Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:18:44 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:12:20 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:05:51 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:04:05 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:48:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:45:54 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.Alright alright fine.What exactly is unhealthy about it if they're normal functioning people that blend in to normal society and are happy?They're living a lie. They're pretending to be something they're not. If someone truly believed that they were King Richard III, would you encourage him to live out that life? Or would you recommend him a therapist? Probably the latter.But there's a difference between thinking you're an already existing person and living as the opposite sex, isn't there? Seems like a silly comparison, especially considering how in utero we all had a 50/50 chance of ending up either male to female. Or...on the off chance, something different.i.e. XXX, X, XXY, XYY, etcBecause you know, they exist.Not only that, but it's medically proven that in rare cases there is the possibility of mind and body from a gender standpoint being out of alignment because they form separately and on rare occasions during fetal development receive different amounts of sex hormones.It's rare but it's a natural occurrence. Call it a defect or whatever, but these people aren't diseased or delusional.If you're born as a man, that's what you are. No matter how much you whine about it on the Internet, you will never be a woman. And if you go to the lengths to get reassignment surgery, you're still not a woman. You're an idiot who tried to fuck with nature and change what can't be changed. It's disgusting, inhumane, and generally unpleasant. Of course, you should be able to do whatever the hell you want with your body, but that doesn't make it smart to do so.Come on, you're not even trying.
Quote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:12:20 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:05:51 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:04:05 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:48:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:45:54 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.Alright alright fine.What exactly is unhealthy about it if they're normal functioning people that blend in to normal society and are happy?They're living a lie. They're pretending to be something they're not. If someone truly believed that they were King Richard III, would you encourage him to live out that life? Or would you recommend him a therapist? Probably the latter.But there's a difference between thinking you're an already existing person and living as the opposite sex, isn't there? Seems like a silly comparison, especially considering how in utero we all had a 50/50 chance of ending up either male to female. Or...on the off chance, something different.i.e. XXX, X, XXY, XYY, etcBecause you know, they exist.Not only that, but it's medically proven that in rare cases there is the possibility of mind and body from a gender standpoint being out of alignment because they form separately and on rare occasions during fetal development receive different amounts of sex hormones.It's rare but it's a natural occurrence. Call it a defect or whatever, but these people aren't diseased or delusional.If you're born as a man, that's what you are. No matter how much you whine about it on the Internet, you will never be a woman. And if you go to the lengths to get reassignment surgery, you're still not a woman. You're an idiot who tried to fuck with nature and change what can't be changed. It's disgusting, inhumane, and generally unpleasant. Of course, you should be able to do whatever the hell you want with your body, but that doesn't make it smart to do so.
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:05:51 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:04:05 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:48:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:45:54 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.Alright alright fine.What exactly is unhealthy about it if they're normal functioning people that blend in to normal society and are happy?They're living a lie. They're pretending to be something they're not. If someone truly believed that they were King Richard III, would you encourage him to live out that life? Or would you recommend him a therapist? Probably the latter.But there's a difference between thinking you're an already existing person and living as the opposite sex, isn't there? Seems like a silly comparison, especially considering how in utero we all had a 50/50 chance of ending up either male to female. Or...on the off chance, something different.i.e. XXX, X, XXY, XYY, etcBecause you know, they exist.Not only that, but it's medically proven that in rare cases there is the possibility of mind and body from a gender standpoint being out of alignment because they form separately and on rare occasions during fetal development receive different amounts of sex hormones.It's rare but it's a natural occurrence. Call it a defect or whatever, but these people aren't diseased or delusional.
Quote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:04:05 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:48:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:45:54 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.Alright alright fine.What exactly is unhealthy about it if they're normal functioning people that blend in to normal society and are happy?They're living a lie. They're pretending to be something they're not. If someone truly believed that they were King Richard III, would you encourage him to live out that life? Or would you recommend him a therapist? Probably the latter.
Quote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:48:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:45:54 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.Alright alright fine.What exactly is unhealthy about it if they're normal functioning people that blend in to normal society and are happy?
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:45:54 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.Alright alright fine.What exactly is unhealthy about it if they're normal functioning people that blend in to normal society and are happy?
Quote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.
It's just immoral.
Quote from: Rocketman287 on January 19, 2015, 09:17:45 PMKeep it cleanThat's not a rule.
Keep it clean
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:28:10 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:24:40 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:18:44 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:12:20 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:05:51 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:04:05 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:48:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:45:54 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.Alright alright fine.What exactly is unhealthy about it if they're normal functioning people that blend in to normal society and are happy?They're living a lie. They're pretending to be something they're not. If someone truly believed that they were King Richard III, would you encourage him to live out that life? Or would you recommend him a therapist? Probably the latter.But there's a difference between thinking you're an already existing person and living as the opposite sex, isn't there? Seems like a silly comparison, especially considering how in utero we all had a 50/50 chance of ending up either male to female. Or...on the off chance, something different.i.e. XXX, X, XXY, XYY, etcBecause you know, they exist.Not only that, but it's medically proven that in rare cases there is the possibility of mind and body from a gender standpoint being out of alignment because they form separately and on rare occasions during fetal development receive different amounts of sex hormones.It's rare but it's a natural occurrence. Call it a defect or whatever, but these people aren't diseased or delusional.If you're born as a man, that's what you are. No matter how much you whine about it on the Internet, you will never be a woman. And if you go to the lengths to get reassignment surgery, you're still not a woman. You're an idiot who tried to fuck with nature and change what can't be changed. It's disgusting, inhumane, and generally unpleasant. Of course, you should be able to do whatever the hell you want with your body, but that doesn't make it smart to do so.Come on, you're not even trying.Trying to do what? Express my opinion? I'm sorry for believing that you are what you are, and that feeding delusions is bad. I don't care what nonsense you've heard, a TG woman is not an actual woman.You didn't even try to debunk anything I said, which is what I'm trying to say.
Quote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:24:40 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:18:44 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:12:20 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:05:51 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 09:04:05 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:48:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:45:54 PMQuote from: Nuka 'Kal Vargun on January 19, 2015, 08:33:17 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 08:29:31 PMIt's just immoral.I'm not going to get into a debate with you but you have a strange definition of morality.I'd consider it pretty immoral to let a sufferer of a disease believe that he's healthy instead of actually trying to help him.Alright alright fine.What exactly is unhealthy about it if they're normal functioning people that blend in to normal society and are happy?They're living a lie. They're pretending to be something they're not. If someone truly believed that they were King Richard III, would you encourage him to live out that life? Or would you recommend him a therapist? Probably the latter.But there's a difference between thinking you're an already existing person and living as the opposite sex, isn't there? Seems like a silly comparison, especially considering how in utero we all had a 50/50 chance of ending up either male to female. Or...on the off chance, something different.i.e. XXX, X, XXY, XYY, etcBecause you know, they exist.Not only that, but it's medically proven that in rare cases there is the possibility of mind and body from a gender standpoint being out of alignment because they form separately and on rare occasions during fetal development receive different amounts of sex hormones.It's rare but it's a natural occurrence. Call it a defect or whatever, but these people aren't diseased or delusional.If you're born as a man, that's what you are. No matter how much you whine about it on the Internet, you will never be a woman. And if you go to the lengths to get reassignment surgery, you're still not a woman. You're an idiot who tried to fuck with nature and change what can't be changed. It's disgusting, inhumane, and generally unpleasant. Of course, you should be able to do whatever the hell you want with your body, but that doesn't make it smart to do so.Come on, you're not even trying.Trying to do what? Express my opinion? I'm sorry for believing that you are what you are, and that feeding delusions is bad. I don't care what nonsense you've heard, a TG woman is not an actual woman.
It's really obvious who does and does not understand transgenderism and related trans issues.If you don't know what you're talking about, it's generally a good idea not to debate about it.
Quote from: Mad Max on January 19, 2015, 09:32:12 PMIt's really obvious who does and does not understand transgenderism and related trans issues.If you don't know what you're talking about, it's generally a good idea not to debate about it.This isn't a debate, it's a discussion. Transgenders who embrace the disorder are sick. They have no place in a civilized society.
If SecondClass had to pick between being born transgendered or born with harlequin ichthyosis, which would he choose? Or would they both be equally horrible?
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:33:21 PMQuote from: Mad Max on January 19, 2015, 09:32:12 PMIt's really obvious who does and does not understand transgenderism and related trans issues.If you don't know what you're talking about, it's generally a good idea not to debate about it.This isn't a debate, it's a discussion. Transgenders who embrace the disorder are sick. They have no place in a civilized society.And how does someone being transgender negatively affect anybody else?
Quote from: Verbatim on January 19, 2015, 09:35:54 PMIf SecondClass had to pick between being born transgendered or born with harlequin ichthyosis, which would he choose? Or would they both be equally horrible?What the fuck? Obviously transgender, I just wouldn't be an idiot and try to embrace my disease, I'd get it cured.
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:37:34 PMQuote from: Verbatim on January 19, 2015, 09:35:54 PMIf SecondClass had to pick between being born transgendered or born with harlequin ichthyosis, which would he choose? Or would they both be equally horrible?What the fuck? Obviously transgender, I just wouldn't be an idiot and try to embrace my disease, I'd get it cured.Don't act all offended; it was more of a rhetorical question. Obviously you would rather be transgendered. Point being, how do you quantify how "bad" a defect is? I'm not even arguing with you, I'm just gathering information right now. I'd like to try to understand the perspective of what I consider to be... toxic bigotry.
Quote from: Kupo on January 19, 2015, 09:35:28 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:33:21 PMQuote from: Mad Max on January 19, 2015, 09:32:12 PMIt's really obvious who does and does not understand transgenderism and related trans issues.If you don't know what you're talking about, it's generally a good idea not to debate about it.This isn't a debate, it's a discussion. Transgenders who embrace the disorder are sick. They have no place in a civilized society.And how does someone being transgender negatively affect anybody else?Something doesn't have to affect others to be sick or idiotic. Transgenders have a disorder, simple as that, and it should be treated, not embraced.
Quote from: Verbatim on January 19, 2015, 09:39:37 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:37:34 PMQuote from: Verbatim on January 19, 2015, 09:35:54 PMIf SecondClass had to pick between being born transgendered or born with harlequin ichthyosis, which would he choose? Or would they both be equally horrible?What the fuck? Obviously transgender, I just wouldn't be an idiot and try to embrace my disease, I'd get it cured.Don't act all offended; it was more of a rhetorical question. Obviously you would rather be transgendered. Point being, how do you quantify how "bad" a defect is? I'm not even arguing with you, I'm just gathering information right now. I'd like to try to understand the perspective of what I consider to be... toxic bigotry.The more it affects you, the worse it is. Transgenderism's eventual result (if followed through completely) is the surgical changing of your sex. That's pretty affecting.
The ultimate goal would be to become the opposite sex. This is unarguably impossible at this time. Until such a time that someone can be altered post-birth on a genetic level, a transperson can only make themselves as close to that as possible. Outside of Tumblr and similar special snowflake hugboxes, you will only sparsely find people who legitimately believe that they are "actually" (in the sense you are arguing) men or women.
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:38:36 PMQuote from: Kupo on January 19, 2015, 09:35:28 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:33:21 PMQuote from: Mad Max on January 19, 2015, 09:32:12 PMIt's really obvious who does and does not understand transgenderism and related trans issues.If you don't know what you're talking about, it's generally a good idea not to debate about it.This isn't a debate, it's a discussion. Transgenders who embrace the disorder are sick. They have no place in a civilized society.And how does someone being transgender negatively affect anybody else?Something doesn't have to affect others to be sick or idiotic. Transgenders have a disorder, simple as that, and it should be treated, not embraced.If it doesn't affect you in any way, why do you care? What possible purpose would it serve other than wasting society's time?
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:41:14 PMThe more it affects you, the worse it is. Transgenderism's eventual result (if followed through completely) is the surgical changing of your sex. That's pretty affecting.Actually, it isn't, but you wouldn't know that.Many trans people opt to not have the surgery.
The more it affects you, the worse it is. Transgenderism's eventual result (if followed through completely) is the surgical changing of your sex. That's pretty affecting.
Quote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:41:14 PMQuote from: Verbatim on January 19, 2015, 09:39:37 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:37:34 PMQuote from: Verbatim on January 19, 2015, 09:35:54 PMIf SecondClass had to pick between being born transgendered or born with harlequin ichthyosis, which would he choose? Or would they both be equally horrible?What the fuck? Obviously transgender, I just wouldn't be an idiot and try to embrace my disease, I'd get it cured.Don't act all offended; it was more of a rhetorical question. Obviously you would rather be transgendered. Point being, how do you quantify how "bad" a defect is? I'm not even arguing with you, I'm just gathering information right now. I'd like to try to understand the perspective of what I consider to be... toxic bigotry.The more it affects you, the worse it is. Transgenderism's eventual result (if followed through completely) is the surgical changing of your sex. That's pretty affecting.Actually, it isn't, but you wouldn't know that.Many trans people opt to not have the surgery.
Quote from: Kupo on January 19, 2015, 09:41:23 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:38:36 PMQuote from: Kupo on January 19, 2015, 09:35:28 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:33:21 PMQuote from: Mad Max on January 19, 2015, 09:32:12 PMIt's really obvious who does and does not understand transgenderism and related trans issues.If you don't know what you're talking about, it's generally a good idea not to debate about it.This isn't a debate, it's a discussion. Transgenders who embrace the disorder are sick. They have no place in a civilized society.And how does someone being transgender negatively affect anybody else?Something doesn't have to affect others to be sick or idiotic. Transgenders have a disorder, simple as that, and it should be treated, not embraced.If it doesn't affect you in any way, why do you care? What possible purpose would it serve other than wasting society's time?You can keep posting childish pictures all you want, but it doesn't help your argument.And why do I care? The main reason is that I'm a somewhat ethical person. I don't want diseased people to be able to walk around, untreated, living their life as a delusion. The second, more vain reason, is that TGs are just repulsive. I should be able to walk up to the store without feeling the need to lose my lunch every time I see a tranny.
Quote from: Mad Max on January 19, 2015, 09:42:42 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:41:14 PMQuote from: Verbatim on January 19, 2015, 09:39:37 PMQuote from: SecondClass on January 19, 2015, 09:37:34 PMQuote from: Verbatim on January 19, 2015, 09:35:54 PMIf SecondClass had to pick between being born transgendered or born with harlequin ichthyosis, which would he choose? Or would they both be equally horrible?What the fuck? Obviously transgender, I just wouldn't be an idiot and try to embrace my disease, I'd get it cured.Don't act all offended; it was more of a rhetorical question. Obviously you would rather be transgendered. Point being, how do you quantify how "bad" a defect is? I'm not even arguing with you, I'm just gathering information right now. I'd like to try to understand the perspective of what I consider to be... toxic bigotry.The more it affects you, the worse it is. Transgenderism's eventual result (if followed through completely) is the surgical changing of your sex. That's pretty affecting.Actually, it isn't, but you wouldn't know that.Many trans people opt to not have the surgery.Like I said in the other thread, I have nothing but respect for TGs who don't feed the delusion and get a gender change. If they're actually trying to help themselves, they're dealing with their condition correctly.
irony.
Discussion on Transgenderism
