Bad forms of taxation:
- Corporation tax
- Inheritance tax
- Transfer or Transaction tax
- Wealth tax
- Excise tax
- Tariffs

Okay forms of taxation:
- Income tax
- Capital gains
- Property tax

Pretty boss forms of taxation:
- Negative income tax
- Land value tax
- Consumption tax

Just food for thought, really. A lot of the discussion regarding taxation doesn't seem to take into account that some forms of taxation are vastly superior to others. The solution? Do away with the bad ones.

Quote from: Meta Cognition on August 02, 2014, 06:54:24 PM

Okay forms of taxation:
- Income tax

I have to disagree with you there. That is a terrible form of tax, at least the way it is implemented in the United States. The Constitution was amended in 1913, the same year the Federal Reserve was created. 100% of all income tax collected in the US goes towards paying off the interest on our national debt. All of that currency is pocketed by the corporate elite and bankers who actually own the Federal Reserve and basically the entire Western world.

That isn't so much a criticism of income tax as it is the way in which the U.S. government handled it.

I'm not so sure about Income Tax...

Before 1842, Britain did ok without it. Hell, the only reason it was supported at the time was because Robert Peel (the PM at the time) was doing social reforms for everyone, so it benefitted them the most. Presently, I have no idea what it funds, considering the large cutbacks on the NHS while large contracts on military hardware have been over-budget.

Can I ask why you think the Wealth Tax is bad? In my opinion, if it's taxing the extremely wealthy, it's hardly going to put a dent in their spending on yachts, expensive houses, cars, luxury dining, etc. Why not shave off a few which could (hopefully, assuming a decent government...) be spent on something more beneficial for everyone, i.e. improve education, healthcare and infrastructure, so more people can be wealthy, more efficiently, and feed into the system longer (and the cycle continues)

Bad forms of taxation
- Court costs
- Social Security
- Gun registration
- Concealed carry permits
- Income tax
- Obamacare Individual Mandate Excise Tax
- Property Taxes
- Self-Employment Taxes
- Wealth tax
- Excise tax
- Consumption tax
- Gift tax
- Inheritance tax

Okay forms of taxation
- Tolls
- Fishing license
- Hunting permits
- Traffic fines
- Tariffs
- Cigarette tax
- Corporate income tax
- Double taxation
- Federal unemployment tax
- Food service tax
- Gas tax
- Liquor tax
- Public utility tax
- Resort tax
- Sales tax
- School tax

You'd better have a damn good reason for thinking cigarette, liquor, corporation taxes and tariffs are fine.

Quote from: Meta Cognition on August 02, 2014, 09:46:45 PM

Quote from: IchEsseKinder on August 02, 2014, 09:27:33 PM

Bad forms of taxation
- Court costs
- Social Security
- Gun registration
- Concealed carry permits
- Income tax
- Obamacare Individual Mandate Excise Tax
- Property Taxes
- Self-Employment Taxes
- Wealth tax
- Excise tax
- Consumption tax
- Gift tax
- Inheritance tax

Okay forms of taxation
- Tolls
- Fishing license
- Hunting permits
- Traffic fines
- Tariffs
- Cigarette tax
- Corporate income tax
- Double taxation
- Federal unemployment tax
- Food service tax
- Gas tax
- Liquor tax
- Public utility tax
- Resort tax
- Sales tax
- School tax

You'd better have a damn good reason for thinking cigarette, liquor, corporation taxes and tariffs are fine.

First 2: Not a necessity and can increase health risks of people
Corporate: Corporations are not people
Tariffs: Increases domestic job growth since it's cheaper

You can't seriously call yourself a libertarian and still think taxes should be used to sway people's personal choices. Not to mention, taxation on such goods doesn't stop such behaviour and simply makes people poorer.

If corporations aren't people they can't be properly taxed.

Domestic job growth is meaningless if everybody is poorer because competition is being stifled.

Quote from: Meta Cognition on August 02, 2014, 10:02:17 PM

Quote from: IchEsseKinder on August 02, 2014, 09:56:55 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on August 02, 2014, 09:46:45 PM

Quote from: IchEsseKinder on August 02, 2014, 09:27:33 PM

Bad forms of taxation
- Court costs
- Social Security
- Gun registration
- Concealed carry permits
- Income tax
- Obamacare Individual Mandate Excise Tax
- Property Taxes
- Self-Employment Taxes
- Wealth tax
- Excise tax
- Consumption tax
- Gift tax
- Inheritance tax

Okay forms of taxation
- Tolls
- Fishing license
- Hunting permits
- Traffic fines
- Tariffs
- Cigarette tax
- Corporate income tax
- Double taxation
- Federal unemployment tax
- Food service tax
- Gas tax
- Liquor tax
- Public utility tax
- Resort tax
- Sales tax
- School tax

You'd better have a damn good reason for thinking cigarette, liquor, corporation taxes and tariffs are fine.

First 2: Not a necessity and can increase health risks of people
Corporate: Corporations are not people
Tariffs: Increases domestic job growth since it's cheaper

You can't seriously call yourself a libertarian and still think taxes should be used to sway people's personal choices. Not to mention, taxation on such goods doesn't stop such behaviour and simply makes people poorer.

If corporations aren't people they can't be properly taxed.

Domestic job growth is meaningless if everybody is poorer because competition is being stifled.

nop

That's an interesting argument you have there.

Quote from: IchEsseKinder on August 02, 2014, 09:56:55 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on August 02, 2014, 09:46:45 PM

Quote from: IchEsseKinder on August 02, 2014, 09:27:33 PM

Bad forms of taxation
- Court costs
- Social Security
- Gun registration
- Concealed carry permits
- Income tax
- Obamacare Individual Mandate Excise Tax
- Property Taxes
- Self-Employment Taxes
- Wealth tax
- Excise tax
- Consumption tax
- Gift tax
- Inheritance tax

Okay forms of taxation
- Tolls
- Fishing license
- Hunting permits
- Traffic fines
- Tariffs
- Cigarette tax
- Corporate income tax
- Double taxation
- Federal unemployment tax
- Food service tax
- Gas tax
- Liquor tax
- Public utility tax
- Resort tax
- Sales tax
- School tax

You'd better have a damn good reason for thinking cigarette, liquor, corporation taxes and tariffs are fine.

First 2: Not a necessity and can increase health risks of people
Corporate: Corporations are not people
Tariffs: Increases domestic job growth since it's cheaper

You can't seriously call yourself a libertarian and still think taxes should be used to sway people's personal choices. Not to mention, taxation on such goods doesn't stop such behaviour and simply makes people poorer.

If corporations aren't people they can't be properly taxed.

Domestic job growth is meaningless if everybody is poorer because competition is being stifled.

It's not swaying people's personal choice. If that was the case then you wouldn't be seeing homeless and poor people spending their money in order to get some crack or heroin. There's health risks to the public whenever a person smokes or decides to drink too much and drive. If they don't have health insurance then these taxes would offset the medical bills so insurance policies won't rise for everbody else

They can be properly taxed, it's taking a pen out and specifying business in the tax code

Competition isn't being stifled. Products can be imported but it would cost more for it to be. The smartest thing for a company to do is pack up and create thousands of jobs such as production, manager, construction, maintenance, etc

Quote from: Corsair on August 03, 2014, 10:35:25 AM

We could take care of the tax situation if we could remember a time before World War II.  Seems the gov't forgot it existed for more than seventy years.



Civil War spike, WWI spike, WWII spike, military industrial complex rise for the past half century.

It's common sense to expect a spike in debt during a war. However, the 1970s saw the elimination of the remaining gold standard, which is responsible for the debt increasing despite any wars during years

Ain't complaining about the spike in war years, it'd be problematic if there wasn't, wouldn't it?  Complaining about the fact that after WWII, which saw the biggest spike in spending and taxation in the history of mankind (gracias FDR), we've been awfully slow dropping her back down.  And now it's going in the opposite direction, because of overspending, globalization, inflation, a fiat currency, and my personal favorite, a caustic mix of paranoia and xenophobia.