My problem with ADS is that, in nearly every case of its addition, it includes an idiotic spread penalty on hip firing. Bloom was a concept where the cons outweighed the pros, this just sort of seems like an addition or evolution of that bad mechanic in this franchise.
Quote from: Mr. Admirals on January 09, 2015, 11:29:50 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:11:08 PMMy problem with ADS is that, in nearly every case of its addition, it includes an idiotic spread penalty on hip firing. Bloom was a concept where the cons outweighed the pros, this just sort of seems like an addition or evolution of that bad mechanic in this franchise.There is literally no such difference. Or it's at least not noticeable enough to detect by just playing the game.It's why I've maintained that what you're seeing is just a fancy zoom animation.What I'm saying is that they've kept the bloom (bad idea) and added fancy zooms on top of it to make it seem like totally isn't the same thing. This is a problem of not changing, which is increasingly rare for Halo discussion.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:11:08 PMMy problem with ADS is that, in nearly every case of its addition, it includes an idiotic spread penalty on hip firing. Bloom was a concept where the cons outweighed the pros, this just sort of seems like an addition or evolution of that bad mechanic in this franchise.There is literally no such difference. Or it's at least not noticeable enough to detect by just playing the game.It's why I've maintained that what you're seeing is just a fancy zoom animation.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:11:08 PMMy problem with ADS is that, in nearly every case of its addition, it includes an idiotic spread penalty on hip firing. Bloom was a concept where the cons outweighed the pros, this just sort of seems like an addition or evolution of that bad mechanic in this franchise.ADS [at least on the BR, the accuracy increases on other precision weapons are minimal to the point where it's virtually the same as red reticule] is basically a method of fixing Halo 3's BR and merging it with Halo 2's. Spread was an unbelievably ridiculous mechanic in practice, but in theory it did neuter fulfill its job of neutering the weapon to "fix" its place in the sandbox. What ADS does is ensure that, while the BR is no longer inconsistent at ranges, it's just not the best weapon for the job. In Halo 5, the weapon has spread in its base form, but it's really inconsequential at mid ranges [spread in itself seems tighter than Halo 3's, plus the staple that is bullet magnetism]. So with your intact FOV, you can't just casually cross map, but the weapon remains consistent. However, the spread is eliminated with the BR scope, so at range we can trade situational awareness for accuracy.Small little change, but it fixes the "problem" that Bungie had with the BR. Of course, I disagree with the entire notion that the BR shouldn't be that accurate, but that's not the debate here.[I, have used, fifty, thousand commas, in this post]
My problem is that you shouldn't suddenly be inaccurate because you zoomed out. All zooming should do is give you a magnified image around your reticule, not give you super accuracy. Some would try to rationalize it as being "realistic", to which I reply: you know Spartans have an interface with weapons, right? They don't actually put the gun up to their eye because they a not-so ignorable amount of hard-plastic and glass all over their faces. The Mjolnir armor just interfaces with the weapon and shows a "pop-up" of the scope on their visor. That's why weapons without scopes, such as ARs, just had a binocular zoom.Half of that is more lore butthurt than gameplay issue, but I care about both. For them to trade that out for manually aiming down the sight is almost as stupid as the ME universe going from a practically infinitely firing rifle and back to clips in two years.
Half of that is more lore butthurt than gameplay issue, but I care about both.
For them to trade that out for manually aiming down the sight is almost as stupid as the ME universe going from a practically infinitely firing rifle and back to clips in two years.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:33:15 PMQuote from: Mr. Admirals on January 09, 2015, 11:29:50 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:11:08 PMMy problem with ADS is that, in nearly every case of its addition, it includes an idiotic spread penalty on hip firing. Bloom was a concept where the cons outweighed the pros, this just sort of seems like an addition or evolution of that bad mechanic in this franchise.There is literally no such difference. Or it's at least not noticeable enough to detect by just playing the game.It's why I've maintained that what you're seeing is just a fancy zoom animation.What I'm saying is that they've kept the bloom (bad idea) and added fancy zooms on top of it to make it seem like totally isn't the same thing. This is a problem of not changing, which is increasingly rare for Halo discussion.I'm not following on how this is a problem. And the bloom is only on the automatic weapons, which has been in since CE.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:46:24 PMMy problem is that you shouldn't suddenly be inaccurate because you zoomed out. All zooming should do is give you a magnified image around your reticule, not give you super accuracy. Some would try to rationalize it as being "realistic", to which I reply: you know Spartans have an interface with weapons, right? They don't actually put the gun up to their eye because they a not-so ignorable amount of hard-plastic and glass all over their faces. The Mjolnir armor just interfaces with the weapon and shows a "pop-up" of the scope on their visor. That's why weapons without scopes, such as ARs, just had a binocular zoom.Half of that is more lore butthurt than gameplay issue, but I care about both. For them to trade that out for manually aiming down the sight is almost as stupid as the ME universe going from a practically infinitely firing rifle and back to clips in two years.If you noticed however, the Assault Rifle does not "ADS". Although, I wouldn't think they'd need to put it right up to their eye. Having used a scope IRL, your face is generally pretty far away from it.Regardless, the Smart Scope in Halo 5 still fits in the lore. Shouldering your weapon and aiming down the barrel will in general give you better control over your weapon.
Quote from: Mr. Admirals on January 09, 2015, 11:42:50 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:33:15 PMQuote from: Mr. Admirals on January 09, 2015, 11:29:50 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:11:08 PMMy problem with ADS is that, in nearly every case of its addition, it includes an idiotic spread penalty on hip firing. Bloom was a concept where the cons outweighed the pros, this just sort of seems like an addition or evolution of that bad mechanic in this franchise.There is literally no such difference. Or it's at least not noticeable enough to detect by just playing the game.It's why I've maintained that what you're seeing is just a fancy zoom animation.What I'm saying is that they've kept the bloom (bad idea) and added fancy zooms on top of it to make it seem like totally isn't the same thing. This is a problem of not changing, which is increasingly rare for Halo discussion.I'm not following on how this is a problem. And the bloom is only on the automatic weapons, which has been in since CE.Oh, I know about bloom's history. I argued with people on the Reach forums for hours over who, what, and when Halo was killed. Bloom applies to all weapons, it just "appears" on automatic and semi-automatic weapons because you can actually fire again before it resets. I technicality, but an important one none the less. It's important because of this: how many weapons in Halo 4 and Halo 5 are automatic or semi-automatic in comparison to those that have a much slower firing rate? Off the top of my head, I can think of only a handful of power weapons that wouldn't feel bloom to some effect.I can't even argue this well because I see so many conflicting views over ADS making firing more accurate, and to what degree it does so. It could be a matter of weapons having reticules that are too large and firing being too inaccurate because of it, or ADS does actually improve bullet-spread and it's just the same stupid idea I see everywhere I turn in the genre.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:46:24 PMHalf of that is more lore butthurt than gameplay issue, but I care about both. Well, we have seen people using ADS in lore before. QuoteFor them to trade that out for manually aiming down the sight is almost as stupid as the ME universe going from a practically infinitely firing rifle and back to clips in two years."But the Geth thought it was a good idea!"You have to admit, the mental gymnastics the writers had to pull to accommodate that change in the lore that were pretty impressive.
Quote from: GodspeedSnowjira! on January 09, 2015, 11:52:40 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:46:24 PMHalf of that is more lore butthurt than gameplay issue, but I care about both. Well, we have seen people using ADS in lore before. QuoteFor them to trade that out for manually aiming down the sight is almost as stupid as the ME universe going from a practically infinitely firing rifle and back to clips in two years."But the Geth thought it was a good idea!"You have to admit, the mental gymnastics the writers had to pull to accommodate that change in the lore that were pretty impressive.That's not even aiming down his sights, though. It's clearly not in front of his visor, it's still to the side.
Also, congratulations, this is indisputably the most civil Halo discussion I've seen on this forum since I arrived. Let's all pat each other on the back for that.
Quote from: Assassin 11D7 on January 10, 2015, 12:10:53 AMQuote from: GodspeedSnowjira! on January 09, 2015, 11:52:40 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:46:24 PMHalf of that is more lore butthurt than gameplay issue, but I care about both. Well, we have seen people using ADS in lore before. QuoteFor them to trade that out for manually aiming down the sight is almost as stupid as the ME universe going from a practically infinitely firing rifle and back to clips in two years."But the Geth thought it was a good idea!"You have to admit, the mental gymnastics the writers had to pull to accommodate that change in the lore that were pretty impressive.That's not even aiming down his sights, though. It's clearly not in front of his visor, it's still to the side.In that case Romeo is probably mental, holding the gun so close to his face like that and all.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 10, 2015, 12:15:22 AMAlso, congratulations, this is indisputably the most civil Halo discussion I've seen on this forum since I arrived. Let's all pat each other on the back for that.This is indisputably the most civil Halo multiplayer discussion I've seen in any forum in months.
Here's the thing, ADS in video games is impossible to do IRL, because IRL, you secure the gun on your shoulder and lean your head in.
Quote from: Mr. Admirals on January 10, 2015, 12:20:37 AMHere's the thing, ADS in video games is impossible to do IRL, because IRL, you secure the gun on your shoulder and lean your head in.Sadly, pseudo-realism is acceptable just as well as realism in shooters. I still am annoyed when magazines are called clips, but I don't bother sperging out like a /k/ommando because it just never amounts to anything.
Quote from: Assassin 11D7 on January 10, 2015, 12:10:53 AMQuote from: GodspeedSnowjira! on January 09, 2015, 11:52:40 PMQuote from: Prime Meridia on January 09, 2015, 11:46:24 PMHalf of that is more lore butthurt than gameplay issue, but I care about both. Well, we have seen people using ADS in lore before. QuoteFor them to trade that out for manually aiming down the sight is almost as stupid as the ME universe going from a practically infinitely firing rifle and back to clips in two years."But the Geth thought it was a good idea!"You have to admit, the mental gymnastics the writers had to pull to accommodate that change in the lore that were pretty impressive.That's not even aiming down his sights, though. It's clearly not in front of his visor, it's still to the side.To be fair, that's probably the closest you can get while using a full helmet and a compact weapon like the SMG while still having the stock resting against your shoulder.
Quote from: Prime Meridia on January 10, 2015, 12:22:35 AMQuote from: Mr. Admirals on January 10, 2015, 12:20:37 AMHere's the thing, ADS in video games is impossible to do IRL, because IRL, you secure the gun on your shoulder and lean your head in.Sadly, pseudo-realism is acceptable just as well as realism in shooters. I still am annoyed when magazines are called clips, but I don't bother sperging out like a /k/ommando because it just never amounts to anything.That reminds me
343i more or less has past bungie employees?
343i really need their own forums, Waypoint doesn't count
Quote from: Sprungli on January 09, 2015, 04:59:02 PMQuote from: goootsby on January 09, 2015, 04:50:39 PMQuote from: Sprungli on January 09, 2015, 04:45:38 PM.It plays like a Halo game, no argumentsBut it doesn't.Have you actually spent time playing the beta?No but you would have to be an idiot to think it plays entirely like a Halo game. I'm not saying it sucks, it's just doesn't play like a Halo game. I'm not of those people that's against change but I value keeping a game to it's core mechanics whilst improving in other areas which don't take away from the original experience.
Quote from: goootsby on January 09, 2015, 04:50:39 PMQuote from: Sprungli on January 09, 2015, 04:45:38 PM.It plays like a Halo game, no argumentsBut it doesn't.Have you actually spent time playing the beta?
Quote from: Sprungli on January 09, 2015, 04:45:38 PM.It plays like a Halo game, no argumentsBut it doesn't.
.It plays like a Halo game, no arguments
Quote from: goootsby on January 09, 2015, 05:51:25 PMQuote from: Sprungli on January 09, 2015, 04:59:02 PMQuote from: goootsby on January 09, 2015, 04:50:39 PMQuote from: Sprungli on January 09, 2015, 04:45:38 PM.It plays like a Halo game, no argumentsBut it doesn't.Have you actually spent time playing the beta?No but you would have to be an idiot to think it plays entirely like a Halo game. I'm not saying it sucks, it's just doesn't play like a Halo game. I'm not of those people that's against change but I value keeping a game to it's core mechanics whilst improving in other areas which don't take away from the original experience.How can you possibly comment on how it plays when you haven't played it?
Post on why Halo 5 multiplayer is bad
