Two things to understand about Eric Garner's death

Kinder Graham · December 12, 2014, 03:09:39 PM

When you watch something and discuss it in detail in a classroom, you pick up things nobody elses notices and here's solid good two.

Ever catch the supervisor "in charge" of the whole scene? Well to put it straight, it was a black women; so why does this manner? Well for one, it refutes this entire incident as racially motivated as it can be seen clear as day that she was being as useless as the other officers, she wasn't contacting dispatch to coordinate with EMS arrival, she wasn't asking what was going on, and she wasn't addressing the large crowd gathering. Sergeants have many duties when on an active crime scene and she did not do a single thing and she needs to be the first to receive penalties

Another thing, how about that quality EMS service? No sirens, no ambulance on the street, seriously New York? Not only that, but the only thing this EMS does is check for a pulse and doesn't even have her medical bag. If people are going to be pissed off at the police, be equally pissed at the EMS. I know for sure that the block Garner died on, I'll be sure to not choke or need medical attention

YouTube

More Than Mortal · December 12, 2014, 03:11:53 PM

I firmly believe in hierarchy, but that also confers responsibility.

Police officers who fuck up should absolutely be punished more heavily than citizens for crimes they commit, and sergeants more than constables.

Kinder Graham · December 12, 2014, 03:15:35 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on December 12, 2014, 03:11:53 PM

I firmly believe in hierarchy, but that also confers responsibility.

Police officers who fuck up should absolutely be punished more heavily than citizens for crimes they commit, and sergeants more than constables.

Initially the police were doing everything fine, it was until he said he couldn't breath that things went overboard

Flee · December 12, 2014, 03:16:48 PM

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DAS B00T x2 · December 12, 2014, 03:17:25 PM

Quote from: KletzenbrotEssen on December 12, 2014, 03:15:35 PM

Quote from: Meta Cognition on December 12, 2014, 03:11:53 PM
I firmly believe in hierarchy, but that also confers responsibility.

Police officers who fuck up should absolutely be punished more heavily than citizens for crimes they commit, and sergeants more than constables.
Initially the police were doing everything fine, it was until he said he couldn't breath that things went overboard

You mean until the officer performed a restraining move banned by the NYPD.

Kinder Graham · December 12, 2014, 03:19:56 PM

Quote from: DAS B00T DAS B00T on December 12, 2014, 03:17:25 PM

Quote from: KletzenbrotEssen on December 12, 2014, 03:15:35 PM
Quote from: Meta Cognition on December 12, 2014, 03:11:53 PM
I firmly believe in hierarchy, but that also confers responsibility.

Police officers who fuck up should absolutely be punished more heavily than citizens for crimes they commit, and sergeants more than constables.
Initially the police were doing everything fine, it was until he said he couldn't breath that things went overboard
You mean until the officer performed a restraining move banned by the NYPD.

Now that's a BIG misconception. New York bans chokeholds, what the officer was trying to do was perform a seat belt takedown where the arm goes around the chest like a seat-belt would. A chokehold is where the crevice/bending part of your arm goes directly in the front/middle of your throat; the video doesn't show a chokehold

Kinder Graham · December 12, 2014, 03:22:47 PM

Quote from: Flee on December 12, 2014, 03:16:48 PM

Can I get a quick update on this? There's just so many cases of police abuse and people dying in contact with law enforcement in the US that I can't discern their names or cases anymore.

The guy has a long previous record with arrests and jailtime. Police get a call from a store owner that this guy is selling untaxed cigarettes on the corner, costing the store owner money (pack is $17 in NY, which is fucking outrageous) so the police arrive. They talk to him and Garner resists by blocking the officer's hands which is a crime. Officer behind Garner attempts a seatbelt takedown. He's finally on the ground and starts saying he can't breath

Note Garner is about 6'5 and 300 pounds; big guy

DAS B00T x2 · December 12, 2014, 03:24:01 PM

Quote from: KletzenbrotEssen on December 12, 2014, 03:19:56 PM

Quote from: DAS B00T DAS B00T on December 12, 2014, 03:17:25 PM
Quote from: KletzenbrotEssen on December 12, 2014, 03:15:35 PM
Quote from: Meta Cognition on December 12, 2014, 03:11:53 PM
I firmly believe in hierarchy, but that also confers responsibility.

Police officers who fuck up should absolutely be punished more heavily than citizens for crimes they commit, and sergeants more than constables.
Initially the police were doing everything fine, it was until he said he couldn't breath that things went overboard
You mean until the officer performed a restraining move banned by the NYPD.
Now that's a BIG misconception. New York bans chokeholds, what the officer was trying to do was perform a seat belt takedown where the arm goes around the chest like a seat-belt would. A chokehold is where the crevice/bending part of your arm goes directly in the front/middle of your throat; the video doesn't show a chokehold

The officer should have realized that he's far too small to perform such a maneuver on a tall, morbidly obese man.

Alternative Facts · December 12, 2014, 03:25:08 PM

Quote from: Flee on December 12, 2014, 03:16:48 PM

Can I get a quick update on this? There's just so many cases of police abuse and people dying in contact with law enforcement in the US that I can't discern their names or cases anymore.

Believe me. Even those of us here can't keep up with the sheer number of cases.

Flee · December 12, 2014, 03:27:41 PM

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Lemy the Lizerd · December 12, 2014, 03:30:19 PM

I do not believe Eric Garner's death was racially motivated. I do, however, believe it was not justified and the officer should be prosecuted.

I do not believe Mike Brown's death was racially motivated. I do, however, believe the use of force was justified. I believe that racial profiling does occur often in police departments, but it is not institutionalized.

I am not sure whether Tamir Rice's death was racially motivated. I do believe use of force would have been justified had he been given time to react to the officers and still reached for the air gun. The footage, however, shows the police opening fire unreasonably quickly, which is not justified.

Kinder Graham · December 12, 2014, 03:35:03 PM

Quote from: Lemy the Lizerd on December 12, 2014, 03:30:19 PM

I do not believe Eric Garner's death was racially motivated. I do, however, believe it was not justified and the officer should be prosecuted.

I do not believe Mike Brown's death was racially motivated. I do, however, believe the use of force was justified. I believe that racial profiling does occur often in police departments, but it is not institutionalized.

I am not sure whether Tamir Rice's death was racially motivated. I do believe use of force would have been justified had he been given time to react to the officers and still reached for the air gun. The footage, however, shows the police opening fire unreasonably quickly, which is not justified.

oops, didn't see "do not"

Kinder Graham · December 12, 2014, 03:37:59 PM

Quote from: IcyWind on December 12, 2014, 03:25:08 PM

Quote from: Flee on December 12, 2014, 03:16:48 PM
Can I get a quick update on this? There's just so many cases of police abuse and people dying in contact with law enforcement in the US that I can't discern their names or cases anymore.

Believe me. Even those of us here can't keep up with the sheer number of cases.

Sheer number?

It's not like there's case after case after case; out of a million arrests in a year, only 400 result in the death of a suspect and that doesn't include that amount of justified cases. The stereotype that cops are trigger happy is grossly over played that it's mind boggling

Turkey · December 12, 2014, 03:45:13 PM

Quote from: DAS B00T DAS B00T on December 12, 2014, 03:24:01 PM

Quote from: KletzenbrotEssen on December 12, 2014, 03:19:56 PM
Quote from: DAS B00T DAS B00T on December 12, 2014, 03:17:25 PM
Quote from: KletzenbrotEssen on December 12, 2014, 03:15:35 PM
Quote from: Meta Cognition on December 12, 2014, 03:11:53 PM
I firmly believe in hierarchy, but that also confers responsibility.

Police officers who fuck up should absolutely be punished more heavily than citizens for crimes they commit, and sergeants more than constables.
Initially the police were doing everything fine, it was until he said he couldn't breath that things went overboard
You mean until the officer performed a restraining move banned by the NYPD.
Now that's a BIG misconception. New York bans chokeholds, what the officer was trying to do was perform a seat belt takedown where the arm goes around the chest like a seat-belt would. A chokehold is where the crevice/bending part of your arm goes directly in the front/middle of your throat; the video doesn't show a chokehold
The officer should have realized that he's far too small to perform such a maneuver on a tall, morbidly obese man.

That move is great on big guys because it knocks them out in seconds. Trying to overpower him would have been exactly the wrong move. Either way, he died from laying on his chest and have his airway restricted due to pressure on his head, not from the restraint (not a chokehold).