>This savage practice hasn't been exterminated on human rights grounds yet

I believe this subject is one of the few that justifies using the argument of CURRENT YEAR.

i'm surprised verb is pro tbh

Honestly, I would have thought you'd be against circumcision since it exposes children to extreme pain just a week after they're born. Also, the health issues are negligible if you live in a first world country. Literally, you'll have no problems if you just wash the area when you shower.

Pain that they won't remember--no more than they'll remember having their skull squeezed through the birth canal, causing them plagiocephaly for five months. If you're willing to forcefully schlep a child into the world in the first place, circumcision is going to be the least of that newborn's problems. Especially when you consider that it does have its benefits.

i'm surprised verb is pro tbh

I'm apathetic. I'm neither for nor against it. My personal experience with having been circumcised has worked out splendidly for me, so it's difficult for me to think of it as this big horrible thing that I should care about.

Pain that they won't remember--no more than they'll remember having their skull squeezed through the birth canal, causing them plagiocephaly for five months. If you're willing to forcefully schlep a child into the world in the first place, circumcision is going to be the least of that newborn's problems.

uh relative privation?
just because the majority of the anti-cut crowd aren't antinatalists doesnt give you free pass to be just as hypocritical.
"wow you guys oppose something bad, fucking idiots"

Especially when you consider that it does have its benefits.

yeah those europoors sure are just plagued with dick cancer compared to healthy american boys

There's nothing wrong with circumcision... at least non-Jewish performed ones. Normal doctors don't suck on a baby's penis after they chop the foreskin.

uh
Well my entire life was pretty fucking cushy and free from suffering, therefor it's difficult for me to see being birthed as a big horrible thing that I should care about.

??

The difference is that I've demonstrated in the past, quite thoroughly, exactly why I believe childbirth to be immoral and why life is a massive burden to levy upon a sentient being.

I haven't seen compelling enough reason to believe circumcision is anything at all to be concerned about, beyond the cliche confirmationally-biased psychology papers. So, show me.

Edit:
Or let Zen do it for you.

I like how Verb ignores looking up a video that would blow the arguments out of the water.

Quote from: eggsalad on April 21, 2016, 02:06:46 PM

I thought you were inexorably concerned about the idea of something suffering. Is ability to remember it necessary? If pain is inherently bad why is memory necessary? Does this now exclude simple animals that don't have the ability to reflect on pain cognizantly? If hypothetically I were to harm someone but be able to erase their memory of it without issue is that now not a big deal?

This I don't understand either. The biggest takeaway from Verb's posts has always been that all suffering is intrinsically bad and that it should be avoided at pretty much all costs. It's the reason why we should all be vegan and stop reproducing, so that we can prevent theoretical humans of the future from ever suffering and that we can minimise the suffering inflicted to all things alive right now. It's the entire reason why Verb sees things the way he does and why holds his political beliefs. I really don't see how his attitude here is compatible with his philosophy. I mean, this isn't about him actively fighting against the practice, blogging about the horrors of circumcision, or even considering it a priority at all. He doesn't even have to care about it much. But his response now? Not even condeming the completely unnecessary infliction of a tremendous amount of pain, suffering and risk of complications on defenseless and completely innocent, non consenting human beings or viewing it as something negative, but instead responding to it with mockery? Verb, the most "if you don't hate something objectively bad you're a fucking asshole" person I've ever known is now being condescending and hostile towards people who condemn suffering and want to see it gone?

The only possible explanations are that he's simply unaware, which I can't see being the case because this conversation has been had many times before, or that he actually is a little emotional and by lack of better word "butthurt" about this.

The problem is that Verb is consistently contrarian and an utter gadfly. He doesn't generally hold any consistent views although he'll never admit it. He just likes arguing/disagreeing with people no matter the issue. He'll pick a fight anywhere he can get one and then pretend he doesn't know what he's doing.

There's honestly not much point having any kind of debate with him for these reasons. I've pretty much not said a word to him for a solid year as I've been browsing on and off because of these reasons. Several friends of mine have stopped coming to the site altogether because of these reasons. Don't bother even responding to him.

To add to other comments, I think it's clear enough that people want to be able to be uncircumcised, and the fact that some people aren't given that opportunity because of a choice made for them by others causes suffering after-the-fact.

Holy shit Verbatim just got murdered.

No, not really at all.

Quote from: Verbatim on April 21, 2016, 05:52:25 PM

Quote from: challengerX on April 21, 2016, 05:38:18 PM

Holy shit Verbatim just got murdered.

No, not really at all.

Uh, you kinda did 2bh.

No, not really at all.

I'll shred everything apart later.