Considering he is God in the flesh, did he not foresee his resurrection shortly after death, or give himself infinite pain tolerance?  Even if he didn't, dying still doesn't seem like bad thing for him seeing as once he died he got to go to heaven, which is a paradise, to jointly rule and further unlock more of his abilities.  He didn't really lose anything besides some time on earth in human form and gained lots from it.

Is it moral to push others responsibility on to a person and punish them for others misdeeds?

Also, doesn't God contridict himself sacrificing his son when he condemned it through out the OT?

Spoiler

Deuteronomy 18:9-12: When you enter the land the LORD your God is giving you, do not learn to imitate the detestable ways of the nations there. Let no one be found among you who sacrifices his son or daughter in the fire...Anyone who does these things is detestable to the LORD, and because of these detestable practices the LORD your God will drive out those nations before you.

Spoiler

Deuteronomy 12:31: You must not worship the LORD your God in their way, because in worshiping their gods, they do all kinds of detestable things the LORD hates. They even burn their sons and daughters in the fire as sacrifices to their gods.

Then there's the prophecies in Ezekiel of a future temple, which are accepted by scholars, both Christian and Jewish, to refer to the messianic age.  Contained in the description of the operations of this future temple are references to a fully re-established and functioning animal sacrificial system (Ezekiel 43). If Jesus's sacrifice on the cross was supposed to be the final and perfect sacrifice, rendering animal sacrifices obsolete and ineffective, why would such sacrifices be required in the future messianic age?

In Jeremiah 31, the coming of a "New Covenant" is mentioned, which is interpreted as referring to the coming of Jesus and his death on the cross. Jeremiah 33 provides another OT confirmation that the "obsolete" sacrificial system will be reinstalled in the future messianic age.

Why is this?

God doesn't contradict Himself by sacrificing His Son, because Jesus WAS God.
This is something that gets complex: realizing that Jesus "was with God, and WAS God."
And Christ was the "sacrificial lamb, sin offering" that cleanses the world of its sins if it accepts that gift.

And also, why does knowledge of the aftermath of His death keep His death from being a sacrifice?
He still had to go through the suffering. The knowledge of what your actions will bring don't negate what you are doing.

That's like saying: you know that if you hold off a gunman and die, the people you are with will escape and survive. So you dying is no longer a sacrifice. You do the exact same action, the only difference is you have the knowledge of the aftermath.


What determines an act as sacrifice? The lack of knowledge that what you are doing is worth it?
The "book definition" of Sacrifice is: offer or kill as a religious sacrifice.

So yeah, Jesus meets the book definition of Sacrifice.

And also, why does knowledge of the aftermath of His death keep His death from being a sacrifice?
He still had to go through the suffering. The knowledge of what your actions do don't negate what you are doing.

Would you be more or less willing to die if you knew it was only temporary as opposed to permenant?

That's like saying: you know that if you hold off a gunman and die, the people you are with will escape and survive. So you dying is no longer a sacrifice. You do the exact same action, the only difference is you have the knowledge of the aftermath.

For it to be a fair comparison, I would know that I would be resurrected after holding off the gunman.  I'd say the knowledge of coming back would increase my boldness in wagering my life, it removes the consequence of death.

What determines an act as sacrifice? The lack of knowledge that what you are doing is worth it?
The "book definition" of Sacrifice is: offer or kill as a religious sacrifice.

In Jesus's case, knowing you will be resurrected in a few days and in the mean time dick around in paradise sharing rule with his father.  He also gained the ability to travel between heaven and earth and no longer being restricted by his human side.
The sacrifice I was looking at was: 
"an act of giving up something valued for the sake of something else regarded as more important or worthy".  Does sacrificing the life of a carpenter to become immortal and rule over another realm for eternity with people praising you seem like a loss?  It's not like he damned himself to suffer the fate of sinners burning in hell for eternity to allow people to go to heaven.   

Quote from: Rocketman287 on January 19, 2015, 08:46:58 PM

And also, why does knowledge of the aftermath of His death keep His death from being a sacrifice?
He still had to go through the suffering. The knowledge of what your actions do don't negate what you are doing.

Would you be more or less willing to die if you knew it was only temporary as opposed to permenant?

Quote

That's like saying: you know that if you hold off a gunman and die, the people you are with will escape and survive. So you dying is no longer a sacrifice. You do the exact same action, the only difference is you have the knowledge of the aftermath.

For it to be a fair comparison, I would know that I would be resurrected after holding off the gunman.  I'd say the knowledge of coming back would increase my boldness in wagering my life, it removes the consequence of death.

Quote

What determines an act as sacrifice? The lack of knowledge that what you are doing is worth it?
The "book definition" of Sacrifice is: offer or kill as a religious sacrifice.

In Jesus's case, knowing you will be resurrected in a few days and in the mean time dick around in paradise sharing rule with his father.  He also gained the ability to travel between heaven and earth and no longer being restricted by his human side.
The sacrifice I was looking at was: 
"an act of giving up something valued for the sake of something else regarded as more important or worthy".  Does sacrificing the life of a carpenter to become immortal and rule over another realm for eternity with people praising you seem like a loss?  It's not like he damned himself to suffer the fate of sinners burning in hell for eternity to allow people to go to heaven.

Jesus left His Kingdom, Heaven, all of that to become a mere carpenter. A humble servant.
And died an excruciating death so Humanity could have a way to be free of sin.

How is that not sacrifice?

I guess it would be redundant to remind you that God doesn't exist.

I guess it would be redundant to remind you that God doesn't exist.

I'm asking this under the assumption that he does.

It's always confused me.

God sent himself and had himself executed. . . In order to save him from himself. . . Which apparently didn't work anyway because it's only in the New Testament that Hell is introduced.

http://carm.org/why-did-god-require-animal-sacrifices-in-the-old-testament

http://carm.org/christianity/christian-doctrine/why-did-jesus-have-die-our-sins

That's a great site!