Texas campus carry law

Luciana · October 10, 2015, 01:58:54 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/09/us/texas-campus-carry-law/index.html

Long story short, this bill allows people to walk onto campus with a concealed gun when they meet the requirements. The irony is this

Quote

The bill many know as the "campus carry" law is scheduled to go into effect August 1, 2016, the 50-year anniversary of the UT Tower sniper shooting, one of the first mass murders on a college campus in America.

What are your thoughts on this? One of the professors brought up a point we talked about last year in my English class in that "You will stymie discussion -- heated discussion in areas -- in the classroom." which I think is a good point (we brought up that you wouldn't be so bold to argue with someone if they were carrying a gun).

Anyway, my personal opinion is it's a bad fucking idea. I'm just waiting for this to blow up (no pun intended) in the bills face. America really is just getting weird with guns. I'd honestly drop out of my college if that bill passed here.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · October 10, 2015, 02:51:10 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 02:58:50 AM

Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 02:51:10 AM

How the fuck does concealed carry stymie discussion? The point of it is you don't know they have it.

That's sort of the point. You don't know who's going to have a gun, but you know that somebody will.

It's a bit of a paranoia inducing move.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · October 10, 2015, 03:06:09 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 03:15:35 AM

Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 03:06:09 AM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 02:58:50 AM
Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 02:51:10 AM
How the fuck does concealed carry stymie discussion? The point of it is you don't know they have it.

That's sort of the point. You don't know who's going to have a gun, but you know that somebody will.
Congratulations, you've just explained how concealed carry discourages assault in a setting where it is popular.

How this discourages discussion I don't see. It's a campus- too few people even believe gun ownership should be allowed for carry to be a common thing.

No heated discussion in a classroom is going to lead to violence. The suggestion that concealed carry somehow leads to some kind of universal intimidation and silencing is silly as hell. It takes some serious straw-grasping to get there.

Most likely, I can agree. Nothing much will happen of it. And it might help in future issues.

But, I don't trust people. Never trust them when it comes to a human being having to use sound judgement that could impact your life. Because people more often than not, don't use sound judgement. Especially with a gun.

Then again, I live in a country that doesn't have its screws so loose about guns and their usage. Nor does it as readily have dysfunctional people aiming down their sights at other people.

So I'm just going to sit back and watch the fireworks if there's any.

Septy · October 10, 2015, 04:05:23 AM

Carrying a gun does not make you safe. It makes you and everyone around you a target.

When the fuck are we going to ban concealed and open carry.

Mattie G Indahouse · October 10, 2015, 06:41:41 AM

What a great idea. When somebody does decide to do a shooting every John Wayne is going to be firing like an ass. Chances are there's going to be people that get shot in the crossfire that's not from the shooter.

Mordo · October 10, 2015, 06:46:07 AM

Can you americucks just buck up and admit the deterrence meme categorically does not work?

cxfhvxgkcf-56:7 · October 10, 2015, 06:51:32 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

Flee · October 10, 2015, 07:00:22 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 07:03:26 AM

Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 04:05:23 AM

Carrying a gun does not make you safe. It makes you and everyone around you a target.

When the fuck are we going to ban concealed and open carry.

Well, seeing as there's a piece of paper that says "you can have all the guns," signed by some dead guy a few hundred years old at the moment, not anytime soon.

Ásgeirr · October 10, 2015, 08:33:27 AM

Quote from: Flee on October 10, 2015, 07:00:22 AM

Yeah, this is not the answer. I imagine knowing that there would be fellow students carrying a gun on them in class is going to be a pretty disturbing experience for some of the students (and teachers) there.

The thought makes me uneasy.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · October 10, 2015, 09:54:04 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 10:24:38 AM

Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 09:54:04 AM

Quote from: Flee on October 10, 2015, 07:00:22 AM
Yeah, this is not the answer. I imagine knowing that there would be fellow students carrying a gun on them in class is going to be a pretty disturbing experience for some of the students (and teachers) there.
OH GOD

SOME PEOPLE ON MY CAMPUS MIGHT HAVE G-GUNS

OH GOD I'M SO TRIGGERED THIS IS HINDERING ACADEMIC DISCUSSION

S-STOP OPPRESSING ME SHITLORD

He does have a point. I wouldn't say disturbing. But I know if it were me I wouldn't exactly feel in pleasant company in the presence of somebody with a gun. And you've got several people here who've said basically the same thing. Knowing you, you'd probably argue that because it's concealed carry, I wouldn't know.

At which point that's honestly less of a comfort because I would know that somebody was carrying one around. Just not who.

And I notice that after a few rounds of comments from other people you've done absolutely nothing to comment on the fact that maybe it is a bit of a concern that they'd allow more people to wander around with concealed weapons.

Because it is a concern. Mainly because you can't fucking trust people for shit. Period.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 10:31:18 AM

This sort of reminds me of a discussion I had with somebody a long time ago about where the states was going to head with their gun issues. Either they were going to try and clean their shit up.

Or they were going to add more gun.

I guess they're aiming their sights at add more gun.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · October 10, 2015, 10:39:32 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 10:48:08 AM

Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 10:39:32 AM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 10:24:38 AM
Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 09:54:04 AM
Quote from: Flee on October 10, 2015, 07:00:22 AM
Yeah, this is not the answer. I imagine knowing that there would be fellow students carrying a gun on them in class is going to be a pretty disturbing experience for some of the students (and teachers) there.
OH GOD

SOME PEOPLE ON MY CAMPUS MIGHT HAVE G-GUNS

OH GOD I'M SO TRIGGERED THIS IS HINDERING ACADEMIC DISCUSSION

S-STOP OPPRESSING ME SHITLORD

He does have a point. I wouldn't say disturbing. But I know if it were me I wouldn't exactly feel in pleasant company in the presence of somebody with a gun. And you've got several people here who've said basically the same thing. Knowing you, you'd probably argue that because it's concealed carry, I wouldn't know.

At which point that's honestly less of a comfort because I would know that somebody was carrying one around. Just not who.

And I notice that after a few rounds of comments from other people you've done absolutely nothing to comment on the fact that maybe it is a bit of a concern that they'd allow more people to wander around with concealed weapons.

Because it is a concern. Mainly because you can't fucking trust people for shit. Period.
Concealed carries are not a threat to you. Like at all.

The point of concealed carry is personal defence and only personal defense. Carry pistols are small pieces that do not have large magazines and shoot small-caliber bullets. Completely inoptimal for extended violence.

Concealed carriers have to undergo a background check and are subject to prosecution if they have a fuck up.

It's the guy who walks in with his gun in plain sight you need to worry about.

Also "muh feels" is not a legitimate reason to restrict carry.

And you really think that if some guy is having a bad day or he's in a heat of the moment type situation that he's going to give a shit about background checks and prosecution? It doesn't matter if it's a small capacity weapon. It's still a weapon and it can be used to kill somebody, easily. Disregarding it just because it's not capable of mass violence doesn't negate its potential danger.

And if you want to drag "muh feels" into this, then let's talk about how "muh feels" is literally the basis of this new law. Somebody in parlament is getting a little spooked with all these campus shootings so they figure throwing more guns into the mix might help.

So let's not drag the whole "muh feels" horse shit into this because the entire fucking argument about guns on both sides in america is based around feelings.

And there's something we haven't even talked about yet. Police. Let's say somebody goes off on a shooting at campus, and a few concealed carry people get into a firefight but don't take out the shooter.

You now have multiple people running around with drawn weapons, and only one of them being the shooter.

And the police can't afford to identify and hesitate on a target. You don't think any of that has the potential to get messy?

PSU · October 10, 2015, 10:51:43 AM

Wish I could do that in my state. Good for Texas. Great idea.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · October 10, 2015, 10:58:06 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 11:10:00 AM

Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 10:58:06 AM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 10:48:08 AM
Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 10:39:32 AM
Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 10:24:38 AM
Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 09:54:04 AM
Quote from: Flee on October 10, 2015, 07:00:22 AM
Yeah, this is not the answer. I imagine knowing that there would be fellow students carrying a gun on them in class is going to be a pretty disturbing experience for some of the students (and teachers) there.
OH GOD

SOME PEOPLE ON MY CAMPUS MIGHT HAVE G-GUNS

OH GOD I'M SO TRIGGERED THIS IS HINDERING ACADEMIC DISCUSSION

S-STOP OPPRESSING ME SHITLORD

He does have a point. I wouldn't say disturbing. But I know if it were me I wouldn't exactly feel in pleasant company in the presence of somebody with a gun. And you've got several people here who've said basically the same thing. Knowing you, you'd probably argue that because it's concealed carry, I wouldn't know.

At which point that's honestly less of a comfort because I would know that somebody was carrying one around. Just not who.

And I notice that after a few rounds of comments from other people you've done absolutely nothing to comment on the fact that maybe it is a bit of a concern that they'd allow more people to wander around with concealed weapons.

Because it is a concern. Mainly because you can't fucking trust people for shit. Period.
Concealed carries are not a threat to you. Like at all.

The point of concealed carry is personal defence and only personal defense. Carry pistols are small pieces that do not have large magazines and shoot small-caliber bullets. Completely inoptimal for extended violence.

Concealed carriers have to undergo a background check and are subject to prosecution if they have a fuck up.

It's the guy who walks in with his gun in plain sight you need to worry about.

Also "muh feels" is not a legitimate reason to restrict carry.

And you really think that if some guy is having a bad day or he's in a heat of the moment type situation that he's going to give a shit about background checks and prosecution?
Yes. Because it's been demonstrated statistically.

Quote
It doesn't matter if it's a small capacity weapon. It's still a weapon and it can be used to kill somebody, easily. Disregarding it just because it's not capable of mass violence doesn't negate its potential danger.
A small car has far more capacity to inflict violence than a carry piece.

Quote
And if you want to drag "muh feels" into this, then let's talk about how "muh feels" is literally the basis of this new law. Somebody in parlament is getting a little spooked with all these campus shootings so they figure throwing more guns into the mix might help.
That's not what muh feels is, fam.

Quote
So let's not drag the whole "muh feels" horse shit into this because the entire fucking argument about guns on both sides in america is based around feelings.
it's really not. The left has a muh feels camp on the issue but I'll admit that doesn't make up the entire anti-gun left.

You've a point about concealed permits, at least. They don't exactly just hand them out like candy.

As for cars doing more damage, no shit sherlock, it's a fucking half ton car. But we're not talking about cars. We're not talking about how somebody could go around with a knife and slit people's throats while they're sleeping. We're talking about how a gun, even with low capacity ammunition and lower caliber ammunition can still kill somebody.

And yes, that's exactly "muh feels." It's two sides screaming at each other. Make a law to restrict guns and everybody cries "muh guns and freedomes!" Make a law advocating for them and it's for "muh protection!"

But, who am I to say on the subject. It's a country full of guns and people who will either abuse them or not. It's a cultural thing. I'm not going to lose sleep over it. But I don't expect that law to be passed without some negative repurcussions and incidents.

Luciana · October 10, 2015, 12:52:33 PM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 07:03:26 AM

Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 04:05:23 AM
Carrying a gun does not make you safe. It makes you and everyone around you a target.

When the fuck are we going to ban concealed and open carry.

Well, seeing as there's a piece of paper that says "you can have all the guns," signed by some dead guy a few hundred years old at the moment, not anytime soon.

The funny thing is that's not even how he said it, the context back then was completely different (back when we were in fear of being taken over from so many countries), and it says well regulated militia.

Luciana · October 10, 2015, 12:53:54 PM

Quote from: HEAT SEEKING GHOST OF SEX on October 10, 2015, 09:54:04 AM

Quote from: Flee on October 10, 2015, 07:00:22 AM
Yeah, this is not the answer. I imagine knowing that there would be fellow students carrying a gun on them in class is going to be a pretty disturbing experience for some of the students (and teachers) there.
OH GOD

SOME PEOPLE ON MY CAMPUS MIGHT HAVE G-GUNS

OH GOD I'M SO TRIGGERED THIS IS HINDERING ACADEMIC DISCUSSION

S-STOP OPPRESSING ME SHITLORD

I like how aggressive and defensive you get when people talk about gun rights on here and that it MIGHT be a bad thing when discussing it.

The gun isn't your girlfriend or daughter or something (who would probably get shot anyway). Stop being so loud and obnoxious and discuss it in an intelligent manner without a swear every other sentence or an insult in the next. It can be an enjoyable thing to discuss when it doesn't degrade into petty insults which you're so quick to dish out.

Luciana · October 10, 2015, 12:55:22 PM

Quote from: Madman Mordo on October 10, 2015, 06:46:07 AM

Can you americucks just buck up and admit the deterrence meme categorically does not work?

I think the only deterrence that's proven to work time and time again (so far) is nukes.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 01:05:24 PM

Quote from: Luciana on October 10, 2015, 12:52:33 PM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 07:03:26 AM
Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 04:05:23 AM
Carrying a gun does not make you safe. It makes you and everyone around you a target.

When the fuck are we going to ban concealed and open carry.

Well, seeing as there's a piece of paper that says "you can have all the guns," signed by some dead guy a few hundred years old at the moment, not anytime soon.
The funny thing is that's not even how he said it, the context back then was completely different (back when we were in fear of being taken over from so many countries), and it says well regulated militia.

Oh believe me I'm aware of that one at this point.

A document that's a few hundred years old is, naturally, going to be out of date and out of context a bit.

Luciana · October 10, 2015, 01:10:26 PM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 01:05:24 PM

Quote from: Luciana on October 10, 2015, 12:52:33 PM
Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 07:03:26 AM
Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 04:05:23 AM
Carrying a gun does not make you safe. It makes you and everyone around you a target.

When the fuck are we going to ban concealed and open carry.

Well, seeing as there's a piece of paper that says "you can have all the guns," signed by some dead guy a few hundred years old at the moment, not anytime soon.
The funny thing is that's not even how he said it, the context back then was completely different (back when we were in fear of being taken over from so many countries), and it says well regulated militia.

Oh believe me I'm aware of that one at this point.

A document that's a few hundred years old is, naturally, going to be out of date and out of context a bit.

I do often wonder why we're so obsessed with guns and so eager to get them out in the general public when it's proven it kills more.

If we were to promote gun safety and actually have ads about it like they do with other crap, then maybe I'd be okay with it. But as it goes they're too easy to get, and not enough people are being taught the responsibilities it carries.

CK97 · October 10, 2015, 01:12:57 PM

Bad idea while the mentally ill are still able to obtain a gun and background checks aren't as thorough.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 01:17:36 PM

Quote from: Luciana on October 10, 2015, 01:10:26 PM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 01:05:24 PM
Quote from: Luciana on October 10, 2015, 12:52:33 PM
Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 07:03:26 AM
Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 04:05:23 AM
Carrying a gun does not make you safe. It makes you and everyone around you a target.

When the fuck are we going to ban concealed and open carry.

Well, seeing as there's a piece of paper that says "you can have all the guns," signed by some dead guy a few hundred years old at the moment, not anytime soon.
The funny thing is that's not even how he said it, the context back then was completely different (back when we were in fear of being taken over from so many countries), and it says well regulated militia.

Oh believe me I'm aware of that one at this point.

A document that's a few hundred years old is, naturally, going to be out of date and out of context a bit.
I do often wonder why we're so obsessed with guns and so eager to get them out in the general public when it's proven it kills more.

If we were to promote gun safety and actually have ads about it like they do with other crap, then maybe I'd be okay with it. But as it goes they're too easy to get, and not enough people are being taught the responsibilities it carries.

Well, at this point I doubt there's anything to be done about it. Your culture is so steeped and ornery about firearms that you can't do shit to limit them without people immidiately feeling opressed and scared of going gunless. And even if you did manage it, supposedly, right now there's more guns in america than there are people.

You couldn't even make a dent in that amount of firearms at this point. And the culture couldn't handle it if you did make restrictive laws because at that point you'd be putting people who do obey the laws in danger because you've got so many fuckwit criminals shooting up the place who don't give a shit.

It's going to blow up one of these days.

Septy · October 10, 2015, 01:19:43 PM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 01:17:36 PM

Quote from: Luciana on October 10, 2015, 01:10:26 PM
Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 01:05:24 PM
Quote from: Luciana on October 10, 2015, 12:52:33 PM
Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 07:03:26 AM
Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 04:05:23 AM
Carrying a gun does not make you safe. It makes you and everyone around you a target.

When the fuck are we going to ban concealed and open carry.

Well, seeing as there's a piece of paper that says "you can have all the guns," signed by some dead guy a few hundred years old at the moment, not anytime soon.
The funny thing is that's not even how he said it, the context back then was completely different (back when we were in fear of being taken over from so many countries), and it says well regulated militia.

Oh believe me I'm aware of that one at this point.

A document that's a few hundred years old is, naturally, going to be out of date and out of context a bit.
I do often wonder why we're so obsessed with guns and so eager to get them out in the general public when it's proven it kills more.

If we were to promote gun safety and actually have ads about it like they do with other crap, then maybe I'd be okay with it. But as it goes they're too easy to get, and not enough people are being taught the responsibilities it carries.

Well, at this point I doubt there's anything to be done about it. Your culture is so steeped and ornery about firearms that you can't do shit to limit them without people immidiately feeling opressed and scared of going gunless. And even if you did manage it, supposedly, right now there's more guns in america than there are people.

You couldn't even make a dent in that amount of firearms at this point. And the culture couldn't handle it if you did make restrictive laws because at that point you'd be putting people who do obey the laws in danger because you've got so many fuckwit criminals shooting up the place who don't give a shit.

It's going to blow up one of these days.

Buy back program.

Australia did it and it was successful

Luciana · October 10, 2015, 01:22:50 PM

Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 01:19:43 PM

Buy back program.

Australia did it and it was successful

Americans are annoyingly independent and the political opportunists capitalize on it.

Sandtrap · October 10, 2015, 01:25:58 PM

Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 01:19:43 PM

Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 01:17:36 PM
Quote from: Luciana on October 10, 2015, 01:10:26 PM
Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 01:05:24 PM
Quote from: Luciana on October 10, 2015, 12:52:33 PM
Quote from: Deadtrap on October 10, 2015, 07:03:26 AM
Quote from: Septy on October 10, 2015, 04:05:23 AM
Carrying a gun does not make you safe. It makes you and everyone around you a target.

When the fuck are we going to ban concealed and open carry.

Well, seeing as there's a piece of paper that says "you can have all the guns," signed by some dead guy a few hundred years old at the moment, not anytime soon.
The funny thing is that's not even how he said it, the context back then was completely different (back when we were in fear of being taken over from so many countries), and it says well regulated militia.

Oh believe me I'm aware of that one at this point.

A document that's a few hundred years old is, naturally, going to be out of date and out of context a bit.
I do often wonder why we're so obsessed with guns and so eager to get them out in the general public when it's proven it kills more.

If we were to promote gun safety and actually have ads about it like they do with other crap, then maybe I'd be okay with it. But as it goes they're too easy to get, and not enough people are being taught the responsibilities it carries.

Well, at this point I doubt there's anything to be done about it. Your culture is so steeped and ornery about firearms that you can't do shit to limit them without people immidiately feeling opressed and scared of going gunless. And even if you did manage it, supposedly, right now there's more guns in america than there are people.

You couldn't even make a dent in that amount of firearms at this point. And the culture couldn't handle it if you did make restrictive laws because at that point you'd be putting people who do obey the laws in danger because you've got so many fuckwit criminals shooting up the place who don't give a shit.

It's going to blow up one of these days.
Buy back program.

Australia did it and it was successful

Except that Australia is sane to a degree. Like I said. You can't do fuck all in the US at this point because if you take away the only thing that law abiding civilians have against some asshole coming to do bad shit on somebody, you're going to see a hell of a lot more shootings and deaths.

It's a dual front problem. The excessive amount of guns and the support of them in being normal and average in people's lives, and the excessive amount of violent crime that occurs.