Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:36:11 AM

It's not arrogance whatsoever, I'm just as sure of it as you are of yours. Just because you get your morals from a book written 2,000 years and I get mine from logic doesn't mean that antiquity give yours more legitimacy.

I've never argued that antiquity gives anything legitimacy. Rather, I'm arguing that your logos is shit and you think it is unassailable because you were brought up in it, just like the supposedly morally bankrupt peoples you insult.

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If you took a step back, you'd see how the fact that we're born without choosing our demographic

We're born without choosing most of our demographics, yes. Really though, most of them are arbitrary.

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and the fact that every demographic should be treated equally under the law, are inseperable.

I have seen nothing to demonstrate that this "should" is a fact.

Please explain to me how you get your "ought" (all individuals and groups deserve equal treatment) from the factual "is" (one cannot choose the circumstances of his birth).

Justice.

Everyone is literally created equal in humanity. We have the duty as humans to ensure that there's no organized disparity between these literally equal organisms.

Quote from: Memerick on April 04, 2016, 02:41:52 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:32:32 AM

One is a direct representation of America, the legal system, and the government. What happens reflects on the nation as a whole.

But for this one, very crucial job that has several strong arguments against bringing in women?

It's the same exact thing. The military is a government job. You don't just stick to your principles when they re convenient for you.

I don't see why I would stubbornly stick to my principles if there was nothing but negative outcomes to be gained.

Why is lowering the physical standards for female combatants the right thing to do?

are you genuinely impaired

Quote from: Memerick on April 04, 2016, 02:45:32 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:43:41 AM

Quote from: Memerick on April 04, 2016, 02:41:52 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:32:32 AM

One is a direct representation of America, the legal system, and the government. What happens reflects on the nation as a whole.

But for this one, very crucial job that has several strong arguments against bringing in women?

It's the same exact thing. The military is a government job. You don't just stick to your principles when they re convenient for you.

I don't see why I would stubbornly stick to my principles if there was nothing but negative outcomes to be gained.

Equality is inherently morally positive, and morality supercedes earthly negative outcomes.

I just don't see how you can jump to this appeal to morality given the potential increase in death and sexual assault rates.

Quote from: Verbatim on April 04, 2016, 02:47:19 AM

Quote from: CIS on April 04, 2016, 02:32:33 AM

Why is lowering the physical standards for female combatants the right thing to do?

are you genuinely impaired

Technically, yes. High functioning autism is considered an impairment.

verb getting btfo

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:47:14 AM

Quote from: Memerick on April 04, 2016, 02:45:32 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:43:41 AM

Quote from: Memerick on April 04, 2016, 02:41:52 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:32:32 AM

One is a direct representation of America, the legal system, and the government. What happens reflects on the nation as a whole.

But for this one, very crucial job that has several strong arguments against bringing in women?

It's the same exact thing. The military is a government job. You don't just stick to your principles when they re convenient for you.

I don't see why I would stubbornly stick to my principles if there was nothing but negative outcomes to be gained.

Equality is inherently morally positive, and morality supercedes earthly negative outcomes.

I just don't see how you can jump to this appeal to morality given the potential increase in death and sexual assault rates.

Death and sexual assault of the women who enlist? They signed up for a combat role, no one is forcing them to join the military. The appeal to morality comes into play because of the fact that if a woman wants a combat role, fulfills everything she's supposed to do, outclasses all her male recruits, she's still not allowed in because she wasn't born with a dick. That's injustice and far more immoral than anything else that has been brought up in opposition to my points ITT.

Quote from: CIS on April 04, 2016, 02:48:11 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on April 04, 2016, 02:47:19 AM

Quote from: CIS on April 04, 2016, 02:32:33 AM

Why is lowering the physical standards for female combatants the right thing to do?

are you genuinely impaired

Technically, yes. High functioning autism is considered an impairment.

does it prevent you from retaining information you literally just received

It prevents me from taking anything posted by you or Class seriously and to skim over and ignore 95% of it.

Quote from: Meta Cognition on April 04, 2016, 02:51:05 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:47:14 AM

and morality supercedes earthly negative outcomes.

What you have here is basically a recipe for poverty and persistent squalor, all in the name of some arbitrarily chosen principle.

This is the worst kind of zealotry.

TIL letting women fight in combat roles causes poverty and persistient squalor

Gotta love this slope.

Oh, and fucking equality is arbitrary now.

Why did I ever take Meta seriously?

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:57:45 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:54:33 AM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on April 04, 2016, 02:51:05 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:47:14 AM

and morality supercedes earthly negative outcomes.

What you have here is basically a recipe for poverty and persistent squalor, all in the name of some arbitrarily chosen principle.

This is the worst kind of zealotry.

TIL letting women fight in combat roles causes poverty and persistient squalor

Gotta love this slope.

Oh, and fucking equality is arbitrary now.

Why did I ever take Meta seriously?

Consider that some people see the veneration of things like equality and freedom the same way you see belief in God and love of Jesus Christ.

That will make the conversation run smoother.

Except God and Jesus Christ are figures and equality is a value.

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:54:33 AM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on April 04, 2016, 02:51:05 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:47:14 AM

and morality supercedes earthly negative outcomes.

What you have here is basically a recipe for poverty and persistent squalor, all in the name of some arbitrarily chosen principle.

This is the worst kind of zealotry.

TIL letting women fight in combat roles causes poverty and persistient squalor

Gotta love this slope.

Are you deliberately being obtuse?

The only way you can take that from what I said is that you really aren't paying attention to this conversation, and at that point it's just not worth having.

Even if study came out that damnned women serving in combat roles to the highest extreme, I would still be right.

Discrimination and hindering equality are worse crimes than making military less effective.

Quote from: SecondClass on April 04, 2016, 02:57:45 AM

Oh, and fucking equality is arbitrary now.

Of course it's arbitrary.

You're literally condoning religiously sticking to a principle you have picked out of the air, above all other principles, regardless of the consequences.

I picked out of the air??? What the fuck?

I've literally explained so many times why equality is one of the most important values a society can instill, and people think I'm just picking some shit to look in the right for this argument.

If you're born a certain way, it's immoral for the government to tell you you cant do things on account of that alone. This isnt a hard fucking thing to grasp, its a pretty goddamn basic idea, and one thats far more important than money, effectiveness, and human lives. Call me whatever fucking name you want, that doesn't change a thing. You can run around and parade statistics and studies all you want, that doesn't make your position any less discriminatory, sexist, or hateful.