Dark Souls is easily one of the best games of all time.

 
Luciana
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Community can be bad, but honestly I've met some more people with a sense of humor/honor in Dark Souls, than I have for a lot of games.

It's almost a social experiment really. In Dark Souls 2 in duel arenas (there are arenas to fight in), players came up with the mechanic that, before a fight, you drink allll of your Estus Flask (the thing that restores your health), because it's frowned upon by honor rules to run away and heal and come back to fight. Of course they bow before duels too.

That goes to say though, that when invading other peoples world/vise versa, it's no hold bars since there is more at steak (unless you're right by a bonfire you just spawned at).

Yeah, spamming Estus is highly frowned upon in Dark Souls. It's strange that unspoken rules were formed in what pretty much equates to an open season.
It's neat to see what the community unites under when things like that are presented to you. Of course later on, From updated it so you can't use Estus in duels. Wish the same could be said for weapon buffs. It broke so much.


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Oh yeah, I forgot about gestures. If an invader bows, it means they are friendly and if they kill you, no hard feelings.

People who do "Well, what is it?", shrug and point at the ground are generally cunts.


 
Verbatim
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however

i don't see anything wrong with using the game's conventions to win

so i mean, i disagree with that "rule"--that seems silly

if you can heal during a fight, that's just strategy
Last Edit: December 07, 2015, 04:02:29 PM by Verbatim


 
Luciana
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street fighter has similar stuff

it's generally considered rude to win a game and then switch your character, for example
because you won--what the fuck do you need to change your character for

also, taunting is considered very disrespectful--more than you'd expect, and it's very frowned upon in tournaments
like, it's okay if you're with friends and you're just taunting, but like... in a tournament, it's disrespectful as fuck

so i get that

it's weird, but i get that
Taunting after you kill in Dark Souls (usually the finger wag in Dark Souls 2) is also frowned upon. It's amazing what a simple gesture from someone you've never met, or heard speak, can suddenly change how you see them as a person. Of course, I DO taunt when they try to run and heal and I kill them, simply because they tried to "cheat" in my eyes.

Though when I'm invading their world, I will do anything to really just upset them. Even if it's something as simple as letting them chase me and they can't catch me. It's fun to just go against the grain in the game sometimes and mess with people, because they do the same to you.

Or my favorite, when someone invades you, you camouflage into an object someplace and you just hear them looking for you. Then you send them a message just to taunt them. They have a 10 min time limit (though they can exit any time) so there is a sense of urgency.


 
Luciana
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however

i don't see anything wrong with using the game's conventions to win

so i mean, i disagree with that "rule"--that seems silly

if you can heal during a fight, that's just strategy
It is. It's just when you go in a duel you're expected to uphold some sense of a code since it's a test of skills. When it comes to invading others worlds, you shouldn't be mad at whatever happens since they're fighting for more on the line.


 
Luciana
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Oh yeah, I forgot about gestures. If an invader bows, it means they are friendly and if they kill you, no hard feelings.

People who do "Well, what is it?", shrug and point at the ground are generally cunts.
Unless it's a Giant Dad build. Then it's just memetastic.

YouTube


 
Verbatim
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Of course, I DO taunt when they try to run and heal and I kill them, simply because they tried to "cheat" in my eyes.
again, i don't really see that as cheating

it's a legitimate strategy

...get good?


 
challengerX
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I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
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Luciana
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Of course, I DO taunt when they try to run and heal and I kill them, simply because they tried to "cheat" in my eyes.
again, i don't really see that as cheating

it's a legitimate strategy

...get good?
You're already a Dark Souls fanboy


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I made a minmax build before in Dark Souls with my brother and we ganked invaders.

We wouldn't even gesture, and we'd just start attacking the invaders right away, usually waiting for them to gesture since that makes them vulnerable. I got a lot of angry voicemail and messages. Shit made me a fuckton of souls.


 
Verbatim
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Ripping invaders' throats out DOES sound pretty fun. Like, that's what you get when you use this evil mechanic, sort of thing.

Too bad it's just not guaranteed.
Last Edit: December 07, 2015, 04:11:16 PM by Verbatim


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Ripping invaders' throats out DOES sound pretty fun. Like, that's what you get when you use this evil mechanic, sort of thing.

Yeah, man. Shit was hilarious. We had this whole strategy set up in Anor Londo and nobody could beat us. Sometimes when someone invaded and saw the two of us coming at them they'd run away.


 
Luciana
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Ripping invaders' throats out DOES sound pretty fun. Like, that's what you get when you use this evil mechanic, sort of thing.

Too bad it's just not guaranteed.
There is an entire faction in Dark Souls 2 that calls for the help of others when invaded. Almost like a guardian.


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Stop. Comparing. Humans. With. NPCs.
They are functionally the same in invasions. A human invading you is no less a healthy experience than an NPC invading you, I want you to posit a situation otherwise that I haven't already admitted exist (bad connection, modding, balance issues). NPCs are designed to emulate human behavior, the closer they get to it, the better. How then are humans not functionally the same?

This isn't a matter of consent. You consent to a game of football when you play the game. These are the rules of the game. If you think the game is particularly unfun, I want you to tell me why, not just that these things happening is bad.

For an anecdote, I thought Kirk was a player invading me when I first encountered him in Lost Izalith. That's what NPCs are supposed to do. The more intelligent and challenging your opponent is while you two share a fair playing field, the more meaningful and fun the challenge is.
Last Edit: December 07, 2015, 04:46:13 PM by eggsalad


 
Verbatim
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They are functionally the same in invasions. A human invading you is no less a healthy experience than an NPC invading you, I want you to posit a situation otherwise that I haven't already admitted exist (bad connection, modding, balance issues).
A human being can have the heart NOT to use the invade feature. Like me.
An NPC can't.

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NPCs are designed to emulate human behavior, the closer they get to it, the better. How then are humans not functionally the same?
They'll never have agency.

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This isn't a matter of consent.
It is.

The rest of your post is irrelevant nonsense.


 
Verbatim
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Come back when you can tell the difference between a human being and a computer.


 
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I DONT GIVE A SINGLE -blam!- MOTHER -blam!-ER ITS A MOTHER -blam!-ING FORUM, OH WOW, YOU HAVE THE WORD NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, HOW MOTHER -blam!-ING COOL, NOT, YOUR ARE NOTHING TO ME BUT A BRAINWASHED PIECE OF SHIT BLOGGER, PEOPLE ONLY LIKE YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE NINJA BELOW YOUR NAME, SO PLEASE PUNCH YOURAELF IN THE FACE AND STAB YOUR EYE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF SHIT OF SOCIETY
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No such thing as cheap tactics--get good. Strategy is strategy.


 
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Hell, I even got invaded once and messaged the guy saying "don't kill me stuck at hard part trying to co op" and he said "no prob good luck :)" and left.
A few good people doesn't mean jack shit to me.

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Pretty much how it does work.
I don't want "pretty much".

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You'll very rarely come across people who enjoy killing low level players (or any level player) when they don't want to duel. And I mean VERY rarely. Like 2 people out of 300 hours I put into that game.
I don't care how rare it is. I will only accept 0.


 
Verbatim
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It'd be fair if I could heal, but I can't use Estus as an Invader.
Then don't invade people. Don't take part in cunt activity.

It's a legitimate strategy; get good.

Ripping invaders' throats out DOES sound pretty fun. Like, that's what you get when you use this evil mechanic, sort of thing.

Too bad it's just not guaranteed.
The fun part is that it's NOT guaranteed.
That's not fun, though.


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No such thing as cheap tactics--get good. Strategy is strategy.

Strategy doesn't  break stunlocks.


 
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So what you're saying is you dislike Dark Souls because it's a game where there can be a winner and a loser. You want to be able to employ the help of others against the game, but find it unfair when the game employs the help of others to fight back.

tbh I take what a game tries to be in account when i try to measure it, i don't apply values to a design that was made wit different values in mind


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rescind
Last Edit: December 07, 2015, 06:46:08 PM by eggsalad


 
Verbatim
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So what you're saying is you dislike Dark Souls because it's a game where there can be a winner and a loser.
You probably couldn't have interpreted position any shittier, to be honest.

I don't dislike Dark Souls--I dislike a particular feature that Dark Souls has.

What I hate is the community.


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Why do you guys even bother arguing with Verb?


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Why do you guys even bother arguing with Verb?
Because it's fun as fug getting him riled up.