Quote from: Sprungli on January 09, 2015, 04:45:38 PM.It plays like a Halo game, no argumentsBut it doesn't.
.It plays like a Halo game, no arguments
i was gonna inb4 343 defenders but i was too late.
They don't understand Bungie's vision for the original trilogy
and they certainly don't understand why CE/2/3 were the greatest FPS games of this century.
Bungie began to alienate the core fanbase in Reach.
and 343 continued that with 4. 343 had a chance to bring it back.
Finally, some quality arena FPS after all these years.
we have Halo back!
Halo is never going to be what it was in the halcyon days of H2 and H3.
That's what happens when you forget the fans and pander to the big wigs.
Quote from: goootsby on January 09, 2015, 04:50:39 PMQuote from: Sprungli on January 09, 2015, 04:45:38 PM.It plays like a Halo game, no argumentsBut it doesn't.Have you actually spent time playing the beta?
it's just doesn't play like a Halo game.
This always happens when a new Halo game comes out. I find it rather silly considering its just a really early beta.
Now, let's make this completely clear. I want to hear some kind of agreement on the subject from both sides: is Halo 5 closer to a twitch shooter than "previous" Halo games? I don't want "Well it's kind of like Halo x and y game together", I want to know how the pacing compares. Is it following the trend of the series in getting faster and faster?
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 08:52:11 PMNow, let's make this completely clear. I want to hear some kind of agreement on the subject from both sides: is Halo 5 closer to a twitch shooter than "previous" Halo games? I don't want "Well it's kind of like Halo x and y game together", I want to know how the pacing compares. Is it following the trend of the series in getting faster and faster?mobility-wise, yes. it's hard to say when it comes to the actual gunplay. if the final game keeps the arena-style map pickups the original trilogy had, that will be a step back closer to arena style and further from the class-based games that influenced the mobility aspects of the game and the changes to gunplay mechanics.
Quote from: Azumarill on January 09, 2015, 08:54:55 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 08:52:11 PMNow, let's make this completely clear. I want to hear some kind of agreement on the subject from both sides: is Halo 5 closer to a twitch shooter than "previous" Halo games? I don't want "Well it's kind of like Halo x and y game together", I want to know how the pacing compares. Is it following the trend of the series in getting faster and faster?mobility-wise, yes. it's hard to say when it comes to the actual gunplay. if the final game keeps the arena-style map pickups the original trilogy had, that will be a step back closer to arena style and further from the class-based games that influenced the mobility aspects of the game and the changes to gunplay mechanics.I dislike sprint in Halo. Not because "m-muh slow and deliberate", fucking UT players run at DOOMGUY speeds. Arena games usually have Mach-1 running in them. My problem is basically what was outlined in the OP: it's not a game that was made with sprint in mind, so adding it in introduces more problems than it fixes (see: none). If they went back and rebuilt the system with it in mind? I can't say I'd be thrilled to have another twitch shooter, but it'd be better than the build of compromises that currently exists.I like that they're not going full-on twitch shooter, but there isn't really a "healthy middle" between the two styles. A game that's half arena, half twitch shooter is only half good at being an arena shooter and half good at being a twitch shooter. That's even in the case that the game has zero flaws outside of the compromises.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 09:03:21 PMQuote from: Azumarill on January 09, 2015, 08:54:55 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 08:52:11 PMNow, let's make this completely clear. I want to hear some kind of agreement on the subject from both sides: is Halo 5 closer to a twitch shooter than "previous" Halo games? I don't want "Well it's kind of like Halo x and y game together", I want to know how the pacing compares. Is it following the trend of the series in getting faster and faster?mobility-wise, yes. it's hard to say when it comes to the actual gunplay. if the final game keeps the arena-style map pickups the original trilogy had, that will be a step back closer to arena style and further from the class-based games that influenced the mobility aspects of the game and the changes to gunplay mechanics.I dislike sprint in Halo. Not because "m-muh slow and deliberate", fucking UT players run at DOOMGUY speeds. Arena games usually have Mach-1 running in them. My problem is basically what was outlined in the OP: it's not a game that was made with sprint in mind, so adding it in introduces more problems than it fixes (see: none). If they went back and rebuilt the system with it in mind? I can't say I'd be thrilled to have another twitch shooter, but it'd be better than the build of compromises that currently exists.I like that they're not going full-on twitch shooter, but there isn't really a "healthy middle" between the two styles. A game that's half arena, half twitch shooter is only half good at being an arena shooter and half good at being a twitch shooter. That's even in the case that the game has zero flaws outside of the compromises.the closest analogue to the H5 beta that we have right now is lolReach, and we all know how that ended. normalizing abilities was a step in the right direction- at least now everyone is on equal footing again. sprint is only really a problem on smaller arena-style maps, which sucks because those tended to be the best maps in the original series. midship and citadel, for example, would have been absolutely god fucking awful with sprint, but something like sandbox or zanzibar wouldnt have been that bad with sprint.
Quote from: Azumarill on January 09, 2015, 09:10:57 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 09:03:21 PMQuote from: Azumarill on January 09, 2015, 08:54:55 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 08:52:11 PMNow, let's make this completely clear. I want to hear some kind of agreement on the subject from both sides: is Halo 5 closer to a twitch shooter than "previous" Halo games? I don't want "Well it's kind of like Halo x and y game together", I want to know how the pacing compares. Is it following the trend of the series in getting faster and faster?mobility-wise, yes. it's hard to say when it comes to the actual gunplay. if the final game keeps the arena-style map pickups the original trilogy had, that will be a step back closer to arena style and further from the class-based games that influenced the mobility aspects of the game and the changes to gunplay mechanics.I dislike sprint in Halo. Not because "m-muh slow and deliberate", fucking UT players run at DOOMGUY speeds. Arena games usually have Mach-1 running in them. My problem is basically what was outlined in the OP: it's not a game that was made with sprint in mind, so adding it in introduces more problems than it fixes (see: none). If they went back and rebuilt the system with it in mind? I can't say I'd be thrilled to have another twitch shooter, but it'd be better than the build of compromises that currently exists.I like that they're not going full-on twitch shooter, but there isn't really a "healthy middle" between the two styles. A game that's half arena, half twitch shooter is only half good at being an arena shooter and half good at being a twitch shooter. That's even in the case that the game has zero flaws outside of the compromises.the closest analogue to the H5 beta that we have right now is lolReach, and we all know how that ended. normalizing abilities was a step in the right direction- at least now everyone is on equal footing again. sprint is only really a problem on smaller arena-style maps, which sucks because those tended to be the best maps in the original series. midship and citadel, for example, would have been absolutely god fucking awful with sprint, but something like sandbox or zanzibar wouldnt have been that bad with sprint.This may be an extremely unfeasible, stupid idea, but what if sprint was a game option? not an "innate ability" or requirement, but something like insta-kill headshots for gametypes like SWAT. That way you could have one gametype to be the standard with all the bells and whistles that's played on medium to large sized maps, and another without sprint and its pack of merry restrictions that come with it for smaller maps. That way sprint doesn't harm the gameflow on small maps and 343 still gets to pretend that sprint is a good idea.I seem to be one of the few that was okay with Reach. I didn't love it, but I didn't hate it. It did a number of things right and a number of things wrong. That being said, I wish it was half as good as the beta. If the Invasion Beta was a sample of the content instead of half of it (disregarding Forge World maps) then I don't think I would have played anything else.
This may be an extremely unfeasible, stupid idea, but what if sprint was a game option? not an "innate ability" or requirement, but something like insta-kill headshots for gametypes like SWAT. That way you could have one gametype to be the standard with all the bells and whistles that's played on medium to large sized maps, and another without sprint and its pack of merry restrictions that come with it for smaller maps. That way sprint doesn't harm the gameflow on small maps and 343 still gets to pretend that sprint is a good idea.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 09:21:32 PMThis may be an extremely unfeasible, stupid idea, but what if sprint was a game option? not an "innate ability" or requirement, but something like insta-kill headshots for gametypes like SWAT. That way you could have one gametype to be the standard with all the bells and whistles that's played on medium to large sized maps, and another without sprint and its pack of merry restrictions that come with it for smaller maps. That way sprint doesn't harm the gameflow on small maps and 343 still gets to pretend that sprint is a good idea.The thing is 343 has to make the maps with sprint in mind so they get stretched. Removing it would just make it awkward. Midship plays dramatically different in Halo 5 than Halo 2 or Heretic in Halo 3. Instead of the "remixes" we got now I'd rather see maps made without sprint in mind. And instead of gimmicky sprint I'd prefer 343 add a speed boost ability where you can just move 15-25% faster in all directions. It would mean not lowering your gun to chase people and would over all be more competitive for strafing.
Is it following the trend of the series in getting faster and faster?
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 08:52:11 PMIs it following the trend of the series in getting faster and faster?The only time the series got faster in a Halo sequel was from Reach to Halo 4. Every other Halo has been slower paced than the last. Halo 5's pace isn't on the level of competitive Halo 2, and certainly not like competitive CE. I'll say it's slightly faster than Halo 3 [again, assuming we're talking a competitive setting] right now, if only because of the killtimes.And no, Halo 5 is far from a twitch shooter. The more interesting thing is how you're talking about twitch shooters and arena shooters as if they're mutually exclusive [they aren't].Sly Instinct's idea is fantastic BTW.
Halo 3 was "slower", but that was so they could scale maps down without complaints of them being too small.
which is the closest Halo has ever been in terms of gameplay values in releases
They're fixing some things, but just taking the piss out of it in other areas. They neuter sprint by adding all of these restrictions and drawbacks, but then promote features like ADS. They want to make an Arena/Twitch shooter? Okay, good for them. But don't take what has traditionally had Arena-style gameplay and try to "spice it up" with Twitch elements.
I don't get your point here. Halo 3's movement speed is almost the exact same as Halo 2's. The paramount reason Halo 3 was slower paced was because of the neutered weapon sandbox and far longer [+inconsistent] TTKs. Maps being smaller had nothing to do with it [it's pretty hard to beat Halo 2's small maps in... smallness]. Hell, map remakes like Last Resort and Blackout were slightly larger than Halo 2's.
Hmmm?
I wouldn't say there's much twitch elements to be found in Halo 5. It doesn't remind me of Quake [or, if you're willing to call the game a twitch shooter, CoD] at all.I'm also going to say that ADS is not an inherently bad feature when it doesn't limit movement speed. It's struck a great balance of accuracy with the BR, possibly the best in the series, due to the spread tightening mechanic + FOV tradeoff.
My problem with ADS is that, in nearly every case of its addition, it includes an idiotic spread penalty on hip firing. Bloom was a concept where the cons outweighed the pros, this just sort of seems like an addition or evolution of that bad mechanic in this franchise.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:11:08 PMMy problem with ADS is that, in nearly every case of its addition, it includes an idiotic spread penalty on hip firing. Bloom was a concept where the cons outweighed the pros, this just sort of seems like an addition or evolution of that bad mechanic in this franchise.There is literally no such difference. Or it's at least not noticeable enough to detect by just playing the game.It's why I've maintained that what you're seeing is just a fancy zoom animation.
Post on why Halo 5 multiplayer is bad
