your insistence on applying rational skepticism in evaluating assertions of pervasive {sin,racism,sexism,homophobia, oppression…} itself demonstrates that you are {sinful,racist,sexist,homophobic,oppressive,…}.” This sounds much like the Model S, except that we are back in the territory ofunspecified crime here. This version is not intended to induce guilt so much as it is to serve as a flank guard for other forms of kafkatrapping. By insisting that skepticism is evidence of an intention to cover up or excuse thoughtcrime, kafkatrappers protect themselves from having their methods or motives questioned and can get on with the serious business of eradicating thoughtcrime.

Having shown how manipulative and psychologically abusive the kafkatrap is, it may seem almost superfluous to observe that it is logically fallacious as well. The particular species of fallacy is sometimes called “panchreston”, an argument from which anything can be deduced because it is not falsifiable. Notably, if the model A kafkatrap is true, the world is divided into two kinds of people: (a) those who admit they are guilty of thoughtcrime, and (b) those who are guilty of thoughtcrime because they will not admit to being guilty of thoughtcrime. No one can ever be innocent. The subject must be prevented from noticing that this logic convicts and impeaches the operator of the kafkatrap!

I hope it is clear by now that the particular flavor of thoughtcrime alleged is irrelevant to understanding the operation of kafkatraps and how to avoid being abused and manipulated by kafkatrappers. In times past the kafkatrapper was usually a religious zealot; today, he or she is just as likely to be advancing an ideology of racial, gender, sexual-minority, or economic grievance. Whatever your opinion of any of these causes in their ‘pure’ forms may be, there are reasons that the employment of kafkatrapping is a sure sign of corruption.

The practice of kafkatrapping corrupts causes in many ways, some obvious and some more subtle. The most obvious way is that abusive and manipulative ways of controlling people tend to hollow out the causes for which they are employed, smothering whatever worthy goals they may have begun with and reducing them to vehicles for the attainment of power and privilege over others.

A subtler form of corruption is that those who use kafkatraps in order to manipulate others are prone to fall into them themselves. Becoming unable to see out of the traps, their ability to communicate with and engage anyone who has not fallen in becomes progressively more damaged. At the extreme, such causes frequently become epistemically closed, with a jargon and discourse so tightly wrapped around the logical fallacies in the kafkatraps that their doctrine is largely unintelligible to outsiders.

These are both good reasons for change activists to consider kafkatraps a dangerous pathology that they should root out of their own causes. But the best reason remains that kafkatrapping is wrong. Especially, damningly wrong for anyone who claims to be operating in the cause of freedom.

UPDATE: A commenter pointed out the Model D: “The act of demanding a definition of {sin,racism,sexism,homophobia,oppression} that can be consequentially checked and falsified proves you are {sinful,racist,sexist, homophobic, oppressive}.”

UPDATE2: The Model M: “The act of arguing against the theory of anti-{sin,racism,sexism,homophobia,oppression} demonstrates that you are either {sinful,racist,sexist, homophobic, oppressive} or do not understand the theory of anti-{sin,racism,sexism,homophobia,oppression}, and your argument can therefore be dismissed as either corrupt or incompetent.”

Model T: Designated victims of {sin,racism,sexism,homophobia,oppression} who question any part of the theory of {sin,racism,sexism,homophobia,oppression} demonstrate by doing so that they are not authentic members of the victim class, so their experience can be discounted and their thoughts dismissed as internalized {sin,racism,sexism,homophobia,oppression}

This isn't just the crazies either. You see it at every level of the ideology and until they're rid of it I can't take it seriously. It's intellectually dishonest and emotionally abusive to boot.

3077
Serious / Re: What are the strongest arguments for God?
« on: November 17, 2014, 11:56:05 AM »
The existence of the universe and the third law of motion. I can post more substantial things but the vibe I get from this forum is generally hostile to this subject material.
I'd be interested to read it if you'd be inclined to post it <.<
pretty sure he's referring to Aquinas'  arguments from first cause.

3078
The Flood / Re: Anyone here familar with STEM cell research?
« on: November 17, 2014, 11:42:30 AM »
No, your friend is wrong, you need the sperm cells from STEM major graduates, that will make you smarter. Don't get Liberal arts sperm though, it will have the opposite effect.
( ͡o ͜ʖ ͡o)

3079
Serious / Re: True randomness: Does it exist?
« on: November 17, 2014, 11:25:37 AM »
Heisenberg's Uncertainty implies a randomness to behavior of subatomic particles, and quantum mechanics necessitates randomness at a quantum level. Radioactive decay is also a random process.

But in typical day-to-day stuff? No, everything has a cause and effect, but the inability to perceive those causes leads to labeling something as random.
I guess it depends on how one defines "truly random". To me quantum mechanical uncertainty isn't true randomness. You can make predictions about quantum systems, yes they're probability based but true randomness ( to me at least) seems to imply that all bets are off (kek). Quantum systems can still be shown to follow certain relations (ie. there is this much energy in the system therefor the outcome will most likely be so and so)

I guess this where we bring causality into the mix and try to decide whether it is a good gauge of whether something is random or not.

3080
The Flood / Re: Sweden is a shithole.
« on: November 17, 2014, 11:11:30 AM »
Ah...

Bugger.
They're applying something known as the Bechdel Test, which is nothing new. It's been around for 30 years already and has been widely discussed in the cinematic community. Basically, if a movie features two (named) female characters talking to one another about something other than a man, it passes the test.

Ohh, that thing?
That's a pretty shallow measure in my opinion >.>
It definitely is. It's hard to come up with a better way of judging gender equality and equal representation in movies though. The more you're going to analyse a movie, the more subjective and personal it becomes.
> mfw you've just laid out everything wrong w/ sociology departments around the world

3081
The Flood / Re: NO LAWYER, NO WITNESSES
« on: November 17, 2014, 10:49:30 AM »
YOU AND ME BABY AIN'T NOTHING BUT MAMMALS
SO WE'LL DO IT LIKE THEY DO IT ON THE DISCOVERY CHANNEL
SWEAT BABY SWEAT BABY, SEX IS A TEXAS DROUGHT

3082
The Flood / Re: What classes are you taking next semester?
« on: November 17, 2014, 10:44:27 AM »
Psychology funnily enough >.>

Don't be silly, pokemon can't go to University. <.<
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Celadon_University

<_________________________<

They even teach Psychology there.

Still a university for people.

Spoiler
Are you getting Pokemon Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire?
Is psyduck yellow?

I paid off my preorder yesterday e.e

And it's almost fortunate that we have to wait an extra week, because it means I should have time to finish breeding a shiny eevee to start off OR with :D

Fucking yanks get it a week early, what the hell. <.<

What the hell, Japan.
lol we dropped the nuke on them and they still like us better

:p

3083
Serious / Re: What are the strongest arguments for God?
« on: November 17, 2014, 10:42:46 AM »
I've come across a couple that could be pretty convincing given some modification and a willingness to forgo empiricism.

3084
The Flood / Re: What classes are you taking next semester?
« on: November 17, 2014, 10:09:26 AM »
In American universities, you have a set of courses for your major (Such as for me, Journalism, Media Ethics, Digital Media, etc.) on top of General Education Courses (Sciences, Math, Composition, Art, etc.). You take them as you wish, but all of the requirements need to be filled before you can graduate.

certain classes are required but you can choose when you take them. There are also electives and capstones that you can choose from certain areas based on what your major is.
So other than taking lectures for your degree you have to take extra classes in other subjects?

Wtf is the point? Surely at university you should be past the point of taking different subjects you don't care about and should be focused specifically on what you want to do.

Trust me - it's been brought up at many universities.

It's mainly to ensure we're well rounded in various subjects, but it's honestly pointless and only causes more stress and chaos when it comes to trying and working on your core major classes.
^

3085
Serious / Re: True randomness: Does it exist?
« on: November 17, 2014, 10:07:36 AM »
What do you mean by true randomness?

When I think true randomness I think of there being no logic to it.

With math, basically being logic, I'd think not.

Huh, that's a lot more difficult a question to answer than I imagined. No method of predicting an outcome based on any form of algorithm? I swear there was a distinct difference to unpredictability that I came up with before...

Now that you mention it, wouldn't a simplification be "events occur without any causation?"

Hmmm...
Unpredictability, I generally think chaos theory. Where causation from one moment to the next is obvious but the system considered overall is highly unstable and unpredictable.

Then there is the quantum mechanical style of unpredictability, still it can be shown to follow a logic or chain of causation.

3086
The Flood / Re: What classes are you taking next semester?
« on: November 17, 2014, 10:02:53 AM »
wtf is this?

In the UK you just choose a degree you want to pursue and that's it. what's with choosing different classes each semester and what not?
certain classes are required but you can choose when you take them. There are also electives and capstones that you can choose from certain areas based on what your major is.

3087
The Flood / Re: Fat
« on: November 17, 2014, 09:57:15 AM »
And you're at fault you temptress of fast food! You give us promise of convenience and grease in return for our health.
>implying

3088
Serious / Re: First contact
« on: November 17, 2014, 09:54:35 AM »
We show them a mainstream rap music video and drive them off
Then we promise to turn it off in return for some of their interstellar drive technology. As a show of good faith we will offer them some our probing technology.

3089
Serious / Re: True randomness: Does it exist?
« on: November 17, 2014, 09:51:11 AM »
What do you mean by true randomness?

When I think true randomness I think of there being no logic to it.

With math, basically being logic, I'd think not.

3090
The Flood / Re: What classes are you taking next semester?
« on: November 17, 2014, 09:44:39 AM »
Linear
Differential Equations
Statics
E&M
Modern physics (basically intro to Quant, GR, and Thermo)

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