The 8th amendment in Ireland

FatherlyNick - fuck putin · October 26, 2017, 05:35:25 AM

Background info: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eighth_Amendment_of_the_Constitution_of_Ireland

tl;dr - Abortion is illegal in Ireland and is only permitted if the mother's life is in danger.

Soon, there will be a referendum to repeal the law. The country is divided into two camps, the pro-choice (Let women have abortions) or pro-life (Keep the law).

Would you vote for legalisation of abortion or would you keep the law in force?

Aside: one of the student presidents of a local university is pro-life and she kept slashing the funding for pro-choice activities (a majority in that university) and now there is a vote to impeach her. kek

Genghis Khan · October 26, 2017, 07:01:25 AM

I'm pro-life. Abortion is murder.

FatherlyNick - fuck putin · October 26, 2017, 07:41:42 AM

Quote from: Genghis Khan on October 26, 2017, 07:01:25 AM

I'm pro-life. Abortion is murder.

If there are 50 embryos in one oven and a 5 year old child in another. They will die in 10 seconds and you can only open one of the ovens and save the occupant. Which oven do you go for?

Super Irish · October 26, 2017, 08:20:14 AM

It's a bit stupid since people who are going to have abortions regardless of the law in Ireland will have them in the UK. It has been done for some time now.

Since you can't just drop down and get it free on the NHS, you're stuck with private services, which restricts who actually gets one through an artificial barrier. The poor get fucked, other than literally, and then have to take care of a child they thought they weren't capable of. One life created, more often then not two lives ruined.

Rights of unborn children has been quite conservative in all regards in Ireland. There was a case a few years ago about a braindead woman being refused the right to die on the basis that she had a 6 month fetus. Don't know how it turned out.

FatherlyNick - fuck putin · October 26, 2017, 08:27:14 AM

Quote from: βck on October 26, 2017, 08:20:14 AM

It's a bit stupid since people who are going to have abortions regardless of the law in Ireland will have them in the UK. It has been done for some time now.

Since you can't just drop down and get it free on the NHS, you're stuck with private services, which restricts who actually gets one through an artificial barrier. The poor get fucked, other than literally, and then have to take care of a child they thought they weren't capable of. One life created, more often then not two lives ruined.

Rights of unborn children has been quite conservative in all regards in Ireland. There was a case a few years ago about a braindead woman being refused the right to die on the basis that she had a 6 month fetus. Don't know how it turned out.

Haven't heard of that case. Was she an Irish citizen? you're up North, right? I assume abortion is legal over there?

Luciana · October 26, 2017, 02:49:47 PM

I'm pro-choice, so obviously you know where I would stand. Also, idk about Ireland, but in America even with anti-abortion laws, it's been proven that having clinics that can provide them properly are safe, because women will still have them regardless.

challengerX · October 26, 2017, 03:53:09 PM

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Solonoid · October 26, 2017, 04:35:45 PM

Quote from: FatherlyNick on October 26, 2017, 07:41:42 AM

Quote from: Genghis Khan on October 26, 2017, 07:01:25 AM
I'm pro-life. Abortion is murder.
If there are 50 embryos in one oven and a 5 year old child in another. They will die in 10 seconds and you can only open one of the ovens and save the occupant. Which oven do you go for?

What does that scenario have to do with the issue?

It's completely fabricated, unrealistic, and doesn't parallel any of the choices a mother actually has to make when deciding whether to have an abortion or not.

The worst part of it is if the embryos are already separated from their mothers, then they'll die anyway.
The question is loaded.

Solonoid · October 26, 2017, 04:56:01 PM

That out there, I have no real opinion on this issue. I'm physically incapable of having a frame of reference for it.

Super Irish · October 26, 2017, 04:59:35 PM

Quote from: FatherlyNick on October 26, 2017, 08:27:14 AM

Quote from: βck on October 26, 2017, 08:20:14 AM
It's a bit stupid since people who are going to have abortions regardless of the law in Ireland will have them in the UK. It has been done for some time now.

Since you can't just drop down and get it free on the NHS, you're stuck with private services, which restricts who actually gets one through an artificial barrier. The poor get fucked, other than literally, and then have to take care of a child they thought they weren't capable of. One life created, more often then not two lives ruined.

Rights of unborn children has been quite conservative in all regards in Ireland. There was a case a few years ago about a braindead woman being refused the right to die on the basis that she had a 6 month fetus. Don't know how it turned out.
Haven't heard of that case. Was she an Irish citizen? you're up North, right? I assume abortion is legal over there?

Heard it a while back, so after a quick google search I found some of my details were off;
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/braindead-pregnant-woman-kept-on-life-support-31550989.html
Westmeath, so a Republic citizen. Her life support was eventually turned off, but only on the court's basis that the fetus wouldn't survive to full-term anyway. Wouldn't matter much where in Ireland she's from though, as NI bans abortions as well iirc.

I was in the South but now that I've moved, it doesn't personally affect me. Still, gotta have some pride in my country, and some shame when this old shite's still banging around.

Flee · October 27, 2017, 09:48:03 AM

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Super Irish · October 29, 2017, 10:12:04 AM

Quote from: Flee on October 27, 2017, 09:48:03 AM

It's ridiculous Ireland doesn't have legal abortion yet. It was baffling to see anti-abortion protests and signs when I was in Dublin. Keeping it illegal does not accomplish anything. It's stupid and should be removed.

You should see the shite either side has been pumping out of the mills.

Apart from the "against God" themes, there's some "that child could've developed a cancer cure" and "you wouldn't murder this (picture of 3 month old smiley baby), so why this? (Foetus)"

The pro-choice has come up with shite rather than some reasonable arguments for it, but it's a lot less memorable.

FatherlyNick - fuck putin · October 30, 2017, 06:58:36 AM

Quote from: Sᴏʟᴏɴᴏɪᴅ on October 26, 2017, 04:35:45 PM

Quote from: FatherlyNick on October 26, 2017, 07:41:42 AM
Quote from: Genghis Khan on October 26, 2017, 07:01:25 AM
I'm pro-life. Abortion is murder.
If there are 50 embryos in one oven and a 5 year old child in another. They will die in 10 seconds and you can only open one of the ovens and save the occupant. Which oven do you go for?
What does that scenario have to do with the issue?

It's completely fabricated, unrealistic, and doesn't parallel any of the choices a mother actually has to make when deciding whether to have an abortion or not.

The worst part of it is if the embryos are already separated from their mothers, then they'll die anyway.
The question is loaded.

This is for people who think life begins at conception.