Parents release picture of baby born at 24-week abortion limit

More Than Mortal · September 13, 2014, 08:38:25 PM

Quote

A grieving mum has released this heartbreaking photograph of her premature daughter who was delivered at the 24-week abortion limit.

Born just 24 weeks into her mother’s pregnancy tiny Adelaide was too small to survive.

This treasured image of the tot reaching up as she let out a cry is the only picture her parents have of her alive.

Service Advisor Emily Caines, 25 from Yeovil, Somerset and husband security guard Alastair Caines, 29, released the photograph in a bid to open up the debate about abortion.

The current law allows babies to be terminated up to 24 weeks gestation, the same as Adelaide when she was born.

She said: "Our picture shows Adelaide was not a feotus she was a fully formed human being and to think that a baby like her could be legally terminated on grounds of a lifestyle choice is to me is horrifying. Medical grounds is a different matter.

"Our hospital was amazing and did all they could but Adelaide suffered complications which made it impossible for her to survive but many babies born at 24 weeks do live.

"That makes a mockery of the 24 week legal limit."

More Than Mortal · September 13, 2014, 08:40:57 PM

Quote from: Nuka on September 13, 2014, 08:40:13 PM

This is actually why I only support first trimester abortions.
Also I feel like this belongs in Serious.

Fuck. I pulled a reverse Door >.>

Can some mod move this to Serious.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · September 13, 2014, 08:41:07 PM

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Dustin · September 13, 2014, 08:42:27 PM

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More Than Mortal · September 13, 2014, 08:43:57 PM

Quote from: Le Dustin on September 13, 2014, 08:42:27 PM

I thought the law banned second trimester abortions. How the hell is this relevant to abortion?

Legal limit is 24 weeks.

Baby born at 24 weeks.

Baby is a baby.

nͫiͤcͫeͤ · September 13, 2014, 08:44:05 PM

don't worry the demonicsonic fixed it

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · September 13, 2014, 08:48:03 PM

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More Than Mortal · September 13, 2014, 08:49:35 PM

Quote from: TrussingDoor on September 13, 2014, 08:48:03 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on September 13, 2014, 08:43:57 PM
Quote from: Le Dustin on September 13, 2014, 08:42:27 PM
I thought the law banned second trimester abortions. How the hell is this relevant to abortion?
Legal limit is 24 weeks.

Baby born at 24 weeks.

Baby is a baby.
Probably gonna be disabled

Well, baby is also dead.

Yu · September 13, 2014, 10:30:30 PM

From the looks of it the limit should be lowered by a good amount.

velox · September 14, 2014, 12:59:47 AM

It's not often that a simple news article can change my views dramatically like this.

I'm still pro-choice, but if a fetus at 24 weeks looks like that, the limit needs to be significantly lower.

R o c k e t · September 14, 2014, 01:55:50 AM

As soon as 18 days after conception, there is a heartbeat.
I just can't believe the number of people who never got a chance to live because of abortion.
Millions and millions.

September 14, 2014, 02:46:36 AM

Yeah, no one supports abortions after the first trimester. Emotional, strawman argument if I've ever seen one.

September 14, 2014, 02:48:13 AM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 01:55:50 AM

As soon as 18 days after conception, there is a heartbeat.
I just can't believe the number of people who never got a chance to live because of abortion.
Millions and millions.

Living =/= sentient. We kill billions of cows, chickens, and pigs every year. Logically and scientifically, a fetus in the first trimester is beneath those animals.

challengerX · September 14, 2014, 03:51:47 AM

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Verbatim · September 14, 2014, 04:02:46 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on September 14, 2014, 02:46:36 AM

Yeah, no one supports abortions after the first trimester.

I sure as fuck do!

Verbatim · September 14, 2014, 04:10:58 AM

What's your argument against it?

Mr. Psychologist · September 14, 2014, 09:47:29 AM

*sigh*

Normally I steer clear of Abortion threads after the armageddon of them on B.net when they relaxed the rules but here we go <.<

My view is that once the CNS has developed, it shouldn't be aborted out of convenience. I'm not pro-life, but I'm not exactly pro-choice. The problem with the debate is the typical screeching shitstorm that happens from both sides.

You have the die-hard pro life psychotics who will abuse people walking into the clinics, howling like a pack of apes that they will burn in eternal hellfire for their actions. And on the other hand you have the equally deranged pro-choicers who say that anything short of full post-natal abortions is the patriarchy raping the rights of womyn.

Meanwhile parents are having to run this gauntlet and try to make the 'right choice' when there isn't really one.

If you go with a purely scientific/logic based approach as to whether it's a viable baby instead of a fully dependant foetus then 24 weeks is far too late. If you go with a more open minded approach and realise that sometimes it can be hard to tell if someone is pregnant until it's approaching the end of the first trimester/mid second sort of time (It does happen) then expecting them to make a snap decision before say, 12 weeks (The time at which the CNS is develop/ed/ing, I'm not 100% on that one) is a bit too arbitrary.

If you go with the laughable (In my opinion) approach that you should be able to abort right up until the baby is delivered then I'm at a loss for words on that one.

It's a tricky problem, made all the harder from the propaganda machines (Right and Left wing) diarrhoeaing misinformation all over the internet/media.

PSU · September 14, 2014, 09:55:40 AM

Unless the woman was raped or her life is in danger, all other abortions should be illegal.

More Than Mortal · September 14, 2014, 11:13:26 AM

Quote from: PSU on September 14, 2014, 09:55:40 AM

Unless the woman was raped or her life is in danger, all other abortions should be illegal.

Doesn't work.

I think it was Romania that tried it, but essentially it resulted in higher population growth and high rates of death among women. Pregnant women will find a way to have an abortion if they want one, and illegalising it makes it very, very dangerous.

R o c k e t · September 14, 2014, 11:26:52 AM

Quote from: SecondClass on September 14, 2014, 02:48:13 AM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 01:55:50 AM
As soon as 18 days after conception, there is a heartbeat.
I just can't believe the number of people who never got a chance to live because of abortion.
Millions and millions.
Living =/= sentient. We kill billions of cows, chickens, and pigs every year. Logically and scientifically, a fetus in the first trimester is beneath those animals.

Either way it'll become a human in time. Saying its "inhuman" before a certain point is simply self-justification.

And no, animals are not comparable to a human life.

More Than Mortal · September 14, 2014, 11:28:23 AM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:26:52 AM

And no, animals are not comparable to a human life.

I'd have to disagree there, to some extent.

The great apes, particularly chimpanzees, deserve the right of personhood.

Perhaps dolphins too.

R o c k e t · September 14, 2014, 11:30:52 AM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on September 14, 2014, 11:28:23 AM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:26:52 AM
And no, animals are not comparable to a human life.
I'd have to disagree there, to some extent.

The great apes, particularly chimpanzees, deserve the right of personhood.

Perhaps dolphins too.

I'm not saying animals don't matter at all, but saying farm animals matter more than a human baby's life........you gotta be kidding me.

And all the supporters of abortion need to realize this: if your parents were pro abortion, you wouldn't even be here to argue about this.

More Than Mortal · September 14, 2014, 11:31:50 AM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:30:52 AM

if your parents were pro abortion, you wouldn't even be here to argue about this.

So?

That seems utterly inconsequential.

R o c k e t · September 14, 2014, 11:32:51 AM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on September 14, 2014, 11:31:50 AM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:30:52 AM
if your parents were pro abortion, you wouldn't even be here to argue about this.
So?

That seems utterly inconsequential.

It shows that supporters aren't very grateful towards being alive.

More Than Mortal · September 14, 2014, 11:36:42 AM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:32:51 AM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on September 14, 2014, 11:31:50 AM
Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:30:52 AM
if your parents were pro abortion, you wouldn't even be here to argue about this.
So?

That seems utterly inconsequential.
It shows that supporters aren't very grateful towards being alive.

Can't say I agree.

I'd venture insofar as to say it could be considered immoral to not abort a baby which will be severely disabled. Nonetheless, while I agree life begins at conception, you need to be pragmatic. Legal or not, people will find a way to have abortions and it's safest when it's legal.

There's nothing inherently wrong in ending a life.

R o c k e t · September 14, 2014, 12:01:48 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on September 14, 2014, 11:36:42 AM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:32:51 AM
Quote from: Meta Cognition on September 14, 2014, 11:31:50 AM
Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 11:30:52 AM
if your parents were pro abortion, you wouldn't even be here to argue about this.
So?

That seems utterly inconsequential.
It shows that supporters aren't very grateful towards being alive.
Can't say I agree.

I'd venture insofar as to say it could be considered immoral to not abort a baby which will be severely disabled. Nonetheless, while I agree life begins at conception, you need to be pragmatic. Legal or not, people will find a way to have abortions and it's safest when it's legal.

There's nothing inherently wrong in ending a life.

1) so killing someone is ok now?

2) if you were the one being aborted, would you still support abortion? Support the fact that you never get a chance to live or breathe, simply because of somebody's preference?

More Than Mortal · September 14, 2014, 12:04:38 PM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 12:01:48 PM

1) so killing someone is ok now?

2) if you were the one being aborted, would you still support abortion? Support the fact that you never get a chance to live or breathe, simply because of somebody's preference?

1) That's not the claim I was making. I'm saying it isn't innately, inherently, in-and-of-itself immoral to end another human life.

2) If I was the one being aborted? That really is a non-question. I wouldn't have any experience or intellectual capacity to know about what I was missing out on. It's virtually the same as complaining about the fact that many potential persons have been lost because a guy wanks into a sock.

What a shame none of them will ever be able to live or breathe.

Verbatim · September 14, 2014, 12:10:43 PM

Quote from: Rocketman287 on September 14, 2014, 12:01:48 PM

2) if you were the one being aborted, would you still support abortion? Support the fact that you never get a chance to live or breathe, simply because of somebody's preference?

Oh GOD. This MAY just have given me cancer. I'm pretty sure it did.

As a pro-death individual, I think I'd respect my parent's choice to not force me into life, as if life is the greatest goddamn thing in the whole godless world. They shouldn't have conceived me to begin with, sure, they should have been more careful during sex, sure, but only because of two or three external factors unrelated to my fucking existence.

If someone was gonna buy me lottery tickets, but did so by stealing my money, and then changed their mind and returned what they stole, I'd be a pretty fucking happy camper.

cxfhvxgkcf-56:7 · September 14, 2014, 12:12:17 PM

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Verbatim · September 14, 2014, 12:13:38 PM

You would "despite it"? I don't even know what that means.

If you meant, "You'd think I'd spite my parents for trying to abort me, but I don't..." Yeah, that's probably what you meant.

No, I wouldn't think anyone with a rational brain would be all that upset over the prospect of being aborted.
Well, that's not a "prospect", but you know what I mean.