I don't understand why people were mad at Snowden.

Lord Starch · October 12, 2015, 11:01:51 PM

People called him a traitor and said he was one of the worst Americans, but why? He did the country a favor by telling everyone that the NSA was spying on everyone and violating our rights. Shouldn't people have been glad that he pretty much confirmed what most people already suspected? Knowing is half the battle imo.

Thun · October 12, 2015, 11:02:26 PM

Literally sheeple.

cxfhvxgkcf-56:7 · October 12, 2015, 11:04:05 PM

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eggsalad · October 12, 2015, 11:05:53 PM

They will always complain about currently relevant information resulting in negative consequences for undergoing operations.
But the fact no where near all the info has been leaked should really defuse the concerns that Snowden is just some irresponsible caution-to-the-wind kiddy.
Also him fleeing to America's enemies is a direct result of American aggression. No NATO state would be safe to reside in, might as well choose a country that is actually capable of protecting you and not some backwater shit.

Mad Max · October 12, 2015, 11:10:29 PM

"If you see something, say something"*

*unless it's the government. If you say something, we'll prosecute you to the fullest extent of the law and/or make sure you're dead

Turkey · October 12, 2015, 11:10:53 PM

Cadenza has moved on · October 12, 2015, 11:14:24 PM

When I first heard people calling him a traitor I thought it was some bizarre parody of how an idiot would respond to someone helping them understand their government better, but I guess people just honestly believe he is one.

Mad Max · October 12, 2015, 11:16:05 PM

Quote from: Cadenza on October 12, 2015, 11:14:24 PM

When I first heard people calling him a traitor I thought it was some bizarre parody of how an idiot would respond to someone helping them understand their government better, but I guess people just honestly believe he is one.

The only true patriot is he who supports his country unconditionally. Exposing what your elected representatives are up to behind closed doors is the worst thing you could do

Spoiler

/s just in case

🍁 Aria 🔮 · October 12, 2015, 11:26:44 PM

I mean, I'm all for exposing government muck-ups, but exposing the identities of undercover agents is kind of a shit thing to do.

Verbatim · October 12, 2015, 11:31:04 PM

Quote from: Prime Megaten on October 12, 2015, 11:26:44 PM

I mean, I'm all for exposing government muck-ups, but exposing the identities of undercover agents is kind of a shit thing to do.

you should get on steam some time

🍁 Aria 🔮 · October 12, 2015, 11:34:44 PM

Quote from: Verbatim on October 12, 2015, 11:31:04 PM

Quote from: Prime Megaten on October 12, 2015, 11:26:44 PM
I mean, I'm all for exposing government muck-ups, but exposing the identities of undercover agents is kind of a shit thing to do.
you should get on steam some time

Tomorrow, I should be asleep right now tbh

Lord Starch · October 13, 2015, 12:22:42 AM

Quote from: HurtfulTurkey on October 12, 2015, 11:10:53 PM

You must be one of the people I'm talking about.

Lord Starch · October 13, 2015, 12:24:55 AM

Quote from: Prime Megaten on October 12, 2015, 11:26:44 PM

I mean, I'm all for exposing government muck-ups, but exposing the identities of undercover agents is kind of a shit thing to do.

I agree. Their lives are probably at stake. But maybe there was a specific reason behind it. Snowden seems like the type to plan everything out.

Release · October 13, 2015, 12:40:51 AM

Nationalism, and the information released may or may not have endangered some people's lives.

Anonymous (User Deleted) · October 13, 2015, 12:46:00 AM

Quote from: HurtfulTurkey on October 12, 2015, 11:10:53 PM

perfect

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · October 13, 2015, 08:59:30 AM

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More Than Mortal · October 13, 2015, 09:07:05 AM

Collection of metadata is not "spying". No data mining occurs, and everything is autonomous and anonymous; the phone book has more personal information about you than the NSA's metadata banks. Plus, you need to already have probable cause before being given a warrant to access the data.

cxfhvxgkcf-56:7 · October 13, 2015, 09:22:42 AM

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PSU · October 13, 2015, 09:42:16 AM

He is a traitor. Dude exposes all this info, acts like he's doing the right thing, but then leaves the country. He knew he was wrong and that's why he ran like a little bitch.

Pippen · October 13, 2015, 09:45:59 AM

Do I think that we should know the information that he exposed? Absolutely.
Should he have exposed undercover agents, making them lose everything and in constant danger? Absolutely not

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · October 13, 2015, 09:47:46 AM

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cxfhvxgkcf-56:7 · October 13, 2015, 10:07:57 AM

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Mordo · October 13, 2015, 10:26:29 AM

>'revealed' what we already knew then handed classified documents of military operations to the Russians on a silver platter.

But if we disagree with him I guess we're all gubment shills.

eggsalad · October 13, 2015, 10:36:09 AM

Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:26:29 AM

>'revealed' what we already knew then handed classified documents of military operations to the Russians on a silver platter.

Why do you pretend that Russia and China were not his best options for personal safety? Hell China isn't an entirely safe bet now.

Mordo · October 13, 2015, 10:40:18 AM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 13, 2015, 10:36:09 AM

Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:26:29 AM
>'revealed' what we already knew then handed classified documents of military operations to the Russians on a silver platter.
Why do you pretend that Russia and China were not his best options for personal safety? Hell China isn't an entirely safe bet now.

I really don't care about his personal safety. He clearly had no concern for the personal safety of the undercover military personnel he revealed to innumerable terrorist groups.

eggsalad · October 13, 2015, 10:44:09 AM

Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:40:18 AM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 13, 2015, 10:36:09 AM
Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:26:29 AM
>'revealed' what we already knew then handed classified documents of military operations to the Russians on a silver platter.
Why do you pretend that Russia and China were not his best options for personal safety? Hell China isn't an entirely safe bet now.
I really don't care about his personal safety. He clearly had no concern for the personal safety of the undercover military personnel he revealed to innumerable terrorist groups.

I'm just thinking you need to stop implying he handed information to Russia because he wants Russia to have the upperhand. He was essentially forced to because he is only protectend there as long as he cooperayes with them.

Mordo · October 13, 2015, 10:44:28 AM

In all honesty I find this whole Snowden debacle to be extremely patronising towards the American public. Everyone was perfectly willing to sacrifice their privacy to massive conglomerate corporations so they could get access to Google and Facebook for free, but as soon as the NSA was 'revealed' to be collecting metadata (which requires a legal warrant to investigate, and really has no bearing on your personal privacy) it was immediately painted as this huge comic book tier government conspiracy.

Metadata isn't even real data. It's just a transcript of phone calls and emails that the NSA had no legal grounding to look into without proper judicial sanctions.

Mordo · October 13, 2015, 10:47:19 AM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 13, 2015, 10:44:09 AM

Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:40:18 AM
Quote from: eggsalad on October 13, 2015, 10:36:09 AM
Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:26:29 AM
>'revealed' what we already knew then handed classified documents of military operations to the Russians on a silver platter.
Why do you pretend that Russia and China were not his best options for personal safety? Hell China isn't an entirely safe bet now.
I really don't care about his personal safety. He clearly had no concern for the personal safety of the undercover military personnel he revealed to innumerable terrorist groups.
I'm just thinking you need to stop implying he handed information to Russia because he wants Russia to have the upperhand. He was essentially forced to because he is only protectend there as long as he cooperayes with them.

I don't think he really cares who has the upper hand. He saw an opportunity to sell data to the highest bidder and took it at the expense of the safety of others.

Mad Max · October 13, 2015, 10:52:36 AM

Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:44:28 AM

Everyone was perfectly willing to sacrifice their privacy to massive conglomerate corporations so they could get access to Google and Facebook for free, but as soon as the NSA was 'revealed' to be collecting metadata (which requires a legal warrant to investigate, and really has no bearing on your personal privacy) it was immediately painted as this huge comic book tier government conspiracy.

...you don't see the difference between being able to choose what information you publish online, and the information the government gathers on you without your consent?

eggsalad · October 13, 2015, 10:54:28 AM

Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:47:19 AM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 13, 2015, 10:44:09 AM
Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:40:18 AM
Quote from: eggsalad on October 13, 2015, 10:36:09 AM
Quote from: Ronnie Pickering on October 13, 2015, 10:26:29 AM
>'revealed' what we already knew then handed classified documents of military operations to the Russians on a silver platter.
Why do you pretend that Russia and China were not his best options for personal safety? Hell China isn't an entirely safe bet now.
I really don't care about his personal safety. He clearly had no concern for the personal safety of the undercover military personnel he revealed to innumerable terrorist groups.
I'm just thinking you need to stop implying he handed information to Russia because he wants Russia to have the upperhand. He was essentially forced to because he is only protectend there as long as he cooperayes with them.
I don't think he really cares who has the upper hand. He saw an opportunity to sell data to the highest bidder and took it at the expense of the safety of others.

Thinking this is solely about money is equally retarded, no one would take that risk just for wealth. It'd be more likely to land you a censor label in a document than where he is now. Just because what he did was irresponsible and unjust does not mean he had nefarious intentions.