i dont know enough about science to add anything worthwhile to the discussion, but as an avid scifi fan, i can only imagine this going horribly wrong and somehow exploding our planet. would be a pretty cool way to go out tbh

In this way, the circulating hydrogen will become ionized, and achieve temperatures exceeding two hundred million degrees Celsius—more than ten times as hot as the sun at its blazing core.

NOPE

I really hope this works. Not just because fusion would be a great source of power, but the amount of time and money put into it. I feel like a lot of future fusion projects will use ITER for arguements.

ITER spent all this money and time, and produced nothing usable, etc...
ITER cost a lot, but it gave us sustainable fusion, and more power than we need, etc...

Personally, I'm worried about two things. Feasibly, the idea is sound. It's actual working physics.

But the two hurdles that don't make sense to me, are the heat generated, and the radiation.

Number one. Where do you put that heat? Where do you direct it and disperse it? Because that amount of heat cannot be contained by any physical apparatus we can build.

Pure diamond would be vaporized.

Number two. The radiation, the ultra violet rays, gamma rays, x rays, all of that shit that will be generated because a star generates all of these, where do you put it?

All of these things don't just simply....dissappear. They have to go somewhere. Travel and be released. Henceforth why our sun ejects them in all directions in the first place.

ITER to me seems like the actual definition of playing with fire.

Quote from: Sandtrap on March 17, 2015, 06:59:32 PM

Number one. Where do you put that heat? Where do you direct it and disperse it? Because that amount of heat cannot be contained by any physical apparatus we can build.

Says who? We're talking about plasma, here. Think about a candle: the flame is around 1000 degrees celcius, but because of the low density of plasma (it's the phase after gas, the least dense conventional phase of matter), it's painless to pinch out with your fingers. Assuming a catastrophic Fukushima-esque disaster causing a total loss of containment, the heat would dissipate in a matter of seconds. The containment walls might get scorched, but the reaction itself would stop immediately and the heat would dissipate.

Quote

Number two. The radiation, the ultra violet rays, gamma rays, x rays, all of that shit that will be generated because a star generates all of these, where do you put it?

Well they're not literally making a tiny star, they're just causing a fusion reaction using tritium as a fuel source. Tritium is an isotope of hydrogen, as opposed to fission's use of something heavy with a long half-life like uranium. Used fuel will be recyclable within a century, and materials exposed to radiation can be disposed. It's not particularly dangerous, especially compared to coal or oil.

I'm aware that the machine itself would pose no threat in a disaster because of how much power it would take to run it. Shut off any systems inside and the reaction stops immidiately. What I am talking about, is the heat buildup while the machine is running.

If you read through said article, you would know that the superconducting magnets were being cooled to roughly -270 something Celsius. As it's been said before, that is roughly the temperature of "space."

What does that imply?

That machine is going to be fucking hot. And the fact that they have to keep the magnets frozen so that they don't melt, because as stated, there is no physical substance on the planet that can withstand that heat or that process on direct contact, is a pretty obvious tell, that while this reactor is a candle, there's one problem.

It's a candle that can vaporize anything on contact while active. And the machine is going to be active, constantly. They don't just spend all that power, fire it up, smash a few atoms, and then turn it off. It doesn't work like that. Because once it's ignited, technically, it's a self sustaining reaction so long as the neccessary materials for it to happen are provided.

As long as the reactor runs, then I wouldn't be surprised if it could power itself and it's own functions.

But the key thing here, is heat build up. Heat doesn't just go away. It builds up.

Admitedly, I know less about radiation and wavelengths on that sort of subject, so you have me there. But I think the heat generated will be a problem. The other key thing to note here, is that this is not a candle.

This is a building sized, in essence, star. Now, candles may burn as fire, and be easy to put out, quick and painless because of their size, but as soon as you change the scale, it's not feasible. Pinch a campfire with your finger and you get set on fire.

That micro star is the same principle, considering that it's going to burn at the hottest temperature on our planet in its entire history.

Quote from: Sandtrap on March 18, 2015, 12:12:08 AM

As long as the reactor runs, then I wouldn't be surprised if it could power itself and it's own functions.

Well yeah, that's called a critical reaction. You want a reaction that's self-sustaining, so you don't have to keep providing input energy to the system. The heat is a good thing; that's how you convert the chemical energy of the reaction to electrical energy we can use. The heat superheats a pool of water which is pumped through a steam system, just like a fission reactor. Fusion is just another method of creating that heat. It's not like it's going to immediately melt everything in the room; the fuel is precisely measured to output exactly as much heat as they desire.

Quote

they have to keep the magnets frozen so that they don't melt, because as stated, there is no physical substance on the planet that can withstand that heat or that process on direct contact

Reread what you said. Nothing can withstand that heat, yet they're using supercooled materials in the chamber? So something can withstand the heat? Like I said, because of the low density of the plasma, it's not at all the same as say, touching a comparably hot piece of metal. The heat is transferred very inefficiently.

Let's just clear this up: the heat is a good thing, and the materials can withstand it.

The magnets aren't making contact with anything because the plasma is contained in a suspended magnetic field. It's all held safely away from coming into contact with anything. But if they needed to cool the magnets, then obviously it means that even though the reaction is suspended, there's still going to be heat.

Several million degrees celsius is still several million degrees celsius no matter what form it takes.

But on this, I can take your word for it. And I can take roughly 35 country's worth of scientists and engineers who obviously know their respective fields, far better than both I, or you.

I am, after all, a guy in a field.

And on the bright side of things, that reactor is on the other side of the planet. If something ever goes wrong and it does do something horrible like explode and fry half the country, I won't be there for it.

Regardless though, it is a project that has to be considered carefully. It's not something you can just wing to be sure. But, with some luck, they'll put everything together and that reactor could be the start of a new age.

Here's hoping, right? No lead scientist mechanical octopuses.

Star, you say?

Star....

Laboratories?

If this works I can see the coal powered companies big wigs hiring people to say shit about why this should be banned.