Spoiler Okay so an obvious BvS question that deserves its own thread.

Dietrich Six · March 29, 2016, 09:43:57 PM

Quote from: Prime X on March 29, 2016, 06:51:08 PM

Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 04:01:44 PM
Quote from: Eli on March 29, 2016, 03:37:42 PM
Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 03:34:19 PM
Batman's line about him not being brave really hit hard. Can't be brave if you have no fear.

Superman has demonstrated bravery several times, even in the DCCU...

He's a fucking God, no reason to be scared.
They killed doomsday in like ten minutes.
Did you even read Superman Doomed? Or watch TAS, for that matter. He's afraid of his powers, their continuous expansion, and hurting those he loves.

He's scared for other people and what he might lose, not of fighting the bad guys. Especially if they aren't some comically overpowered world destroyers.

Batch · March 29, 2016, 10:04:18 PM

Did anyone else not get chills when Wonder Woman went all fucking out on Doomsday, that was pretty damn cool.

Also about Batman, first I wanna know more about the past of this one, two he pretty much told Alfred that they've 'always been Criminals' pretty much showing he doesnt care if he kills a crim or two. Lastly he could have killed Superman, out right they could have just killed him.

Anyone else get Injustice (the game) vibes from this? Especially he Supes tried to kill Doomsday.

Nick McIntyre · March 29, 2016, 10:37:42 PM

Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 09:41:23 PM

Quote from: Eli on March 29, 2016, 04:11:35 PM
Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 04:01:44 PM
He's a fucking God, no reason to be scared.
They killed doomsday in like ten minutes.

He's not literally a god, you realise...

I'm sure the mild-mannered farm boy from Kansas doesn't share your opinion on his mortality.

He sleeps inside of the sun and breaks out of the universe. He then resurrects the woman he loves.

He is a God

That's Superman 10,000 right?

Fuck whoever decided to write that storyline, there's no reason to turn Superman into a wanna-be Dr. Manhattan

March 30, 2016, 12:21:13 AM

Needs more Shazam.

Dietrich Six · March 30, 2016, 07:59:55 AM

Quote from: Nick McIntyre on March 29, 2016, 10:37:42 PM

Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 09:41:23 PM
Quote from: Eli on March 29, 2016, 04:11:35 PM
Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 04:01:44 PM
He's a fucking God, no reason to be scared.
They killed doomsday in like ten minutes.

He's not literally a god, you realise...

I'm sure the mild-mannered farm boy from Kansas doesn't share your opinion on his mortality.

He sleeps inside of the sun and breaks out of the universe. He then resurrects the woman he loves.

He is a God

That's Superman 10,000 right?

Fuck whoever decided to write that storyline, there's no reason to turn Superman into a wanna-be Dr. Manhattan

Superman prime, yeah it's fucking insane.
He sleeps inside the sun for 15,000 years and becomes a literal God.

Elai · March 30, 2016, 01:27:06 PM

Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 30, 2016, 07:59:55 AM

Superman prime, yeah it's fucking insane.
He sleeps inside the sun for 15,000 years and becomes a literal God.

He's not a god. We're not talking about Superman Prime.

Dietrich Six · March 30, 2016, 02:00:53 PM

Quote from: Eli on March 30, 2016, 01:27:06 PM

Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 30, 2016, 07:59:55 AM
Superman prime, yeah it's fucking insane.
He sleeps inside the sun for 15,000 years and becomes a literal God.

He's not a god. We're not talking about Superman Prime.

Superman becomes superman prime, his story has always been bland because of how overpowered he is.

He's like the hulk, too powerful for his own good.

Elai · March 30, 2016, 07:02:48 PM

Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 30, 2016, 02:00:53 PM

Superman becomes superman prime, his story has always been bland because of how overpowered he is.

In a single, else-worlds storyline not used as a benchmark for any other Superman story.

It would be like me using Earth-2 Bruce Wayne to say, "Bruce Wayne is the father of Huntress!" when it's is only so in a specific universe.

Solonoid · March 31, 2016, 03:28:17 AM

That's the point of Superman.

The conflicts that can challenge such an awesome power must be so much more than colossal, they must be cleverly crafted and plotted to highlight the mortality in a very much immortal figure.

Challenges Superman faces have to be more than physical, they must be intellectual, moral, and existential.

In JL: Unlimited, there is an episode called 'For the man who has everything'

Superman has been trapped in an illusion dream state where his heart's truest desire has cone true.

He lives as a simple farmer in Krypton, and has a family, and son, Van El.

He remembers every day of his life there, clearly and vividly.

In the real world, Mongul is attacking Wonder Woman and Batman and is poised to destroy the planet in Superman's absence, and Batman continues to cry out to Clark to fight it, snap out of it.

He hears these cries, and feels the tremors of the battle, manifested as earthquakes on Krypton.

He tells Van El he loves him, and that he is everything he ever wanted in a son, and that the day he was born was the happiest of his life, but he has to go and be Superman, because he has responsibilities.

This is the kind of conflict that faces Superman.

Would you be able to sacrifice your only son to save the world?

Yes, Superman is absolutely god, in every aspect, but the conflicts god faces are more important and meaningful than any struggle that Batman faces.

🍁 Aria 🔮 · March 31, 2016, 10:06:00 AM

Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 09:43:57 PM

Quote from: Prime X on March 29, 2016, 06:51:08 PM
Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 04:01:44 PM
Quote from: Eli on March 29, 2016, 03:37:42 PM
Quote from: Dietrich Six on March 29, 2016, 03:34:19 PM
Batman's line about him not being brave really hit hard. Can't be brave if you have no fear.

Superman has demonstrated bravery several times, even in the DCCU...

He's a fucking God, no reason to be scared.
They killed doomsday in like ten minutes.
Did you even read Superman Doomed? Or watch TAS, for that matter. He's afraid of his powers, their continuous expansion, and hurting those he loves.

He's scared for other people and what he might lose, not of fighting the bad guys. Especially if they aren't some comically overpowered world destroyers.

You said that he doesn't feel fear. He is afraid specifically of his own powers. The things he uses against criminals and world destroyers alike. He tangles with fear every time he shows his red-and-blue. Despite that, he still fights.

There's more than one kind of fear, and more than one kind of bravery. There's the bravery of standing up for something when you can be harmed, and there's standing up for something when you could hurt those you love.

Verbatim · March 31, 2016, 10:06:28 AM

Quote from: Soliloquy Sauce on March 31, 2016, 03:28:17 AM

That's the point of Superman.

The conflicts that can challenge such an awesome power must be so much more than colossal, they must be cleverly crafted and plotted to highlight the mortality in a very much immortal figure.

Challenges Superman faces have to be more than physical, they must be intellectual, moral, and existential.

In JL: Unlimited, there is an episode called 'For the man who has everything'

Superman has been trapped in an illusion dream state where his heart's truest desire has cone true.

He lives as a simple farmer in Krypton, and has a family, and son, Van El.

He remembers every day of his life there, clearly and vividly.

In the real world, Mongul is attacking Wonder Woman and Batman and is poised to destroy the planet in Superman's absence, and Batman continues to cry out to Clark to fight it, snap out of it.

He hears these cries, and feels the tremors of the battle, manifested as earthquakes on Krypton.

He tells Van El he loves him, and that he is everything he ever wanted in a son, and that the day he was born was the happiest of his life, but he has to go and be Superman, because he has responsibilities.

This is the kind of conflict that faces Superman.

Would you be able to sacrifice your only son to save the world?

Yes, Superman is absolutely god, in every aspect, but the conflicts god faces are more important and meaningful than any struggle that Batman faces.

(and that's why he's a boring character)

Verbatim · March 31, 2016, 10:09:09 AM

You're basically making a character out of the boulder that Sisyphus is trying to push up the hill. Or the hill itself.

His very purpose is to be an insurmountable object.

🍁 Aria 🔮 · March 31, 2016, 10:13:42 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on March 31, 2016, 10:09:09 AM

You're basically making a character out of the boulder that Sisyphus is trying to push up the hill. Or the hill itself.

His very purpose is to be an insurmountable object.

It's why I prefer the stories like Kingdom Come which are less about "who's stronger than who" and more about the idea of superheroes, moral necessities, the implications of their heroics, and et cetera.

He's only bulletproof on the outside, he's got internal struggles just like everyone else.

He also just recently had a depowered storyline where he Solar Flared too much and it drained him to his basics, if you want to see a more vulnerable Superman.