Net Neutrality Dead?

 
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how long would it take for Sep7agon to load up if net neutrality is gone?

I would be surprised if it still exists. ISP would blacklist this site if Cheat himself doesn't censor it.

You know what would be nice? If the website was actually privatized where it wouldn't be google indexed. Do we really need guests to read our posts?

The only board that's safe is Anarchy
This site has such a small footprint that I doubt it would make a significant difference, broski. The fall of net neutrality is probably only going to significantly affect streaming services and web apps unless ISPs really do go full ham and block off all parts of the internet except for a few (which I can see them doing by offering cheap "netflix and facebook only" plans or something so they can jack the price of regular internet access up.

Don't have a fit, is all I'm saying. It's probably going to be fine. :)


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This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.


Turkey | Mythic Inconceivable!
 
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I live in a country without codified net neutrality laws and the internet is the same as in the states. I'm interested to see what restrictions ISPs would place on VPNs though. With broadband access becoming increasingly less expensive for ISPs to provide, even at high speeds and bandwidth usage, there doesn't seem to be much of a reason to implement these hypothetical plans except as an attempt to eek out a bit more profit from customers, but at a huge risk given the public attitude towards exclusive plans.


 
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I live in a country without codified net neutrality laws and the internet is the same as in the states. I'm interested to see what restrictions ISPs would place on VPNs though. With broadband access becoming increasingly less expensive for ISPs to provide, even at high speeds and bandwidth usage, there doesn't seem to be much of a reason to implement these hypothetical plans except as an attempt to eek out a bit more profit from customers, but at a huge risk given the public attitude towards exclusive plans.
I think there's two things to keep in mind though. One, Japan has long had a much more competitive ISP market than the US, although it's recently been dwindling and formal net neutrality rules are being proposed. In the US, 80% of the country has only 1 or 2 carriers offering broadband speeds to choose from. There is a lot less competition and consumer choice, giving ISP's a lot more power to adopt these kind of practices. Two, there's a lot more to this than just legal net neutrality protections. Consumer protection, telecoms standards and quality of service requirements, antitrust / competition law and the influence of supervisory authorities (which is sorely lacking with the FTC in the US) are all important aspects of this, and while I'm no expert on Japanese law, I do know that the US isn't exemplary in many of these due to the power big companies have. That is all just to say that there's a lot more that goes into this than whether or not net neutrality is a formal law or not. Just because Japan gets by without it very well does not mean other countries will do the same.

I also think that the public attitude is probably overstated. When I brought up the issue with my girlfriend's family two weeks ago in the US, none of them had heard about it before. When I explained what might happen, they didn't think that the tiered / laned internet sounded that bad and would shrug at it becoming like a cable box service. The online minority just shouts very loudly while I'm willing to bet a very large chunk of the population doesn't care and wouldn't be too bothered by these practices.


 
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how long would it take for Sep7agon to load up if net neutrality is gone?

I would be surprised if it still exists. ISP would blacklist this site if Cheat himself doesn't censor it.

You know what would be nice? If the website was actually privatized where it wouldn't be google indexed. Do we really need guests to read our posts?

The only board that's safe is Anarchy
This site has such a small footprint that I doubt it would make a significant difference, broski. The fall of net neutrality is probably only going to significantly affect streaming services and web apps unless ISPs really do go full ham and block off all parts of the internet except for a few (which I can see them doing by offering cheap "netflix and facebook only" plans or something so they can jack the price of regular internet access up.

Don't have a fit, is all I'm saying. It's probably going to be fine. :)

Okay then let me ask you this. If its going to be all fine, why does Newgrounds have a warning pop up on this urging its users to call their local congressmen?

This means it can affect websites too. That includes Sep7agon.

I know this place isn't big like NG but it still counts. We're not a private website. If all of our posts are google indexed and the site is visible to guests, we're pretty much public.
I meant it was probably going to be fine for this site. Any large site, especially one that is software as a service, is going to feel the pain.


 
Flee
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Okay then let me ask you this. If its going to be all fine, why does Newgrounds have a warning pop up on this urging its users to call their local congressmen?

This means it can affect websites too. That includes Sep7agon.

I know this place isn't big like NG but it still counts. We're not a private website. If all of our posts are google indexed and the site is visible to guests, we're pretty much public.
Why exactly do you think this will affect sep7agon? I really cannot see how it would, yet you're talking about it with almost certainty.


MyNameIsCharlie | Mythic Invincible!
 
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Get of my lawn
Okay then let me ask you this. If its going to be all fine, why does Newgrounds have a warning pop up on this urging its users to call their local congressmen?

This means it can affect websites too. That includes Sep7agon.

I know this place isn't big like NG but it still counts. We're not a private website. If all of our posts are google indexed and the site is visible to guests, we're pretty much public.
Why exactly do you think this will affect sep7agon? I really cannot see how it would, yet you're talking about it with almost certainty.

It could very much effect Simple Machines. They host us.


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One, Japan has long had a much more competitive ISP market than the US, although it's recently been dwindling and formal net neutrality rules are being proposed.
Most people just go with one of a few mobile carriers for their internet access, even at home. It's a lot like the non-competitive market in the states. I'm not convinced that ending or changing the current laws will plunge the U.S. into a dark age of internet (nor did it prior to 2015). I do support net neutrality.
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I also think that the public attitude is probably overstated. When I brought up the issue with my girlfriend's family two weeks ago in the US, none of them had heard about it before. When I explained what might happen, they didn't think that the tiered / laned internet sounded that bad and would shrug at it becoming like a cable box service. The online minority just shouts very loudly while I'm willing to bet a very large chunk of the population doesn't care and wouldn't be too bothered by these practices.
We're kind of talking about two different ramifications, although some might claim they go hand in hand. One is that the internet is divided into tiered service bundles allowing you to add or remove certain high-bandwidth services like streaming video or gaming, and the other is the the potential for competitors to impose restrictions on each other, influence political content, etc. The latter is what really concerns me, whereas the former just seems like an extension of the current subscription plans various services already impose. I think most people like your girlfriend's family see the removal of NN as the chance that Cox might let them pay less since they don't play internet games or stream Netflix, when in could mean much more.


 
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Most people just go with one of a few mobile carriers for their internet access, even at home. It's a lot like the non-competitive market in the states. I'm not convinced that ending or changing the current laws will plunge the U.S. into a dark age of internet (nor did it prior to 2015). I do support net neutrality.
I agree with you on that. I support net neutrality but think there's a generous amount of exaggerating and doomsday scenarios being thrown around on the pro-NN side as well. And I don't doubt that most people stick with one of a few (mobile) carriers in Japan, but it is to my knowledge still more competitive than the US where home internet is still very common and many people simply do not have any real choice whatsoever. I've done some reading after your last post and found a government report (albeit slightly outdated) saying there's sufficient competition as well as some published studies that are only now (2016 and after) finding issues with competition, which is why the authors suggested net neutrality becoming a formal law in Japan as well.

Quote
We're kind of talking about two different ramifications, although some might claim they go hand in hand. One is that the internet is divided into tiered service bundles allowing you to add or remove certain high-bandwidth services like streaming video or gaming, and the other is the the potential for competitors to impose restrictions on each other, influence political content, etc. The latter is what really concerns me, whereas the former just seems like an extension of the current subscription plans various services already impose. I think most people like your girlfriend's family see the removal of NN as the chance that Cox might let them pay less since they don't play internet games or stream Netflix, when in could mean much more.
I don't think it's unreasonable to claim that they go hand in hand. Imposing these packages can be harmful to beginning businesses who might miss out on traffic or simply won't be able to pay or compete with larger competitors who can be included in the preferential / fast lane. And even though the anti-competition or political influence consequences are much more worrisome, I sure am not interested in being excluded from certain parts of the most free and global network ever created unless I pay to have specific parts of it unlocked. This isn't like cable where copyright, intellectual property, editorial decisions and whatnot are hugely important. I also think that some of the concerns (for example, people paying more for services they don't use) are very often unfounded as we do already have data plans (something which does not violate net neutrality at all). My grandma doesn't stream or play video games, so she gets by with the cheapest internet package giving her slower speeds and a datacap of a few dozen gigs a month. Internet usage and speed does not require a one size fits all approach, but that doesn't mean that the actual content of what people see and use it for should be restricted or differentiated between.

I don't think we actually disagree on this issue. We both support net neutrality and are skeptical of some of the doomsday scenarios. I also don't believe that the internet will be dead upon the removal of these rules. The rest of the world will do just fine and even in the US I don't think it'll be that disastrous. I just think that there is a reason for its repeal and no matter what it ends up being, it doesn't look for the consumer.


 
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Okay then let me ask you this. If its going to be all fine, why does Newgrounds have a warning pop up on this urging its users to call their local congressmen?

This means it can affect websites too. That includes Sep7agon.

I know this place isn't big like NG but it still counts. We're not a private website. If all of our posts are google indexed and the site is visible to guests, we're pretty much public.
Why exactly do you think this will affect sep7agon? I really cannot see how it would, yet you're talking about it with almost certainty.

It could very much effect Simple Machines. They host us.
Fair enough, but I think it's unlikely that this will happen. Cheat can also pick a host in a different country, so we'll end up being fine.