ITT I'll tell you why your religion or worldview is shit.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · February 28, 2016, 08:11:35 PM

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🍁 Aria 🔮 · February 28, 2016, 08:20:41 PM

I believe in the one true god. Shamballah my brother.

N/A · February 28, 2016, 08:35:29 PM

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Elai · February 28, 2016, 08:37:00 PM

Philisophical pessimism fused with Orthodox Christianity. I don't actually believe that God exists (I can't seem to figure out how to do that while remaining intellectually honest with myself), but I follow most of His teachings.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · February 28, 2016, 08:39:36 PM

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Elai · February 28, 2016, 08:46:14 PM

Quote from: Chief Among Sinners on February 28, 2016, 08:39:36 PM

The problem may be that your perception of is/is not has been colored by empiricism, which is a religion in and of itself.

How do you figure?

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I'd recommend going to church

Out of curiosity, what will this accomplish? I'm currently attending a Christian school so I'm already involved with a church. Using its original meaning, that is.

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and reading scripture, plus

Which version do you recommend? I've been switching between the Harper Study Version and the NIV.

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looking into Kierkegaard.

Where should I start?

Verbatim · February 28, 2016, 08:50:11 PM

"SCRIPTURE"

http://www.humanistsofutah.org/2002/WhyCantIOwnACanadian_10-02.html

Elai · February 28, 2016, 08:58:46 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 08:50:11 PM

"SCRIPTURE"

http://www.humanistsofutah.org/2002/WhyCantIOwnACanadian_10-02.html

What are you getting at?

Verbatim · February 28, 2016, 08:59:55 PM

Quote from: Eliab on February 28, 2016, 08:58:46 PM

What are you getting at?

Christianity is a joke. Door's leading you down a bad path. You will ignore this.

Korra · February 28, 2016, 09:01:23 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 08:59:55 PM

Quote from: Eliab on February 28, 2016, 08:58:46 PM
What are you getting at?
Christianity is a joke. Door's leading you down a bad path. You will ignore this.

Don't tell him what to fucking do.

Ingy · February 28, 2016, 09:01:50 PM

But what do you believe in

Verbatim · February 28, 2016, 09:02:28 PM

Quote from: Korra on February 28, 2016, 09:01:23 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 08:59:55 PM
Quote from: Eliab on February 28, 2016, 08:58:46 PM
What are you getting at?
Christianity is a joke. Door's leading you down a bad path. You will ignore this.
Don't tell him what to fucking do.

Where EXACTLY did I tell him what to do?

Show me the EXACT spot where I did that.

Korra · February 28, 2016, 09:03:00 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 09:02:28 PM

Quote from: Korra on February 28, 2016, 09:01:23 PM
Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 08:59:55 PM
Quote from: Eliab on February 28, 2016, 08:58:46 PM
What are you getting at?
Christianity is a joke. Door's leading you down a bad path. You will ignore this.
Don't tell him what to fucking do.
Where EXACTLY did I tell him what to do?

Show me the EXACT spot where I did that.

"You will ignore this."

That sounds like a command.

Verbatim · February 28, 2016, 09:04:00 PM

"Christianity is a joke."

Declarative statement, not an imperative statement.

"Door's leading you down a bad path."

Declarative statement.

"You will ignore this."

Declarative statement. I'm saying that I expect him to ignore my advice, not telling him to ignore Door's.

Shut the fuck up.

Korra · February 28, 2016, 09:05:54 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 09:04:00 PM

"Christianity is a joke."

Declarative statement, not an imperative statement.

"Door's leading you down a bad path."

Declarative statement.

"You will ignore this."

Declarative statement.

Shut the fuck up.

You are not clear with anything that you say, dickwaffle. What you wrote looked like a command instead of a declarative statement.

And I will not shut the fuck up

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · February 28, 2016, 09:06:10 PM

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Elai · February 28, 2016, 09:07:16 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 08:59:55 PM

Quote from: Eliab on February 28, 2016, 08:58:46 PM
What are you getting at?
Christianity is a joke. Door's leading you down a bad path. You will ignore this.

Some will argue YOU led me down a bad path with anti-natalism.

I will have to ruminate on verses like those. If I cannot come to terms with their meaning and adopt them as ideals, then I won't adopt the lifestyle.

Elai · February 28, 2016, 09:10:22 PM

Korra, it's okay. I value Verbatim's words.

Korra · February 28, 2016, 09:11:42 PM

Quote from: Eliab on February 28, 2016, 09:10:22 PM

Korra, it's okay. I value Verbatim's words.

All right.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · February 28, 2016, 09:12:08 PM

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Elai · February 28, 2016, 09:13:08 PM

Quote from: Chief Among Sinners on February 28, 2016, 09:06:10 PM

Empiricism is simply slavery of the mind to sense-experience. Tied to modern materialism and skepticism, it traps one behind a door of arbitrary garbage. Evidence, proofs, these are of no intrinsic value outside of the context of an empiricist-skepticist worldview. A worldview that fails to justify itself.

How exactly does that make them a religion/god? I will concede that these things "control" us (in that they dictate our worldview and actions), but to call them a religion just seems intellectually dishonest to me. Almost like an attempt to bring "them" down to "our" level.

Quote

Practice in Christianity is the most important, even Kierkegaard recognized it as such. You probably should read The Sickness Unto Death first or after, though.

This?

Elai · February 28, 2016, 09:16:16 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 09:04:00 PM

To clarify, I do not think you lead me down a bad path. Depressing, esoteric and pessimistic, sure. But I'd rather know an unfortunate truth than a comforting lie, and that is what philosophical pessimism is: the unfortunate truth of reality.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · February 28, 2016, 09:17:43 PM

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Elai · February 28, 2016, 09:21:04 PM

Quote from: Chief Among Sinners on February 28, 2016, 09:17:43 PM

Because they are on "our" level, or below it.

It still strikes me as dishonest to call it a religion.

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We choose what we bow to, and those things we bow to should empower us. Christianity is ideal BECAUSE to practice it allows empowerment of the self in two ways- A) closeness to God and escape from eternal torment or nothingness and B) transcendence of servitude to the Self through loyalty to a higher Other, which allows for an orderly life and worldview resistant to the tugging whims of instinct.

What do you mean by "Other"?

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>paying money for philosophy

here you go
http://www.naturalthinker.net/trl/texts/Kierkegaard,Soren/TheSicknessUntoDeath.pdf

I'm still going to buy the book, but thanks, I'll read through this when I get the chance. Nothing beats a physical copy, though.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · February 28, 2016, 09:22:27 PM

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Aether · February 28, 2016, 09:25:52 PM

Quote from: Chief Among Sinners on February 28, 2016, 08:03:48 PM

Quote from: DemonicChronic on February 28, 2016, 07:21:09 PM
I believe in "I am." The one truth that supersedes all others in my life. "I" being the most basic form of awareness, that is, the awareness that I 'am.' Not "I" as in some white kid named Zach who lives in the USA, smokes pot, and is a deadbeat.
Get to work on that sensus divinitatis

I still have to 'be' before any sensus divinatis can ever take place ergo my existence superseding.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · February 28, 2016, 09:27:21 PM

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N/A · February 28, 2016, 09:27:24 PM

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Elai · February 28, 2016, 09:27:25 PM

Quote from: Chief Among Sinners on February 28, 2016, 09:22:27 PM

MAx Stirner wrote that atheists were pious people. This is true. Most, if not all, Atheists formulate their own arbitrary religions based on abstract, socially imposed gods, rather than personal ones. They may lack a belief in afterlife or things which are beyond their senses, but this is the only distinction. There is still the veneration of saints (thinkers, scientists, leaders, reformers), places of worship (various- the university is a popular one), and a myriad of value systems.

Just because they serve something does not make it their god. It may take the traditional place of a god, informing your perspective and choices, your value system, but it is not a god.

I understand and agree with the heart of what you're saying but I just don't see why you feel the need to do that.

"Hey, see, you guys are theistic, just like me! Except I actually admit it and am therefore better."

Verbatim · February 28, 2016, 09:27:34 PM

Quote from: Eliab on February 28, 2016, 09:16:16 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on February 28, 2016, 09:04:00 PM
To clarify, I do not think you lead me down a bad path. Depressing, esoteric and pessimistic, sure. But I'd rather know an unfortunate truth than a comforting lie, and that is what philosophical pessimism is: the unfortunate truth of reality.

Yeah, I know. I respect your ability to think critically about philosophy and religion, and unlike what Korra was insinuating, I'm not trying to tell you what you should or shouldn't believe. It's just that I can't help but be disappointed that you're still struggling with this whole God thing--hence my comments--because it's an issue I was able to reconcile with years and years ago.

But whatever--as long as you don't start sacrificing bulls at the altar for God, I don't suppose I actually have any reason to be too concerned. It's good that you're soul-searching.