Judges Plead Guilty in Scheme to Jail Youths for Profit

Turkey · August 30, 2015, 01:32:14 PM

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2009/02/13/us/13judge.html?_r=0&referrer

Full dramatic story in the article. It's filled with sadness and oppression of youth, so I quoted only the actually relevant stuff.

Quote

[...]
The answers became a bit clearer on Thursday as the judge, Mark A. Ciavarella Jr., and a colleague, Michael T. Conahan, appeared in federal court in Scranton, Pa., to plead guilty to wire fraud and income tax fraud for taking more than $2.6 million in kickbacks to send teenagers to two privately run youth detention centers run by PA Child Care and a sister company, Western PA Child Care.

While prosecutors say that Judge Conahan, 56, secured contracts for the two centers to house juvenile offenders, Judge Ciavarella, 58, was the one who carried out the sentencing to keep the centers filled.

“In my entire career, I’ve never heard of anything remotely approaching this,” said Senior Judge Arthur E. Grim, who was appointed by the State Supreme Court this week to determine what should be done with the estimated 5,000 juveniles who have been sentenced by Judge Ciavarella since the scheme started in 2003. Many of them were first-time offenders and some remain in detention.

tl;dr Private prisons get to have more inmates so they bought at least two judges to send them more youth inmates than were really necessary.

But privatization of prisons is still a good idea, right?

challengerX · August 30, 2015, 02:48:20 PM

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big sponge · August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM

I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.

Anonymous (User Deleted) · August 30, 2015, 03:58:11 PM

There's zero evidence to suggest that private prisons are any better than state or federal prisons, but rather they're easy money for the snake oil salesmen who own them. Requirements to fill up all of the beds in prisons (they get 100% occupation guarantees when they build these things) have given the US one of the world's highest incarceration rates (more than Russia or Cuba, to put that into perspective). The private prison industry is one of the largest lobbying groups in the country, and it's because they've successfully lobbied for stricter sentencing guidelines (it is financially beneficial for them to do so) that got us into this mess in the first place.

Nearly everything about them reeks of corporate interests, and making a profit/justifying the costs of prisons should not be the bottom line of our justice system.

challengerX · August 30, 2015, 04:02:04 PM

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DAS B00T x2 · August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM

I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.

Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Mordo · August 30, 2015, 06:14:28 PM

Quote from: challengerX on August 30, 2015, 04:02:04 PM

I'm just waiting for Mordo's bitch ass to come in here and say "Niggers are at the root of this, I'm sure of it".

Who knew that integrating animals into society would be problematic.

The Lord Slide Rule · August 30, 2015, 06:36:57 PM

Quote from: HurtfulTurkey on August 30, 2015, 01:32:14 PM

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2009/02/13/us/13judge.html?_r=0&referrer

But privatization of prisons is still a good idea, right?

Does anyone that doesn't in some way profit from it actually think it is?

Luciana · August 30, 2015, 06:45:03 PM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

So you're saying because the government allows private prisons and hires for them, it's shit?

DAS B00T x2 · August 30, 2015, 06:54:50 PM

Quote from: Luciana on August 30, 2015, 06:45:03 PM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.
So you're saying because the government allows private prisons and hires for them, it's shit?

The contracts establish the quotas and occupancy rates. If the states would dig in against the lobbyists and fight their shit, the industry could be less of a grand evil.

big sponge · August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.

DAS B00T x2 · August 30, 2015, 07:02:00 PM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.

Can we ban liberals from Serious, please?

Anonymous (User Deleted) · August 30, 2015, 07:24:07 PM

I forgot to plug in my sarcasm detector, hold on just a sec

big sponge · August 30, 2015, 09:09:34 PM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 07:02:00 PM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM
Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.
Can we ban liberals from Serious, please?

You'd remove like 3 people at most and none of them would be me.

Mattie G Indahouse · August 31, 2015, 06:58:04 AM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.

What's going to stop these people from charging like $20 to use their road when it's the only one in that area?

Mr. Psychologist · August 31, 2015, 07:00:36 AM

Quote from: BerzerkCommando on August 31, 2015, 06:58:04 AM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM
Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.
What's going to stop these people from charging like $20 to use their road when it's the only one in that area?

Now that's just silly talk, the free market has literally zero flaws whatsoever.

DAS B00T x2 · August 31, 2015, 07:41:47 AM

Quote from: BerzerkCommando on August 31, 2015, 06:58:04 AM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM
Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.
What's going to stop these people from charging like $20 to use their road when it's the only one in that area?

The people. Corporations are slaves to a truly free populace.
They will either make other paths or take arms in protest.

eggsalad · August 31, 2015, 08:48:06 AM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 31, 2015, 07:41:47 AM

Quote from: BerzerkCommando on August 31, 2015, 06:58:04 AM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM
Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.
What's going to stop these people from charging like $20 to use their road when it's the only one in that area?
The people. Corporations are slaves to a truly free populace.
They will either make other paths or take arms in protest.

so you're saying that the defense against monopoly is trespassing (making new paths through areas not necessarily owned by the people who need them) or violence?

that or like
unions
rofl

challengerX · August 31, 2015, 10:15:43 AM

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DAS B00T x2 · August 31, 2015, 10:18:50 AM

Quote from: challengerX on August 31, 2015, 10:15:43 AM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 31, 2015, 07:41:47 AM
Quote from: BerzerkCommando on August 31, 2015, 06:58:04 AM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM
Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.
What's going to stop these people from charging like $20 to use their road when it's the only one in that area?
The people. Corporations are slaves to a truly free populace.
They will either make other paths or take arms in protest.
Yeah that's working out great in Somalia.

It is. We should all wish to be free pirates, plundering the goods of evil global corporations.

Luciana · August 31, 2015, 11:51:04 AM

You guys know LC was being sarcastic, right?

DAS B00T x2 · August 31, 2015, 03:24:08 PM

Quote from: Luciana on August 31, 2015, 11:51:04 AM

You guys know LC was being sarcastic, right?

Duh.

Alternative Facts · August 31, 2015, 03:26:26 PM

Pretty sure this was a Law and Order episode.

eggsalad · August 31, 2015, 03:55:25 PM

Quote from: Luciana on August 31, 2015, 11:51:04 AM

You guys know LC was being sarcastic, right?

im sorry i thought i was in the SERIOUS BOARD

DAS B00T x2 · August 31, 2015, 03:58:02 PM

Quote from: eggsalad on August 31, 2015, 03:55:25 PM

Quote from: Luciana on August 31, 2015, 11:51:04 AM
You guys know LC was being sarcastic, right?
im sorry i thought i was in the SERIOUS BOARD

Ha, good one.

Turkey · August 31, 2015, 04:11:52 PM

Oh, and in all fairness this is from 2009 and as far as I know is the only case prosecuted for the same type of crime.

As for inmate quotas, I think it should be more like a percentage of a state's inmates being housed in contract facilities, not a guarantee of being filled.

Mattie G Indahouse · August 31, 2015, 04:57:55 PM

Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 31, 2015, 07:41:47 AM

Quote from: BerzerkCommando on August 31, 2015, 06:58:04 AM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM
Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.
What's going to stop these people from charging like $20 to use their road when it's the only one in that area?
The people. Corporations are slaves to a truly free populace.
They will either make other paths or take arms in protest.

When it comes down to risks would a privet sector be willing to do them even though they may loose money? With NASA due to them being backed by the government if something goes wrong it's not much of a set back. With a private space thing they may not be willing to take as many risks as NASA due to money issues. If something goes wrong for them it will set them back and they may give up on it due to money lose.

Dr. Pavel · August 31, 2015, 05:26:34 PM

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The Lord Slide Rule · September 04, 2015, 04:21:14 PM

Quote from: BerzerkCommando on August 31, 2015, 06:58:04 AM

Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 07:00:20 PM
Quote from: GAIUS DASSIUS B00TSAR on August 30, 2015, 04:05:57 PM
Quote from: LC on August 30, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
I think we also need privately run courts.

Government isn't necessary, we should privatize everything because the private sector is better at everything. The public sector only holds us back.
Government contracts make the "private" prison industry the shitfest that it is.

Exactly.

This is why we need to completely do away with government. A fully privitized society would be free of corruption due to the free market.
What's going to stop these people from charging like $20 to use their road when it's the only one in that area?

playing the Devil's advocate

Um, competition is a thing man, there's no set rule that the road has to be the only one in the area. Somebody builds virtually the same road for cheaper. The other guy is then forced to lower his prices or close his road.

But once again I'm playing Devil's advocate.

More Than Mortal · September 04, 2015, 04:28:37 PM

Quote from: Kupo on August 30, 2015, 03:58:11 PM

There's zero evidence to suggest that private prisons are any better than state or federal prisons

There's some evidence in the UK that private prisons are indeed better, but other evidence I've seen kind of suggests that "study" is bullshit.

The incentives are all wrong in this instance; it makes no sense. Why the fuck would anybody think profiting off people's imprisonment is a beneficial economic phenomenon? It's like profiting off the ownership of individuals, and we all know how that turned out.