Quote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:29:02 PMIf that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.That is the only reason. Literally the whole reason it's so evil.
If that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.
Quote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:33:41 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:29:02 PMIf that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.That is the only reason. Literally the whole reason it's so evil.How do you know for sure?
Quote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:35:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:33:41 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:29:02 PMIf that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.That is the only reason. Literally the whole reason it's so evil.How do you know for sure?Because it's a fact. Women aren't allowed to serve in the military in a combat role. The reason being their gender.
Quote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:36:32 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:35:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:33:41 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:29:02 PMIf that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.That is the only reason. Literally the whole reason it's so evil.How do you know for sure?Because it's a fact. Women aren't allowed to serve in the military in a combat role. The reason being their gender.Well, their sex does indicate how strong/fast they'd be. I can't find anything here that indicates sexism or fear of it other than people not wanting it to be "like highschool", and fears of sexual assault. I got that from an article I was reading. I don't know, it all looks pretty messy.
Quote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:48:15 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:46:27 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:36:32 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:35:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:33:41 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:29:02 PMIf that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.That is the only reason. Literally the whole reason it's so evil.How do you know for sure?Because it's a fact. Women aren't allowed to serve in the military in a combat role. The reason being their gender.Well, their sex does indicate how strong/fast they'd be. I can't find anything here that indicates sexism or fear of it other than people not wanting it to be "like highschool", and fears of sexual assault. I got that from an article I was reading. I don't know, it all looks pretty messy.I'm not saying any woman should be allowed to serve, I'm saying that just like men, the women who pass the competency tests (how strong/fast they are) should be able to.No
Quote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:46:27 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:36:32 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:35:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:33:41 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:29:02 PMIf that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.That is the only reason. Literally the whole reason it's so evil.How do you know for sure?Because it's a fact. Women aren't allowed to serve in the military in a combat role. The reason being their gender.Well, their sex does indicate how strong/fast they'd be. I can't find anything here that indicates sexism or fear of it other than people not wanting it to be "like highschool", and fears of sexual assault. I got that from an article I was reading. I don't know, it all looks pretty messy.I'm not saying any woman should be allowed to serve, I'm saying that just like men, the women who pass the competency tests (how strong/fast they are) should be able to.
so do we have any evidence for this whole disruption-of-unit-cohesion meme, or are we just gonna keep saying it exists
Quote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 08:05:11 PMQuote from: challengerX on June 11, 2016, 08:04:19 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:48:15 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:46:27 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:36:32 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:35:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:33:41 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:29:02 PMIf that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.That is the only reason. Literally the whole reason it's so evil.How do you know for sure?Because it's a fact. Women aren't allowed to serve in the military in a combat role. The reason being their gender.Well, their sex does indicate how strong/fast they'd be. I can't find anything here that indicates sexism or fear of it other than people not wanting it to be "like highschool", and fears of sexual assault. I got that from an article I was reading. I don't know, it all looks pretty messy.I'm not saying any woman should be allowed to serve, I'm saying that just like men, the women who pass the competency tests (how strong/fast they are) should be able to.NoYesI get that you're some unapologetic advocate of discrimination, but this is too far
Quote from: challengerX on June 11, 2016, 08:04:19 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:48:15 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:46:27 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:36:32 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:35:01 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 07:33:41 PMQuote from: Gunt on June 11, 2016, 07:29:02 PMIf that was the only reason, yea, that's fucked up.That is the only reason. Literally the whole reason it's so evil.How do you know for sure?Because it's a fact. Women aren't allowed to serve in the military in a combat role. The reason being their gender.Well, their sex does indicate how strong/fast they'd be. I can't find anything here that indicates sexism or fear of it other than people not wanting it to be "like highschool", and fears of sexual assault. I got that from an article I was reading. I don't know, it all looks pretty messy.I'm not saying any woman should be allowed to serve, I'm saying that just like men, the women who pass the competency tests (how strong/fast they are) should be able to.NoYesI get that you're some unapologetic advocate of discrimination, but this is too far
Training and experience is what turns you into that
Quote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 04:11:50 PMTraining and experience is what turns you into thatNo, it isn't. You need grit. One of the primary functions of boot camp is to weed out people who just can't do it.
Quote from: Meta Cognition on June 13, 2016, 09:28:57 AMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 04:11:50 PMTraining and experience is what turns you into thatNo, it isn't. You need grit. One of the primary functions of boot camp is to weed out people who just can't do it.Grit =/= thinking women are beneath you
Quote from: SecondClass on June 13, 2016, 04:43:01 PMQuote from: Meta Cognition on June 13, 2016, 09:28:57 AMQuote from: SecondClass on June 11, 2016, 04:11:50 PMTraining and experience is what turns you into thatNo, it isn't. You need grit. One of the primary functions of boot camp is to weed out people who just can't do it.Grit =/= thinking women are beneath youHow is that relevant to what I said?
and apparently part of that is thinking you need to protect women.
Quote from: SecondClass on June 13, 2016, 05:03:16 PMand apparently part of that is thinking you need to protect women.No, he's saying that this is going to be a part of most male soldier's mindsets whether we like it or not. I really don't think Challenger considers going beserk in order to protect women a good thing, in that it improves soldier performance. If you don't understand this point by now, you have no business discussing the topic with him.
It's not some unavoidable problem that the soldiers we're choosing to enlist are sexists.
Quote from: SecondClass on June 13, 2016, 05:17:10 PM It's not some unavoidable problem that the soldiers we're choosing to enlist are sexists.In what universe is men going beserk to protect women sexist?
Thinking
Quote from: SecondClass on June 13, 2016, 05:33:49 PMThinkingThe central point we're making is that soldiers do precisely none of that in such a situation, and that this is the problem. We just differ from you in that we'd rather not run around calling soldiers sexist for acting as their instincts tell them to in the middle of a fucking combat situation. Have you ever spoken to a solider? Most of them will tell you that being in a fire-fight is like a drug; we don't train soldiers to think properly because nobody can think properly in a combat situation.
Quote from: Meta Cognition on June 13, 2016, 05:57:35 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 13, 2016, 05:33:49 PMThinkingThe central point we're making is that soldiers do precisely none of that in such a situation, and that this is the problem. We just differ from you in that we'd rather not run around calling soldiers sexist for acting as their instincts tell them to in the middle of a fucking combat situation. Have you ever spoken to a solider? Most of them will tell you that being in a fire-fight is like a drug; we don't train soldiers to think properly because nobody can think properly in a combat situation.but muh sexism
Quote from: SecondClass on June 13, 2016, 06:10:47 PMQuote from: challengerX on June 13, 2016, 06:06:32 PMQuote from: Meta Cognition on June 13, 2016, 05:57:35 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 13, 2016, 05:33:49 PMThinkingThe central point we're making is that soldiers do precisely none of that in such a situation, and that this is the problem. We just differ from you in that we'd rather not run around calling soldiers sexist for acting as their instincts tell them to in the middle of a fucking combat situation. Have you ever spoken to a solider? Most of them will tell you that being in a fire-fight is like a drug; we don't train soldiers to think properly because nobody can think properly in a combat situation.but muh sexismYeah, newsflash: discrimination is worse than having a slightly less effective military.Are you a comedian, musician... and the rest?
Quote from: challengerX on June 13, 2016, 06:06:32 PMQuote from: Meta Cognition on June 13, 2016, 05:57:35 PMQuote from: SecondClass on June 13, 2016, 05:33:49 PMThinkingThe central point we're making is that soldiers do precisely none of that in such a situation, and that this is the problem. We just differ from you in that we'd rather not run around calling soldiers sexist for acting as their instincts tell them to in the middle of a fucking combat situation. Have you ever spoken to a solider? Most of them will tell you that being in a fire-fight is like a drug; we don't train soldiers to think properly because nobody can think properly in a combat situation.but muh sexismYeah, newsflash: discrimination is worse than having a slightly less effective military.
Inequality
