Quote from: Camnator on October 20, 2014, 12:37:47 PM

Why are people acting like Kinder was insulting others when it was clearly Challenger? Wow, that's enough blindness for me. This is clearly a waste of time and I've said all that needs to be said.

Consult the Kindliography:

- God damn you're so fuc­king retarded
- "hur hur he ez useng facts hur he mus be useng wikipedia hur i'm so damn retarded" That's what you fuc­king sound like right now
- Go back with a thumb up your ass
- Something else equally stupid before Mr. P changed his post.

>something equally as stupid

Because Challenger disregarding MULTIPLE sources, including History, as "revisionist" history isn't stupid?

Quote from: Kinder on October 20, 2014, 02:12:02 PM

Quote from: challengerX on October 20, 2014, 01:48:40 PM

Quote from: Kinder on October 20, 2014, 11:55:54 AM

Quote from: challengerX on October 20, 2014, 10:19:36 AM

Quote from: Kinder on October 20, 2014, 08:33:01 AM

Quote from: challengerX on October 20, 2014, 06:06:14 AM

Quote from: Mr Psychologist on October 20, 2014, 06:00:17 AM

Hmmmmm

Just a friendly reminder, nothing official but try to keep this clean >.>
It's an interesting discussion that for once hasn't completely degenerated into flaming, I'd like to see it remain that way >.>

There's no keeping it clean with ignorant savages apologizing and trying to justify slavery.

My ancestors got rid of widespread slavery 2,500 years ago, not to mention the slaves were more like servants who were treated humanely and were not picked for their skin color, and freeing slaves was regarded as one of the best things you could do. America got rid of it some centuries ago and still has people who think slavery was good.

I'm just not getting into it with Cam who's basically a broken record, Kinder who calls anybody who disagrees with him a Communist and "libtard", and any other inbred southern trash who wants to "discuss" this.

You can tell people the truth all you like, it's up to them to accept it. And when they don't want to and don't have an open mind, it's a colossal waste of time. I have far better things to do.

Ah, typical Challenger not reading the discussion and making wide-spread generalizations

Justifying slavery? Nobody is justifying the degrading act of owning another human being. What's being discussed is the South not a representation of hate, but a sense of proud and identity. Nobody goes ape shit when Russians or Germans display nationalism, despite Germany causing the holocaust and Russia killing tens of millions of people

Your ancestors? Let me guess, Persia? Yeah, slavery was only outlawed in Persia/Iran by Rezā Shāh in 1928. Slavery existed under the  Achaemenids, Parthians, and Sassanids. In 1828, the slave trade against Circassians and Georgians was abolished and  the late 19th century the British Empire put an end to the slave trade in Iran.However, slavery was still common in Iran under the Qajar dynasty

Now let me tell YOU something about MY ancestors. My family is almost half Irish. Know how the Irish were treated? Just as bad, and at times, FAR worse than blacks. The British killed thousands and millions of my people, along with selling hundreds of thousands of us into slavery, where they were brought into America.

Just as stated above, slaves were NOT just black and was nothing based on skin color. If it was based on color, then there would have been no white slaves. Funny enough that America abolished slavery before Iran did

And I'll throw this right back at you: You can tell people the truth all you like, it's up to them to accept it. And when they don't want to and don't have an open mind, it's a colossal waste of time.

I read everything, and laughed my ass off doing so.

You're a slavery apologist. You change history to suit your beliefs. And yes I do dislike when there are overly nationalistic Germans and Russians. But the main point is the "South" is not a nation. You're part of the United States of America. If you don't like it, leave. But don't fly the flag of dumbasses who seceded to keep their slaves then got their shit pushed in. It's just retarded.

I'm well aware it wasn't formally outlawed until 1928 in Iran. But I said "widespread slavery". That hadn't been in Iran for hundreds of years.

When did I ever say what happened to the Irish isn't bad? Why are you even bringing that up? I brought my ancestry because it's relevant to the fact that widespread slavery is ancient history in Iran, and even then they were treated with FAR more respect THOUSANDS of years ago. It was formally outlawed in 1928, yes, but there hadn't been widespread slavery for centuries. But slavery in Iran was never on the same scale as America. Try something other than Wikipedia next time.

The large majority of slaves were black. There was quite a large majority of Irish slaves as well, but it doesn't even compare to the number of African slaves. Especially considering America's ugly history and present when it comes to hatred and fear of black people. Please, don't even try it. More bullshit revisionist history and acting like because there were some Irish slaves brought by the British it compares to what happened to the blacks and what still happens today. The Irish aren't forced into ghettos and weren't being lynched for hundreds of years. Nobody asked JFK for his birth certificate.

So please, educate yourself. It's embarrassing how little you know about history, and the fact that you're being hostile and slinging around insults is just pathetic. Have a juice box and calm down. I know you get a raging boner every time you see me post, but try and chill out.

God damn you're so fracking retarded

I'm no slavery apologist. You claim to have read what's being talked about in this thread, but that very statement contradicts such. I'm not changing anything. I'm stating what had happen in history. Trying to change the fact states fought for state rights and to make it all about slavery is you and every damn liberal changing history. The south is a fracking geographic area of America, with a culture and heritage different than other parts. Just as Russia has Siberia and Switzerland with the Alps, America has the south and other areas. Once again, South seceded because of states rights, it wasn't about slavery. Plus the south was winning the war for many years

Lol, you're trying to say I'm justifying slavery but the one who is is you. Slavery is slavery, doesn't matter if it was wide-spread or something small. Iran had slavery for far longer than America and you're trying to compensate and shift the goal posts

When did I ever mention Iran? If you're going to bring up your ancestors then I will do the same damn thing. It's relevant because my ancestors faced extreme discrimination and slavery but I still support southern culture because I'm not some idiot that associates south with racism 

"hur hur he ez useng facts hur he mus be useng wikipedia hur i'm so damn retarded" That's what you fracking sound like right now

Again, you're trying to downplay slavery by not making it seem like a big deal whites were slaves. As I stated, slavery is slavery. Doesn't matter who is the victim of it. Take your uneducated bullshit to tumblr

I am educated. How about you educate yourself. It's embarrassing how little you know about history. You're so damn mad that I prove you wrong constantly. Go back with a thumb up your ass

Insults on the Serious forum isn't a good combination boyo.

You are a slavery apologist. The South seceded because abolishing slavery would ruin the economy down there. I've already do odds an unbiased source proving that, and there's more where that came from. All you've done is link two biased sources, and a third which contradicts your argument. So basically, you go to google search then just copy and paste links. 10/10

Exactly. The South is a geographic area with a slightly different culture than other parts of America. But it's still America. Flying a flag like you're part of a different nation is just pathetic. And the South lost the war. It got massacred towards the end.

Not at all. I think it's disgusting and there are a shit ton of disgusting things in Iranian culture and society I absolutely despise. I'm an American before an Iranian, and I'm a man before any of those. And as a man, I think slavery is one of the most disgusting things on the planet. But the point remains slavery was far more humane thousands of years ago in Iran than it was 200 years ago in America. It was just a comparison I was making, I don't know why you got your panties in a wad over it. Slavery was more humane in Greece and in Africa than in America.

When did I say anything about Southern culture? I'm talking about history, slavery, and racism. Racism is still alive and well in the South just like anywhere else in America, although there are more racists in the South. So unless you consider slavery and racism part of Southern culture, you shouldn't be offended.

No, I know you're using Wikipedia because I went to the page (knowing you went there, because slavery in Iran is briefly covered in school if not covered at all) and what you said was practically word for word and in the exact same order as the wiki article. Sorry man, foiled again.

Downplay the slavery of the Irish? Not at all. The British massacred and enslaved the Irish like crazy, and had African men rape Irish women and even girls to make Mulattos which they also enslaved. The point is Irish folks don't face the struggle of black folks and haven't for centuries. I'm not downplaying anything, those are just the facts.

Again, twisting the facts doesn't make you look smart, and calling me names doesn't make your wild claims fact, nor do they offend me. But please, continue. This is actually really amusing.

Look who's talking, you use insults also. Get over yourself

I'm not a slavery apologist. Do you have any fact to that, other than talking out of your ass and making shit up? The south seceded because of wanting to preserve the concept of a limited federal government. So how exactly are my sources biased? Oh yeah, anything is biased if it doesn't agree with your liberal revisionist education. You're really pathetic if that's your mentality

Does it honestly fracking manner what flag a person displays? The south and the flag it's associated with, is displaying a sense of heritage and life of were a person comes from. You're seriously a close-minded individual if you have a issue with that

It's funny how you call me a slavery apologist but I'm the one saying slavery of ANY kind, despite where it was, how long ago it happened, and the circumstances of slaves is disgusting. I don't give a crap about what happens in Iran because this isn't what the thread is about. This thread is about the American south and to rely on a place far, far away from America shows that you have to rely on non-relevant manners to make a claim

Ummmm, this thread IS about the south and the culture people associate with it, whether it be what you think or I think. There's racism everywhere and better yet, the only black supreme court justice has said that he's experienced more racism in the north than the south
http://news.yahoo.com/clarence-thomas-on-race-194104252.html?soc_src=mediacontentstory
The south is not some safe haven where everybody you meet says derogatory things, and the fact the south has most of the nations black population shows that if it was racist like you think, they would all have moved away by now

Care to prove that I went to Wikipedia? I'm in a world history course currently and have had to research Persian history and slavery in the Persian Empire. You just can't get over the fact that I know a decent amount of things about Persia

Oh lawdy, discrimination against Irish existed in America into the very early 20th century. You are downplaying it and you are twisting the facts

Quote

I didn't insult you bro. What are you talking about? When I said you guys need to go hump your cousins I'm just taking jabs at you guys. If you're going to get offended over that, get off the Internet.

Yes, you're a slavery apologist. You're downplaying what happened to the blacks by bringing up the Irish. They're totally irrelevant. We're talking about racism towards blacks and black slavery. So, to try and make it seem like slavery wasn't about racism you bring up the Irish because they're white. Now, funnily enough, the British also considered the Irish subhuman. So really, it's racism either way.

"Limited federal government". LOL. Why would they want that? They clearly don't care about actual freedom since they have slaves and treat blacks like garbage. No, they care about their freedom to take away freedom. Which is why they seceded. If you read my source on the last page you'll notice several states that seceded explicitly talked about slavery. Abolishing slavery destroyed the South's economy.

Of course it matters. Flags are symbols (which symbolize things if you remember). So if you display a flag that was made by people who seceded so they could keep their slaves, you're either ignorant, or a racist. I mean look at you, you call it the "War of Northern Aggression".

http://dailykos.com/story/2013/05/06/1207171/-Mything-the-Point-The-War-of-Northern-Aggression
"Let's be clear.  Calling the Civil War,  "The War of Northern Aggression" means it was a war of choice started by the North.   If Saddam Hussein were still alive, I am sure he'd be calling the Iraq War "The War of American Aggression" and he'd have a pretty good case for doing that.   But the South?  Not so much... let's start with the fact y'all call your Great-Grandpa and his kin "Rebels" because they were actively engaged " in rebellion against the United States," as someone who was there (cough Lincoln cough) so bluntly put it.

You don't have to take my word for it, let's look at the early Christmas gift South Carolina delivered to the Union on December 20th, 1860.

We, the People of the State of South Carolina, in Convention assembled do declare and ordain, and it is hereby declared and ordained, That the Ordinance adopted by us in Convention, on the twenty-third day of May in the year of our Lord One Thousand Seven hundred and eight eight, whereby the Constitution of the United State of America was ratified, and also all Acts and parts of Acts of the General Assembly of this State, ratifying amendment of the said Constitution, are here by repealed; and that the union now subsisting between South Carolina and other States, under the name of “The United States of America,” is hereby dissolved".

Uh, I JUST said I find slavery disgusting no matter what. I brought up Iran to make a comparison, it's relevant because it's about slavery. What I'm saying is, you take the fact that America and mostly the South has a very ugly history and present with racism, and you take it personally. That's your problem. I'm not pinning what people did back then or do today on you, so why are you taking it personally? Get a grip.

The South has the most black people because that's where all the slaves were. A lot went North, but many stayed. LOL Now that's desperate to prove a point. I raise my glass to you.

I already proved you went to Wikipedia. What you wrote was word for word. And judging from your crappy and biased sources you consider good, and the fact you barely read your own sources, excuse me if I dont believe you're in some ancient history class and you know everything about Iran. And if you do, good for you. Why would I be angry you read Iranian history?

Discrimination against Irish exists today. Point is it wasn't anywhere near as bad as it was for the blacks, and it's almost nothing compared to what the blacks face in the modern day. The Irish weren't forced to sit in the back of the bus, have separate schools, fountains etc. Have their civil leaders murdered. Hell, the Irish didn't even need to march for their civil rights. There was no such thing as an Irish Wall Street that was burned down in a race riot. They didn't have anything happen to them like the Watts riots.

It's incredible, you contradict yourself and prove me right every post. It's like you just write shit and pretend you're right no matter what.

Nearly every thread, including this thread, you insult me. If I made a remark like "go back to stoning women" then you'd be upset.

No, I'm not a slavery apologist. I ONLY brought up Irish because you brought up your ancestors. If you don't want me to discuss something of irrelevance, then don't do yourself. Just continue to contradict yourself like you constantly do

Nope, it was about states rights, not only slavery. Read my sources

So I guess you're a racist for being a proud American, as America had slavery also. Once again, you contradict yourself and exhibit hypocrisy. It was the War of Northern Agression, as the South demand Union troops to leave Fort Sumter. They didn't and the south saw it as the north invading them, thus being aggressive. Pick up a non-biased history book once in a while\

Now this is just rich. You just stated previously that I'm somehow downplaying things by bring up Irish, but here you go bringing up Persians, gg. Oh, you are pinning it on me. I'm proud to be a southerner, not because I'm a racist that endorses slavery, but it's a culture and heritage I grew up around. Calling us racists and shit IS offensive and I do take it personally. Because guess what? Like America, my family is greatly diverse; my grandmother and her three children are hispanic, three of my cousins are Filipino, 2 of my cousins are black, 1 cousin is half black, my other grandparents are Irish. So don't put me in a group and label us all as racists

Not like slavery ended last year. It's been gone for a long time and if it was so bad like you think it is, then they would have all left. But guess what? It's not a racist haven, as I stated in another response

Except I didn't use Wikipedia. Wikipedia may have cited a source that I used before, but I didn't go on there. And explain how my sources are crappy and biased? If you seriously think The History Channel is biased and crappy then you have no idea as to what you're saying and it's obvious you're trying to make up excuses because the facts contradicts what you think

So having signs that said "no dogs or Irish allowed" isn't as bad as what blacks faced? Irish faced harsh discrimination just as blacks. Continue to disregard it

And right back at you: It's incredible, you contradict yourself and prove me right every post. It's like you just write shit and pretend you're right no matter what.

Quote from: Kinder on October 20, 2014, 04:22:28 PM

Except I didn't use Wikipedia. Wikipedia may have cited a source that I used before, but I didn't go on there. And explain how my sources are crappy and biased? If you seriously think The History Channel is biased and crappy then you have no idea as to what you're saying and it's obvious you're trying to make up excuses because the facts contradicts what you think

M80, I'd take the crappiest wikipedia article over the history channel every day of the week.

facepalm.gif

Quote from: Kinder on October 20, 2014, 04:28:35 PM

Quote from: Mr Psychologist on October 20, 2014, 04:26:14 PM

Quote from: Kinder on October 20, 2014, 04:22:28 PM

Except I didn't use Wikipedia. Wikipedia may have cited a source that I used before, but I didn't go on there. And explain how my sources are crappy and biased? If you seriously think The History Channel is biased and crappy then you have no idea as to what you're saying and it's obvious you're trying to make up excuses because the facts contradicts what you think

M80, I'd take the crappiest wikipedia article over the history channel every day of the week.

facepalm.gif

Cited sources >>>> Trogtier entertainment.

Whatever. History Channel is far from terrible. I'm fucking tired of having to justify my opinions to challenger and he disregard them in substitution of his ego-eccentric, narcissist opinions that he thinks are fact. Going to use the damn mute feature probably the only time ever

ego-eccentric

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA