Do you think death represents the total end of your experience?

Tsirist · October 12, 2015, 07:03:20 PM

Simple question. Do you expect death to be the complete end of your perceptual experiences? If you don't think it is, feel free to elaborate as to why! Reincarnation, after-life, all is fair game!

Note that I do not mean the end of who you are now. Clearly, you, in the sense of the human brain/body you experience, will be dead. But will you end up experiencing something else or will there be the classic "nothingness, forever, infinitely"?

Personally I always felt that since I'm here now and not having a sensory experience of any kind would literally be unnoticeable, then whatever led to me being here now could very well happen again given an infinite expanse of possibilities metaphysically. I figure that, given a world as arbitrarily ordered as this one is . . . I cannot think of a reason to assume it's one of many possibilities. I kinda assume that when I die my perceptual experience will reignite in some other condition.

But I'll admit that trying to apply human rationality to such a thing might be foolish. Nevertheless, my answer would be no.

challengerX · October 12, 2015, 07:06:13 PM

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DAS B00T x2 · October 12, 2015, 07:08:41 PM

I have no reason to believe in an afterlife.
I have no reason to believe that I'll return to this world as a different person.
I have no reason to believe in a soul.

Some people say that such thinking makes life meaningless. I disagree. This is the only existence I get. That makes it all the more precious.

eggsalad · October 12, 2015, 07:26:56 PM

I choose to believe so because if death is not a true end then I am doomed regardless. I will have an infinite amount of time to suffer and an infinite amount of time to cope. The afterlife does not make this life more valuable, because infinite existence will only continually diminish how much of this life was part of my total life.

Azumarill · October 12, 2015, 07:27:01 PM

http://www.southampton.ac.uk/news/2014/10/07-worlds-largest-near-death-experiences-study.page

meh. i wont pretend to know one way or the other.

Super Irish · October 12, 2015, 07:34:25 PM

I will experience true nothingness.

Well, actually, I won't. That's the thing about nothing. Without sense or anything alive to actually comprehend what feeling nothing is like, I won't feel it.

I will feel the heart attack or whatever it is that kills me though, and I know that's going to suck.

Cindy · October 12, 2015, 08:08:16 PM

I'd hope so

More Than Mortal · October 12, 2015, 08:14:57 PM

Quote from: Tsirist on October 12, 2015, 07:03:20 PM

Personally I always felt that since I'm here now and not having a sensory experience of any kind would literally be unnoticeable, then whatever led to me being here now could very well happen again given an infinite expanse of possibilities metaphysically.

That which explains everything explains nothing.

Basing beliefs on vagueness like that is dogmatic, at best.

Thun · October 12, 2015, 08:18:08 PM

I hope not, I want to be a ghost and terrorize the fuck out of people.

But it more than likely is.

Tsirist · October 12, 2015, 08:20:57 PM

Quote from: Meta as Fuck on October 12, 2015, 08:14:57 PM

Quote from: Tsirist on October 12, 2015, 07:03:20 PM
Personally I always felt that since I'm here now and not having a sensory experience of any kind would literally be unnoticeable, then whatever led to me being here now could very well happen again given an infinite expanse of possibilities metaphysically.
That which explains everything explains nothing.

Basing beliefs on vagueness like that is dogmatic, at best.

I wouldn't say it explains everything, exactly. Rather, it would explain the one thing that matters. The puzzling fact that I'm here at all is what I try to derive that conclusion from.

Dan · October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM

No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.

ΚΑΤΑΝΑΛΩΤΗΣ · October 12, 2015, 08:32:04 PM

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Winy · October 12, 2015, 09:52:38 PM

Quote from: DAS r00d d00d B00T on October 12, 2015, 07:08:41 PM

I have no reason to believe in an afterlife.
I have no reason to believe that I'll return to this world as a different person.
I have no reason to believe in a soul.

Some people say that such thinking makes life meaningless. I disagree. This is the only existence I get. That makes it all the more precious.

Exactly as I'd put it.

Winy · October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM

Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM

No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.

What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.

Verbatim · October 12, 2015, 09:54:38 PM

Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM

Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM
No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.
What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.

Too much pot.

Yes, when you die, you're gone.

Luciana · October 12, 2015, 10:06:50 PM

Maybe, idk (I hate not giving a definitive answer)

So I'll provide you with something else that's sort of related

I believe if there is a god, devil, heaven, or hell, that it wouldn't be as simple as what we read on paper written by men. I feel as if we have all the answers, it makes life uneventful and wonderful. I believe if there was such things, it would be beyond what we could comprehend and something far more spectacular than something so final like religions would have you believe.

We live in a universe which size we cannot fathom, we are mere specs in the universe, and there are such deadly elements all around us. But it's also something that makes us unique. To be provided such precise tools to let life bloom, and beating the odds to be born into the world, is a miracle in itself if you ask me.

Or something stupid like that.

Tsirist · October 12, 2015, 10:07:32 PM

Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM

Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM
No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.
What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.

Can you designate the key part of you that "causes" you to experience things at all? Humans are just machines, the curious part is that we somehow inhabit and see out of one of these machines (or at least, I do, as far as I know). There's some sort of interface between that thing, that experience of being, and this human body "of mine". This body could live and even speak these things without me experiencing it, surely, so what am I and why am I here?

Winy · October 12, 2015, 10:13:23 PM

Quote from: Tsirist on October 12, 2015, 10:07:32 PM

Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM
Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM
No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.
What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.
Can you designate the key part of you that "causes" you to experience things at all? Humans are just machines, the curious part is that we somehow inhabit and see out of one of these machines (or at least, I do, as far as I know). There's some sort of interface between that thing, that experience of being, and this human body "of mine". This body could live and even speak these things without me experiencing it, surely, so what am I and why am I here?

I don't think this is true. I don't think a "Soul" is needed for a mechanical system like my body and brain to have a conscious outlook on my surroundings. I really do view it as just a problem of complexity; and I don't see any compelling reasons to think otherwise.

Tsirist · October 12, 2015, 10:14:35 PM

Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 10:13:23 PM

Quote from: Tsirist on October 12, 2015, 10:07:32 PM
Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM
Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM
No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.
What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.
Can you designate the key part of you that "causes" you to experience things at all? Humans are just machines, the curious part is that we somehow inhabit and see out of one of these machines (or at least, I do, as far as I know). There's some sort of interface between that thing, that experience of being, and this human body "of mine". This body could live and even speak these things without me experiencing it, surely, so what am I and why am I here?
I don't think this is true. I don't think a "Soul" is needed for a mechanical system like my body and brain to have a conscious outlook on my surroundings. I really do view it as just a problem of complexity; and I don't see any compelling reasons to think otherwise.

Nor do I! However, given a system in which I can evidently manifest like this, I see no reason the conditions (complex or simple as they may be) might not arise again.

CIS · October 12, 2015, 10:16:36 PM

There is no reason to believe in an afterlife so I don't see why I would try to argue that it isn't.

Dan · October 12, 2015, 10:19:04 PM

Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM

Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM
No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.
What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.

I said it to piss off the Empiricists.
Empiricism it seems, has the most dogmatic, bigoted and closed-minded group of followers I've ever seen.
Anything bordering mystical, esoteric, or metaphysical is shut down and discarded as "pseudoscience" or "woo woo" and is considered not even worthy of study.

The problem with empiricism is that it shuns every form of enquiry that doesn't follow the guidelines of scientific Materialism (the view that the universe is just the interactions of observable matter)

Don't get me wrong, Emperical science is useful in explaining the interactions of the physical world, but that's its limit.

Tsirist · October 12, 2015, 10:30:06 PM

Dan my man. I don't know who you are but I'm feelin' you right now.

Korra · October 12, 2015, 10:31:42 PM

I surely hope not.

eggsalad · October 12, 2015, 10:33:07 PM

Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 10:19:04 PM

Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM
Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM
No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.
What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.
I said it to piss off the Empiricists.
Empiricism it seems, has the most dogmatic, bigoted and closed-minded group of followers I've ever seen.
Anything bordering mystical, esoteric, or metaphysical is shut down and discarded as "pseudoscience" or "woo woo" and is considered not even worthy of study.

The problem with empiricism is that it shuns every form of enquiry that doesn't follow the guidelines of scientific Materialism (the view that the universe is just the interactions of observable matter) and conventional science.

Don't get me wrong, Emperical science is useful in explaining the interactions of the physical world, but that's it limit.

Discussion without empiricism is redundant and pointless.
A metaphysical discussion is one that transcends the authority of logic itself.

Tsirist · October 12, 2015, 10:34:26 PM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 12, 2015, 10:33:07 PM

Discussion without empiricism is redundant and pointless.
A metaphysical discussion is one that transcends the authority of logic itself.

This may be true, but as we've discussed many times, the phenomenon of existence goes beyond empirical matters, no?

Dan · October 12, 2015, 10:34:36 PM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 12, 2015, 10:33:07 PM

Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 10:19:04 PM
Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM
Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM
No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.
What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.
I said it to piss off the Empiricists.
Empiricism it seems, has the most dogmatic, bigoted and closed-minded group of followers I've ever seen.
Anything bordering mystical, esoteric, or metaphysical is shut down and discarded as "pseudoscience" or "woo woo" and is considered not even worthy of study.

The problem with empiricism is that it shuns every form of enquiry that doesn't follow the guidelines of scientific Materialism (the view that the universe is just the interactions of observable matter) and conventional science.

Don't get me wrong, Emperical science is useful in explaining the interactions of the physical world, but that's it limit.
Discussion without empiricism is redundant and pointless.
A metaphysical discussion is one that transcends the authority of logic itself.

Case in point.

eggsalad · October 12, 2015, 10:35:38 PM

Quote from: Tsirist on October 12, 2015, 10:34:26 PM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 12, 2015, 10:33:07 PM
Discussion without empiricism is redundant and pointless.
A metaphysical discussion is one that transcends the authority of logic itself.
This may be true, but as we've discussed many times, the phenomenon of existence goes beyond empirical matters, no?

I suppose so, but it's really impossible to talk about outside recognizing how strange it is.

Winy · October 12, 2015, 10:35:43 PM

I took an half-year online philosophy course during my Junior year of high school, and I use to know what "Empiricism" and "Metaphysics" meant to the core.

Now I don't know shit lol

eggsalad · October 12, 2015, 10:37:50 PM

Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 10:34:36 PM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 12, 2015, 10:33:07 PM
Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 10:19:04 PM
Quote from: Winy on October 12, 2015, 09:53:21 PM
Quote from: Dan on October 12, 2015, 08:27:30 PM
No.
We're not our bodies, we are souls temporarily inhabiting a body. The soul is eternal.
What makes you think this is true? Genuinely curious.
I said it to piss off the Empiricists.
Empiricism it seems, has the most dogmatic, bigoted and closed-minded group of followers I've ever seen.
Anything bordering mystical, esoteric, or metaphysical is shut down and discarded as "pseudoscience" or "woo woo" and is considered not even worthy of study.

The problem with empiricism is that it shuns every form of enquiry that doesn't follow the guidelines of scientific Materialism (the view that the universe is just the interactions of observable matter) and conventional science.

Don't get me wrong, Emperical science is useful in explaining the interactions of the physical world, but that's it limit.
Discussion without empiricism is redundant and pointless.
A metaphysical discussion is one that transcends the authority of logic itself.
Case in point.

I want an actual answer here.
What is the value of a conversation where all positions and assertions are fundamentally equal?
A discussion where Einsteinian gravity is of equal merit as me smashing my keyboard devalues the idea of communication.

Tsirist · October 12, 2015, 10:39:43 PM

Quote from: eggsalad on October 12, 2015, 10:37:50 PM

I want an actual answer here.
What is the value of a conversation where all positions and assertions are fundamentally equal?
A discussion where Einsteinian gravity is of equal merit as me smashing my keyboard devalues the idea of communication.

For me the value lies in seeing why people are committed to their beliefs about one form of afterlife, or the lack of any continued perceived existence whatsoever. I honestly do not hold the view that death is the end, and that's part of why I'm excited for it. Knowing that others do not feel the same way is somewhat saddening, in some ways, and conversation is a way to become closer over the matter.

Poll

Do you think death represents the total end of your experience?

Do you think death represents the total end of your experience?