I do not understand how people support Trump

Cindy · March 21, 2016, 04:55:57 AM

There exist people that wholeheartedly support Trump - a lot of people, in fact - and that just makes my head hurt.

Like...how? I understand a difference of opinion and, while I personally would honestly rather have Trump than Cruz because of issues that I feel strongly about, I don't understand how anyone can actually be pro-Trump. His entire campaign is just a massive exercise in appeals to emotions, and none of the largest talking points of his campaign have any depth to them.

Like, the only reasons that I imagine people support him is because they're either:

a) so radically anti-establishment that they will vote for whoever isn't part of the "typical government" and looks to have a chance at winning

b) non or single-issue voters that jumped ship once they noticed that Sanders wasn't gonna win because they're deathly afraid of not meeting the status quo

c) neckbeards that like Trump because he's "alpha", use "cuck" to describe any political or social opposition, think that Muslims are ruining Europe, and whose greatest fear in this world is biracial couples.

I honestly cannot fathom anyone who actually, legitimately supports Trump on all of his policies - what little there are.

Mattie G Indahouse · March 21, 2016, 04:59:26 AM

They're supporting him because he wants to make America great again. Anybody who loves America is supporting him due to the great changes which are going to bring our country out of the hole it fell into and back into the light.

Cindy · March 21, 2016, 05:07:44 AM

Quote from: Little Willie on March 21, 2016, 04:59:26 AM

They're supporting him because he wants to make America great again. Anybody who loves America is supporting him due to the great changes which are going to bring our country out of the hole it fell into and back into the light.

I can't tell if this is a serious post or not, but I'm going to treat it like it is for the sake of discussion.

This is exactly what I mean when I say that his campaign is an appeal to emotions. How is he going to do that? He was asked, once, and gave a long speech saying precisely nothing on the methods.

Yes, saying things like "we're going to make America great again" and "we're going to stop ISIS" and "we're going to fix immigration laws and stop drug trafficking" are all fantastic things to say - but none of what he says can actually hold up. His plans for carrying out what he promises are abysmal, and it seems like most people only support him because of how nice it all sounds without looking into it.

Ian · March 21, 2016, 05:16:02 AM

Not to derail the topic but they are ruining Europe. Regardless of whether it's a minority or not, mass immigration is bringing in a shit ton of problems and ultimately the people know this. A countries duty is to its citizens first and refugees second, yet the governments of such countries are doing the exact opposite. You can't just welcome 10,000 people from a completely different culture and think everything is going to be okay. European Leaders are just sticking their fingers in their ears, closing their eyes and pretending there isn't a problem when their tax payers are screaming at them to have them removed.

I personally hate Trump, but seeing hypocritical rhetoric thrown against him ad nauseam gets old quick, part of me wants him to win just to spite them, but in all honesty every candidate is evil to me since they all turn a blind eye to the NSA surveillance.

Quote from: Cindy on March 21, 2016, 04:55:57 AM

think that Muslims are ruining Europe, and whose greatest fear in this world is biracial couples.

Mordo · March 21, 2016, 05:27:59 AM

He's a satirization and mockery of the democratic process in general.

You'd be surprised how far the the whole "take no shit, do what I want" act gets you in politics. By no means am I a supporter of his, but it's pretty funny watching the pitiful race, sexism and bigot cards get played only for it to amplify his status as an untouchable politician.

TheOneTrueDesticle · March 21, 2016, 07:12:14 AM

Quote from: Gaara444 on March 21, 2016, 05:16:02 AM

Quote from: Cindy on March 21, 2016, 04:55:57 AM
think that Muslims are ruining Europe, and whose greatest fear in this world is biracial couples.
Not to derail the topic but they are ruining Europe. Regardless of whether it's a minority or not, mass immigration is bringing in a shit ton of problems and ultimately the people know this. A countries duty is to its citizens first and refugees second, yet the governments of such countries are doing the exact opposite. You can't just welcome 10,000 people from a completely different culture and think everything is going to be okay. European Leaders are just sticking their fingers in their ears, closing their eyes and pretending there isn't a problem when their tax payers are screaming at them to have them removed.

I personally hate Trump, but seeing hypocritical rhetoric thrown against him ad nauseam gets old quick, part of me wants him to win just to spite them, but in all honesty every candidate is evil to me since they all turn a blind eye to the NSA surveillance.

I was gonna say, Muslim immigration is absolutely fucking Europe right now. There's really no question. People will try to suppress it and pretend it isn't happening for fear of being racist but it's a massive fucking issue right now. Sweden, Germany and England immediately come to mind.

EDIT: Within 24 hours of me posting this comment, an airport in Brussels was bombed by Islamists. Fuck that.

PSU · March 21, 2016, 08:33:20 AM

nd I don't understand how people can support 2 career politicians, one of which is a criminal and deserves jail time and another who is senile and has no idea how a healthy economy works.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · March 21, 2016, 11:44:23 AM

This user has been blacklisted from posting on the forums. Until the blacklist is lifted, all posts made by this user have been hidden and require a Sep7agon^® SecondClass Premium Membership to view.

Luciana · March 21, 2016, 11:53:56 AM

Quote from: Cindy on March 21, 2016, 05:07:44 AM

How is he going to do that?

Answer: He's not

He's running on emotion and ignorance and the "tough guy" stance, but the fact of the matter is congress has the final say in a lot of things. Even his healthcare description says something around the lines of "we'll ask Congress to..." a few times over, going entirely against his message. Of course Trump supporters don't really care about that, because they're so sick with their own party and government in general, that it's overriding the actual plans to do anything.

If there is one good thing coming out of this, it's that Trump has proven that Republicans following the whole Reagan "cut taxes/free enterprise" isn't something their people anymore. It's warped into them supporting big business rather than free enterprise, which is something Rubio pointed out in his going away speech.

But I digress.

Jester · March 21, 2016, 10:10:40 PM

He's nothing more than a pawn

MyNameIsCharlie · March 21, 2016, 10:59:30 PM

Because people are pissed and feel that their future has been stolen.

Sandtrap · March 21, 2016, 11:11:27 PM

I legitimately don't really comprehend why people vote for politicians in the first place anyway. I mean Trump's an obvious head scratcher. But all the others are no different either.

Really, I think all it comes down to is for the simple folk, Trump is saying the right vagueries. That's why people compare him to Hitler. He's charismatic to those who don't put much thought into things.

Luciana · March 21, 2016, 11:49:18 PM

Quote from: Sandtrap on March 21, 2016, 11:11:27 PM

I legitimately don't really comprehend why people vote for politicians in the first place anyway.

Well who else are we supposed to vote for? Did you word that wrong?

Sandtrap · March 22, 2016, 12:07:03 AM

Quote from: Luciana on March 21, 2016, 11:49:18 PM

Quote from: Sandtrap on March 21, 2016, 11:11:27 PM
I legitimately don't really comprehend why people vote for politicians in the first place anyway.
Well who else are we supposed to vote for? Did you word that wrong?

No. I didn't. I don't think we're supposed to vote for anybody, frankly. Personally, I think that a lot of our modern day society has a lot of holes in it. People might argue that the current system is what has helped us get so far, which is a fair point. But that's no reason to keep a failing system in place.

And you can't look at current western governments and seriously suggest to me that they aren't turning into failures if they already aren't. As it stands, right now, I'd say that governments exist and operate for the wrong reasons and they have far too much jurisdiction and tread in places they shouldn't.

Who else are you supposed to vote for? Nobody. It's a rigged game and continuing to play it is childish.

Luciana · March 22, 2016, 12:14:28 AM

Quote from: Sandtrap on March 22, 2016, 12:07:03 AM

Quote from: Luciana on March 21, 2016, 11:49:18 PM
Quote from: Sandtrap on March 21, 2016, 11:11:27 PM
I legitimately don't really comprehend why people vote for politicians in the first place anyway.
Well who else are we supposed to vote for? Did you word that wrong?

No. I didn't. I don't think we're supposed to vote for anybody, frankly. Personally, I think that a lot of our modern day society has a lot of holes in it. People might argue that the current system is what has helped us get so far, which is a fair point. But that's no reason to keep a failing system in place.

And you can't look at current western governments and seriously suggest to me that they aren't turning into failures if they already aren't. As it stands, right now, I'd say that governments exist and operate for the wrong reasons and they have far too much jurisdiction and tread in places they shouldn't.

Who else are you supposed to vote for? Nobody. It's a rigged game and continuing to play it is childish.

Well then what's the better alternative? There needs to be some people running the nation, right?

Unless you're an anarchist.

Sandtrap · March 22, 2016, 12:21:47 AM

Quote from: Luciana on March 22, 2016, 12:14:28 AM

Quote from: Sandtrap on March 22, 2016, 12:07:03 AM
Quote from: Luciana on March 21, 2016, 11:49:18 PM
Quote from: Sandtrap on March 21, 2016, 11:11:27 PM
I legitimately don't really comprehend why people vote for politicians in the first place anyway.
Well who else are we supposed to vote for? Did you word that wrong?

No. I didn't. I don't think we're supposed to vote for anybody, frankly. Personally, I think that a lot of our modern day society has a lot of holes in it. People might argue that the current system is what has helped us get so far, which is a fair point. But that's no reason to keep a failing system in place.

And you can't look at current western governments and seriously suggest to me that they aren't turning into failures if they already aren't. As it stands, right now, I'd say that governments exist and operate for the wrong reasons and they have far too much jurisdiction and tread in places they shouldn't.

Who else are you supposed to vote for? Nobody. It's a rigged game and continuing to play it is childish.
Well then what's the better alternative? There needs to be some people running the nation, right?

Unless you're an anarchist.

I may live in a field but I'd like to think that I'm not dumb.

I know the history of my province. If it wasn't for the mounties that rode out from Ottawa under government orders and established rule and law, this province would have stayed lawless and directionless. I know there has to be some people running the show in an overlapping, leading sort of structure.

I just don't think that the current structure does a good job, nor will it ever be capable of it because it's not structured correctly. It needs a sytem reboot, methinks.

Ian · March 22, 2016, 03:27:49 AM

You're only half right. People mostly compare him to Hitler simply because he's the Republican candidate and there has been a huge push (looking like it's almost out of desperation) to try and kill off the party by throwing the racism, sexism, and discrimination card against them every year. Romney and McCain before him also had to wade through being called Satan's spawn by the Left to get their votes, the only difference now is that Trump doesn't care and his lack of interest in fighting it builds momentum which causes the desperate shit flinging to get even more desperate.

Quote from: Sandtrap on March 21, 2016, 11:11:27 PM

Really, I think all it comes down to is for the simple folk, Trump is saying the right vagueries. That's why people compare him to Hitler. He's charismatic to those who don't put much thought into things.

TheOneTrueDesticle · March 22, 2016, 05:05:45 PM

Hey, remember this post I made less than 24 hours ago?

But Europe is totally fine guys.

More Than Mortal · March 22, 2016, 05:12:26 PM

He appeals to the white underclass in society, which is quickly being left behind.

Blonic the Fluxmeister · March 23, 2016, 10:23:58 AM

Quote from: PSU on March 21, 2016, 08:33:20 AM

nd I don't understand how people can support 2 career politicians, one of which is a criminal and deserves jail time and another who is senile and has no idea how a healthy economy works.

Sanders just looks like he could have a heart attack any minute, in all honesty.

Cadenza has moved on · March 24, 2016, 05:23:44 AM

Because the entire liberal world has turned on normal people for not being "progressive" enough and Trump is a big fuck you in response.

Quote from: Cindy on March 21, 2016, 04:55:57 AM

I honestly cannot fathom anyone who actually, legitimately supports Trump on all of his policies - what little there are.

Did you ever consider that that is exactly the point of all this? you liberals are so arrogant in your beliefs that you can't comprehend somebody being opposed to you forcing your "progressive" ideals on people. We don't want immigrants, we don't want white guilt, we don't want forced diversity, we don't want the hypocrisy of us being the only group on earth capable of being racist, we don't want to be labelled worse than Hitler for simply voicing our opinions. And we don't want your fetish for blacks and muslims.

Verbatim · March 24, 2016, 05:40:22 AM

Quote from: Cadenza on March 24, 2016, 05:23:44 AM

Because the entire liberal world has turned on normal people for not being "progressive" enough and Trump is a big fuck you in response.

Oh, what a great reason to put a cartoon character in the most powerful office in the world.

Quote

Did you ever consider that that is exactly the point of all this? you liberals are so arrogant in your beliefs that you can't comprehend somebody being opposed to you forcing your "progressive" ideals on people. We don't want immigrants, we don't want white guilt, we don't want forced diversity, we don't want the hypocrisy of us being the only group on earth capable of being racist, we don't want to be labelled worse than Hitler for simply voicing our opinions. And we don't want your fetish for blacks and muslims.

And you what the funny thing is? There are a great deal of progressives who don't want any of this stuff either. Myself included.

Except for maybe the white guilt thing.

Cadenza has moved on · March 24, 2016, 05:52:41 AM

Quote from: Verbatim on March 24, 2016, 05:40:22 AM

Quote from: Cadenza on March 24, 2016, 05:23:44 AM
Because the entire liberal world has turned on normal people for not being "progressive" enough and Trump is a big fuck you in response.
Oh, what a great reason to put a cartoon character in the most powerful office in the world.

That's assuming he's not simply playing the system until he gets into office; Would anyone give a damn if Trump talked like Bush or Rubio or Cruz? no, he does what he does to trick the media into giving him attention, to trick all the liberals into thinking that they're so much smarter than him and that they just have to prove him wrong, and in the process he gets to vocalize what people like me are thinking but can't say in public, and force the media to show it's hypocrisy and bias.

Quote

Quote
Did you ever consider that that is exactly the point of all this? you liberals are so arrogant in your beliefs that you can't comprehend somebody being opposed to you forcing your "progressive" ideals on people. We don't want immigrants, we don't want white guilt, we don't want forced diversity, we don't want the hypocrisy of us being the only group on earth capable of being racist, we don't want to be labelled worse than Hitler for simply voicing our opinions. And we don't want your fetish for blacks and muslims.
And you what the funny thing is? There are a great deal of progressives who don't want any of this stuff either. Myself included.

Except for maybe the white guilt thing.

I'm well aware that you people want mostly the same things as me and that it's mostly fringe stuff that causes disagreements, but tribalism is the name of the game; trying to be moderate and to compromise and appeal to liberal sensibilities has not worked for the right wing, it just makes us look weak and gives you an advantage, Trump's solution gets results plain and simple.

Also, what is your stance on white guilt?

Luciana · March 24, 2016, 06:06:45 AM

Quote from: Cadenza on March 24, 2016, 05:23:44 AM

Did you ever consider that that is exactly the point of all this? you liberals are so arrogant in your beliefs that you can't comprehend somebody being opposed to you forcing your "progressive" ideals on people. We don't want immigrants, we don't want white guilt, we don't want forced diversity, we don't want the hypocrisy of us being the only group on earth capable of being racist, we don't want to be labelled worse than Hitler for simply voicing our opinions. And we don't want your fetish for blacks and muslims.

You know, regardless of where you lean, this is a pretty ignorant statement. Saying Trump doesn't have any plans isn't a liberal idea. It's a correct observation. Regardless of where you lean on immigrants, gay rights, and refugee things, it is more than correct to say Trump has no message behind 90% of his messages. They're all just slogans. If the "point" is to just go against "the man", then good job? I guess you can have your cookie behind all the racist rhetoric and un-American things behind it.

Luciana · March 24, 2016, 06:09:40 AM

Quote from: Cadenza on March 24, 2016, 05:52:41 AM

Trump's solution gets results plain and simple.

I really can't wait to see what your opinions on Trump and his message are when he loses in the General election. Everyone outside the far right dislikes him, and Cruz isn't a better option either.

Also

Quote

trying to be moderate and to compromise and appeal to liberal sensibilities has not worked for the right wing, it just makes us look weak and gives you an advantage,

Quote

trying to be moderate and to compromise

Quote

compromise

Where have you been since 2010? The reason a lot of Republican voters hate their party is them promising things and never getting them done, and not even doing something as simple as their job. Obstructionism was their main priority for a vast majority of them, and anyone who disagreed with them, they tried to hammer and kick out of office for so much as wanting to come to agreements. It's sad when the top priority of the senate majority leader was to make Obama a one term president. Not immigration reform, not healthcare reform (we'll repeal Obamacare and replace it with something better, but we'll get back to you on what we have that's better), nothing. It's literally a reap what you sow situation.

Cadenza has moved on · March 24, 2016, 06:21:59 AM

Quote from: Luciana on March 24, 2016, 06:06:45 AM

Quote from: Cadenza on March 24, 2016, 05:23:44 AM
Did you ever consider that that is exactly the point of all this? you liberals are so arrogant in your beliefs that you can't comprehend somebody being opposed to you forcing your "progressive" ideals on people. We don't want immigrants, we don't want white guilt, we don't want forced diversity, we don't want the hypocrisy of us being the only group on earth capable of being racist, we don't want to be labelled worse than Hitler for simply voicing our opinions. And we don't want your fetish for blacks and muslims.
You know, regardless of where you lean, this is a pretty ignorant statement. Saying Trump doesn't have any plans isn't a liberal idea. It's a correct observation. Regardless of where you lean on immigrants, gay rights, and refugee things, it is more than correct to say Trump has no message behind 90% of his messages. They're all just slogans. If the "point" is to just go against "the man", then good job? I guess you can have your cookie behind all the racist rhetoric and un-American things behind it.

Officialy speaking that's wrong, his positions are there but I would be lying if I said that I or anyone else supports Trump because of that list.

You see every criticism of Trump boils down to "Trump doesn't act like how I want him to act", in this case it's "Trump doesn't go into enough detail about his plans", normally it's "Trump isn't as nice as I expect politicians to be" and "Trump doesn't pander to liberal ideals as much as I want politicians to"

That's not a valid criticism, his entire campaign is built on saying what no one else is saying, and being cocky and vague is how he keeps the world's attention. You're criticizing him for being successful, but you don't seem to realize that if he wasn't acting this way, no one would be paying attention. If Trump starts going into more details (or acts kinder, or pays some lip service) then he looses our interest, and so he looses the election.

Now Trump hasn't ever said anything racist, but he speaks in such a way that someone like you could interpret him as being close to racist, that's the plan. You cry racist while we supporters are forced to look over his words in an attempt to find the racist part, only to not find anything racist, and in the process grow more supportive of the words we agree with.

Luciana · March 24, 2016, 06:34:59 AM

If your entire campaign is based off of slogans and misinformation left and right, you're doing something wrong. He's getting this attention because he knows it's a TV show for his campaign. You're right, that's how he gets attention, and with how shitty the candidates are on the right side, I guess I can't blame you for picking him.

Quote from: Cadenza on March 24, 2016, 06:21:59 AM

Now Trump hasn't ever said anything racist, but he speaks in such a way that someone like you could interpret him as being close to racist, that's the plan.

"Laziness is a trait in the blacks. ... Black guys counting my money! I hate it."

“The only kind of people I want counting my money are little short guys that wear yamakas every day.” (admittedly, this one is funny)

Right, not very racist. Now before you throw the libbie card at me, just know I don't think he's much of a racist. It's how he comes off and the message he gives to people who ARE in fact pretty damn openly racist.

And if "not acting presidential" is him encouraging violence at his rallies, then yeah, I don't know what you're on about. And him just insulting people left and right to make a headline is stupid, along with insulting people in "his own party" like John McCain, saying he's not a war veteran and only was because he got captured? Trump's never been in a war, so he can screw right off with that. And I don't know why you'd want to support someone who says things like this.

“The concept of global warming was created by and for the Chinese in order to make U.S. manufacturing non-competitive.”

Cadenza has moved on · March 24, 2016, 06:37:55 AM

Quote from: Luciana on March 24, 2016, 06:09:40 AM

Quote from: Cadenza on March 24, 2016, 05:52:41 AM
Trump's solution gets results plain and simple.
I really can't wait to see what your opinions on Trump and his message are when he loses in the General election. Everyone outside the far right dislikes him, and Cruz isn't a better option either.

irrelevant, Trump's already shown me that there are millions of people like me that hate the current political climate. A common liberal talking point is that the world has been on a historical march to being more "progressive" and "tolerant" and that this march will continue indefinitely; and that "old fashioned and out dated" beliefs like mine will just die out.

But in reality my ideals are alive and well; it's hard to see that from my liberal university but Trump's shown that a progressive victory isn't certain.

Quote

Also

Quote
trying to be moderate and to compromise and appeal to liberal sensibilities has not worked for the right wing, it just makes us look weak and gives you an advantage,
Quote
trying to be moderate and to compromise
Quote
compromise
Where have you been since 2010? The reason a lot of Republican voters hate their party is them promising things and never getting them done, and not even doing something as simple as their job. Obstructionism was their main priority for a vast majority of them, and anyone who disagreed with them, they tried to hammer and kick out of office for so much as wanting to come to agreements. It's sad when the top priority of the senate majority leader was to make Obama a one term president. Not immigration reform, not healthcare reform (we'll repeal Obamacare and replace it with something better, but we'll get back to you on what we have that's better), nothing. It's literally a reap what you sow situation.

The specifics of the Republican party wasn't what I was talking about, what I had in mind was a situation like this:
"I oppose immigration"
"That's racist!"
"No you see i'm not actually racist, I just...(excuses)"
You see there's no way to voice that view in public, but Trump gets away with it by being over the top about everything, instead of backing down he doubles down.
"I oppose immigration"
"That's racist!"
"And I'm going to build a wall"
"That's racist!"
"And I'm going to ban muslims"
"That's racist!"
It's not racist, it works.

Luciana · March 24, 2016, 06:40:27 AM

I agree labeling racist on everything is infuriating, believe me I do, but it's very unamerican to oppose Immigration, considering that's our entire country, and saying you're gonna ban all muslims isn't racist, it's xenophobic and asinine.

Nothing "works" about it.

And please for the love of Allah, can you please stop saying "libbie" or "liberal" every 5 seconds? It's such a buzzword and makes you sound like a pissed off redneck. Throwing labels on everything and thinking of everything as "left and right" views is insanely irritating.

Cadenza has moved on · March 24, 2016, 07:15:43 AM

Quote from: Luciana on March 24, 2016, 06:40:27 AM

I agree labeling racist on everything is infuriating, believe me I do, but it's very unamerican to oppose Immigration, considering that's our entire country, and saying you're gonna ban all muslims isn't racist, it's xenophobic and asinine.

Nothing "works" about it.

The difference here is that immigrants normally integrate themselves into the country, but as Britain has shown, Muslims form ghettos and isolate themselves when they have large enough numbers; I don't have a right to say what is or isn't American but being opposed to having Muslims create a 'country' within your country isn't wrong.

If someone other than Trump was doing something about that then I'm not aware of it; what I know is that now this issue is on the table and potentially solvable with Trump, that's what works.

Quote

And please for the love of Allah, can you please stop saying "libbie" or "liberal" every 5 seconds? It's such a buzzword and makes you sound like a pissed off redneck. Throwing labels on everything and thinking of everything as "left and right" views is insanely irritating.

Can do; but I'm not sure what the best word is to describe the leftwing politics i'm talking about, liberal works as a catch all which is why I've used it. I'm tempted to say "modern western democratic values" instead, but that feels like playing semantics.